Meet the Other Phone. Child-safe in minutes.

Meet the Other Phone.
Child-safe in minutes.

Buy now

Please or to access all these features

Site stuff

Join our Innovation Panel to try new features early and help make Mumsnet better.

See all MNHQ comments on this thread

OFFICIAL MNHQ THREAD on posts about suicide, troll-hunting and related matters

833 replies

RowanMumsnet · 23/10/2014 10:10

Hello

There have been so many threads about this over the past few days, and so many divergent points of view - and so much upset - that we'd really like to have the discussion in one place rather than in many different threads all over the boards.

For those who haven't heard yet: we are actively reviewing our policy about threads regarding suicidal feelings and suicidal intent. We are seeking expert input from outside organisations including the Samaritans. Once we have that we will come back and have a further discussion with MNers about the way forward.

We'll be here to talk on the thread throughout the day, but do please note that we WILL delete troll-hunting posts for all the obvious reasons. So PLEASE do not use this thread to make insinuations about identifiable posters - keep it general please.

Re: Wombat: we understand that some reporters had concerns, but at the same time this poster had been around for years with a very consistent posting history. We absolutely do not have any concrete reason to disbelieve her. However, her thread had been immensely upsetting and triggering for many users, and has prompted a site-wide discussion about how we handle these threads. Once her husband had posted that she was at home with him and under the care of RL professionals it really seemed best all round to delete the thread.

We contacted Wombat at the time to explain our deletion and we still feel that for many very good reasons this is best sorted out off-board between us and her; we've asked her again to reply to our email and we will happily take it from there.

We also think that this whole case is a very good illustration of why we have no-trollhunting rules. We understand that some of you find them frustrating, but for every correct troll-call, there's an incorrect one. Being called a troll in public when you're giving an honest account of deeply upsetting real-life circumstances can be devastating for people.

Equally, we do 'get' that there are a lot posters and threads at the moment that seem deeply suspicious. We are on the front foot with this and have been being pretty pro-active at closing things down when they are reported to us and when we can see that things aren't adding up, particularly if they are new users.

So we need you to keep reporting and NOT break troll-hunting rules on the boards unless MNHQ itself has said publicly that we are confident that someone was a deliberate trouble-maker.

The namechange/sock-puppeting thing is extremely easy for us to spot when it's reported. It's not a judgement call - it's black and white and it's the work of a moment for us to spot it and deal with it.

OP posts:
usualsuspect333 · 31/10/2014 16:10

It's ok for namechangers to say 'marking place' etc. Just not regulars who don't namechange.

What a stupid thing to think.

2shoeprintsintheblood · 31/10/2014 17:14

"P.s.
I hate the regulars who keep there same name for years for notoriety, posting the "if this is true" , ".posting for deletion messages" etc."

wow
shows that mn hq are not reading this thread...

RebeccaMumsnet · 31/10/2014 17:36

Afternoon all,

So we've spoken to Mind and the Samaritans about this and they both suggest that we continue to allow threads in which users talk about feeling very low and having suicidal thoughts but remove threads that are clear statements of intent ('I am going to kill myself'), suicide notes, 'live' suicide threads. ('I have taken an overdose and am waiting for it to take effect'), or anything that involves a description of methods.

Looking at the this thread, this chimes with what the majority of Mumsnetters want us to do also, so henceforth that's what we'll do.

In cases in which we remove threads, we will post to explain to the OP that we are going to delete it, and signpost the Samaritans; PM the OP (supportively, obviously) to signpost the Samaritans; and explain our actions in the deletion message.

In cases where we leave the thread up (the feeling low threads) we will post links to our mental health webguide and to the Samaritans' online and telephone support.

We know there are some who feel extremely strongly that threads that express suicidal intent should be allowed to stand, and we do understand your reasons, but the consensus was so strong on this one - from both MNers and from experts in the field - that it really did feel there was only one way forward.

ScaryZ · 31/10/2014 17:40

That sounds great Rebecca, I hope The NightWatch are asked to lock and hide as well, because the middle of the night is probably prime time for this type of thread, sadly.

Could you post that at the top of the mh board, so that people know it's a fixed action to delete every thread, so posters don't feel that they are being picked on?

Because they can always repost a "I'm feeling very low" thread and they will get support.

IamtheWalkingDead · 31/10/2014 17:40

Thanks, Rebecca.

IamtheWalkingDead · 31/10/2014 17:45

^P.s.
I hate the regulars who keep there same name for years for notoriety, posting the "if this is true" , ".posting for deletion messages" etc.^

Zombie has been Zombie for 3 years. She uses MN to give and receive support and to have fun. What's notorius about that? Why on earth should she name change?

ballsballsballs · 31/10/2014 19:01

Sounds good MNHQ.

PacificWerewolf · 31/10/2014 19:09

Sounds reasonable, Rebecca, thanks.

I only NC for the seasons… sometimes
Cannot be arsed otherwise.

ArkhamOffett · 31/10/2014 19:14

I'm glad MNHQ have taken advice from those with expertise in the area of imminent suicide threats.

Good call.

BiWitched · 31/10/2014 20:34

So, PhotoFrames you love MN being somewhere you can get support, yet you are happy to slag off lots of us because we're "regulars who keep there same name for years for notoriety, posting the "if this is true" , ".posting for deletion messages" etc"

How lovely.

Allisgood1 · 31/10/2014 21:11

Clearly I've had a life been busy this week because I've missed all the threads discussed!!

MooseyMouse · 31/10/2014 22:56

Good policy and good process to arrive at it.

You do need some better out of hours cover though even if it's a member of staff on call to volunteers. You need someone with access to the full database who can make decisions through the night or who signs in every three hours to check for any problems escalated by the vols.

Thanks.

usualsuspect333 · 31/10/2014 23:31

Good decision re suicide note threads.

If you could just address the 'royalty', regular bashing I would be almost happy.

ExtraWickedDevil · 31/10/2014 23:34

Is that policy as of now ? Only there is a thread in active convos currently that I am choosing not to open, but which appears to refer to suicidal intent, albeit from yesterday in the title?

It might actually just be a thread looking for support, but as I've said I would prefer not to open it, and wondered if it was relevant

TerribleMother · 31/10/2014 23:48

Trying to keep up with this thread. Also think that the decision by mnhq re actual suicide threads is the right one. Agree with pp (maryZ?) about a message at the top of mh board stating deletion policy to stop people feeling targeted.

Photoframes, can understand where you are coming from to an extent re name changes, being identifiable and changing small details etc, however, number of posts beside your name would give no clue to anyone who you are.

Excuse me for speaking on your behalf also, Photoframes, and correct me if I'm wrong, but I felt that you phrased your last sentence wrongly, not to mean that you actually hate posters with long standing names, but that you hate when they post things like 'awaiting deletion message' or likewise, which is understandable that you find this annoying/upsetting, however it is equally so when posted by MrsBrandNew2014. The only thing I do sometimes feel, is that long term posters might sometimes do this more often, feeling comfortable in the knowledge that they won't be banned for doing so, having 'got away with it' previously. (Please don't flame me, I'm not up for it right now, just being honest Flowers).

2shoeprintsintheblood · 31/10/2014 23:52

can I ask
will mn hq stick to this?
only last week TAAT were not allowed
yet today they are.
mn hq seem to be like the weather

usualsuspect333 · 31/10/2014 23:55

Terriblemother, long term posters who don't hide behind Nchanges are more likely to be reported imo.

TerribleMother · 01/11/2014 00:07

Yeah, I totally get that usual. I do think there is a bit of resentment towards non-nc-ers, but I think that that's because they are seen to be 'getting away with it', even though they are reported. Someone way upthread (sorry, I'm on my phone so it's hard to scroll back) blatantly said that they would continue to call troll as they saw fit if it was blatantly obvious, and from what I could see weren't called on it. It is this type if thing, I think, that causes resentment towards long-termers.

I recently called a long term poster onthread for a similar thing. It almost became bun fighty, but we took it offthread and made friends Smile. I could see why they did what they did, totally understood their reasoning in fact, but it was still blatant rule breaking, which they were comfortable doing in the knowledge that no action would be taken against them for it. Can you understand why that might cause upset? (Again, so titsally not looking for an argument).

DoughnutSelfie · 01/11/2014 00:11

Thank you Rebecca, for the update wrt disaster threads

A marathon read, this thread, fair play

usualsuspect333 · 01/11/2014 00:20

No, what I see is, posters see a name around, decide they don't like that poster and can't wait to report any thing they perceive as 'rule breaking'

If I hid behind name changes, no one would decide they didn't like me iyswim.

I've had all sorts of abuse thrown at me. It's 'usual' she's a twat (which may be true) Grin

It's easier to NC and avoid that TBH.

IamtheZombie · 01/11/2014 00:26

Other than feeble attempts at holiday name changes, Zombie will never change her nickname. She is who and what she is. Full stop.

RockinHippy · 01/11/2014 00:28

There is no continuity in moderation though is there Hmm

The recent Butlins refund thread, where to poor OP was ripped to shreds because she worded things badly is a prime example. You yourself commented & asked that those attacking the OP to lay off. Some posters continued to flame the poor woman, who had already apologised, clarified things & clearly had an awful lot on her plate.

Those attacks continued in a very nasty manner, completely ignoring your own request, yet my reporting those posts that came after your request were not deemed to be breaking rules & my complaint, just like your request was ignored.

I also see that I have had a post deleted in AIBU, I do not make personal attacks & do not break your rules, nothing in my post, that reiterated a point made by many others & in the context of the whole tread was offensive, nor aggressive, far less so than some posts still standing on that same thread, but someone has obviously complained because I simply disagreed, far less gutturally so than others too, yet my post was deleted for what I see as no good reason at all ??

I come here for the most part because I enjoy doing my bit to help others, I've been doing so far many years, but this sort of lack of continuity, alongside the general slide in a lot of posters behaviour here, puts me right off - I don't need to come here, I do so because I want to, but I'm feeling that less & less & I can see myself not bothering.

Yes you all have a difficult job, I get that, but you all need to get your heads together & work by the same rules & if MNHQ requests calm on a thread, that needs to be followed through

DoughnutSelfie · 01/11/2014 00:33

Usual why have you got THREE side bollocks now?! I can't keep up, damn you, half term, for making me do blasted RL stuff avec offspring and distracting moi from keeping up

WhatsWrongWithShepton · 01/11/2014 00:44

mode-switching and personning up with extreme prejudice will be happening next week.

Is that sentence actually decoded anywhere on this interminable thread? My scroll can't cope.

BeyondPreparedForHell · 01/11/2014 08:12

I'm with zombie. Though i have spotted another beyond around recently Angry Grin