Can we have a proper 'woo' topic?

[IndigoBarbie]

Dear MNHQ, I fully believe in freedom of speech and experiences, and as such I go out of my way to assist those who are asking more angelic/psychic etc questions, since this is my real life in a nutshell. Getting sooooo fed up of threads becoming all about others who don't believe and blatantly attacking those of us on thread who want to actively discuss and share and I think a lovely new topic of 'woo' or something you feel is an appropriate title could be provided for us to have proper sharings and discussions.

But "shutting down" discussion is what is happening on the PRS forum. Posters are regularly insulted, called stupid/delusional etc. Their beliefs rubbished and ridiculed, to derail and close down the topic of conversation or take their own problems out on MN posters.

PRS is not MH or General Health. I expect adults know the difference.

Re. FGM, it is a cultural practice in certain locations that predates modern religions. It is rightly condemned, outlawed and campaigned against on the ground. It is not practiced or condoned by most Muslims. To say that spirituality leads to mutilation is the same as saying style and beauty leads to mutilation.

The fact that this is often brought up on PRS threads is an example of the attempts to derail conversation. It is rarely about the methods and organizations combatting this practice, it is more "I feel angry and upset that this is happening so I'm going to have a go at the Muslim posters on MN". It actually benefits no one.

Debate can be brilliant, but not when it comes in the form of my/no god is better than your god and comes with an extra order of insults. And of course no one should be hawking their wares on MN at all.

Scouse, I wouldn't say spirituality leads to FGM. That would be ridiculous. What I thought I did say is that 'sensitivity' to other people's beliefs causes those who should criticise to be silent. Silence permits wrongdoing in the name of 'beliefs'.

I was brought up and, later, trained to critically evaluate that which is presented by others as truth. Often, I'm inadequately informed to take a position so I do have to take a lot on faith: the discovery of the Higgs boson, for example, the existence of water on Mars, and that I have DNA. Were I living in mediaeval times, I'd be taking on a lot of balderdash as fact because the credible authorities were the church. Luckily for me, we have more reliable sources these days (lucky because I - as a childfree, single, information-seeking woman - would have been killed.)

Apart from more urgent issues raised by other "pissers & vomiters", it saddens me philosophically that so many women choose to ignore real science in favour of mythologies. I love a good mythology, me, but can generally tell the difference between an allegorical fantasy and a material truth.

So I take it Christmas , Easter , nativity plays are all cancelled in your homes then?

No. Because they are part of our cultural heritage. I also like singing hymns and looking at Raphael madonnas. And reading George Herbert.

I don't know if indigo actually was. I teach/coach a sport and regularly talk about it - does that mean I'm advertising it?

So you hate talk about angels but you don't mind your dc dressing as one and singing about a god that doesn't exist ?

Softly- she said she had found
Mumsnetters lost children- you can't possibly think that's OK can you?

Drum-banging alert ... Calling someone delusional or deluded is NOT AN INSULT. They're either honest concerns* about mental wellness, or equally honest concerns for the speaker's vulnerability.

Hallucinatory experiences feel more 'real' than reality (which is one of the markers - the other being "how likely is it, given what I know about everyday life?") I recall a few MN threads where I've been one of the posters gently encouraging an OP to call an ambulance while others, shockingly, empathised with her other-worldly experience. The posters did get medical help, thank goodness.

We see deluded posters all the time, particularly on Relationships. Self-delusion and delusion by others can be equally harmful.

• OK, not always meant kindly or honestly, but on SRP threads I believe they usually are. I desperately want to defend those words against being taken for insults!

I don't hate talk about angels. I don't like people believing in them because their duvet's shedding feathers.

Oh, and my children have dressed up an sung songs about all sorts of things that don't exist- Cinderella, for example.

I found the thread in General Health you mentioned Maryz, where Indigo recommended the eye bloke.

I googled - He has a website and charges a lot of money for his 'health' products, retreats, seminars, courses etc etc etc

He also does videos. Here he is on how to cure skin cancer.

Garlic - "I was brought up and, later, trained to critically evaluate that which is presented by others as truth. Often, I'm inadequately informed to take a position so I do have to take a lot on faith: the discovery of the Higgs boson, for example, the existence of water on Mars, and that I have DNA. Were I living in mediaeval times, I'd be taking on a lot of balderdash as fact because the credible authorities were the church. Luckily for me, we have more reliable sources these days" In 500 years time someone might be saying exactly the same about what we believe today about science as it is constantly evolving. I agree with you that we should all critically evaluate stuff but if some people's experience leads them to a different conclusion than yours it does not always mean they are wrong.

I have lost a friend to cancer who might have survived, or at least survived longer, had she not been convinced that she could fight it with homeopathy rather than conventional medicine. That does not mean all homeopathy should be and never spoken of, she was an adult and she made her own decisions, nobody forced her.

How is small children performing a play retelling a story from our cultural heritage in any way comparable with believing that stray feathers come from angels.

Has indigo ever indicated who that was? It's a huge statement if it's not true - words fail me. I really couldn't put in to words how awful it would be.

But no one can disprove that, can they?

I know spiritual guides are used in some high profile cases by police as a last resort. Some seem to work! others don't.

I don't believe in god,hell, heaven. I like listening to other peoples views on it. I certainly don't think a thread about 'I think there is a ghost in my toilet' walks hand in hand with FGM. That's a massive over reaction.

Ok having seen that video I retract my last post.

One poster doesn't stand for the others though.

Nobody forced her but somebody persuaded her. That must have been awful to watch.

I used to write advertising copy for a line of mineral-enriched products (can't say what, as my words are still on the packaging ) We used to make a game out of finding words that sound therapeutic, but aren't legally misleading health claims. Trouble is, so many really want to believe a cream/liquid/pill/ritual can make them better, they skip over "said to help" and interpret "invigorating" any way they want. I'd love critical thinking to be a compulsory school subject.

If you can bear it, have a look at some of his other videos.

Is that video not in breach of the Cancer Act and therefore illegal?

If indigo has ever linked to her site then, yes I agree, it's not cool.