flowery's pushchair dilemma part two - who would like to tell me about Phil and Ted's?

[flowerybeanbag]

For those who didn't see my earlier thread, I have one DS and another DC on the way due early November. DS will be 2.6 when DC2 arrives.

We have a Quinny Buzz that we used with DS, carrycot, rear facing then forward facing. He is currently in a Zapp.

I was initially hoping to re use the Buzz for DC2, with DS on a buggyboard, however I understand a buggyboard can't be used with the Buzz combined with the carrycot or rear-facing, meaning that's out as an option.

Various alternatives to the buggyboard were suggested to me, however someone also pointed out that it will be the middle of winter when I am pushing them both around so perhaps I might prefer to be able to have both in a pushchair with the option of blankets/raincovers etc

So. I am investigating doubles. Lots of people rave about the Phil and Ted's ones but I have some questions.

The cocoon looks tiny. What happens when DC2 grows out of it at I expect about 3mo? Does the little double seat thingy that goes behind the main seat recline? Or will I have to have DC2 sitting up as well as being forward-facing from an earlier age than recommended?

DS is reasonably biggish for his age. Is there plenty of room in the main seat for an average 3yo?

Don't they hate not being able to see out properly from the second seat?

What's the difference between all the models - they all look the same to me. If I get one, which is best?

TIA!

My Dd stayed in the cocoon till around 4 and 1/2 months. P and T recommend that babies go into the rear seat at 6 months, but I don't know anyone who lasted this long. It wasn't ideal but my Dd was ok in the back seat at that age.
The rear seat reclines (a small amount) on the Sport, and a bit more on the Vibe. My Dd has never had a problem sleeping at the rear.
My 3yo is pretty big/tall and is fine in the main seat (and he also sleeps in it) Again, I think the Vibe seats are improved compared to the Sport.
My dd doesn't seem to mind sitting in the back seat... maybe time will change that!
I've always said the same thing about the P and T - It isn't perfect, but it is by far the best of a bad bunch when it comes to double buggies.
I have certainly had my monies worth from it and would always recommend it.
HTH

I've got one for dd1 now 2.11 and dd2 16 months. The front seat is a little snug around the arms and upper body for dd1 but not too bad and she'll go in in quite happily and will sleep in it too. Dd2 will go in either. If dd1 wants to walk dd2 goes in the front and dd2 climbs in the back when she's tired. It works extremely well!

The cocoon is tiny but I used it instead of a moses basket til about 4 months and found being able to go out when dd2 was already asleep by just sliding the cocoon under the top seat invaluable as she was a light sleeper.

When she was too big for the cocoon I kept the doubles seat on the front and the bottom flat and put her on a blanket.

When in the 'normal' position witht he doubles seat underneath, both seats recline a bit using a zip. Not much though and if the front one is down the back one needs to be too or there's not much headroom iyswim.

I still wouldn't change it. Walked out of playgroup today with a lady and her dcs of a similar age in a side by side 3 wheeler. We had to open the double doors for her to get out, then she got wedged going down the slope, then she couldn't get down the aisle in the shop as it was too crowded. A right pita for her!

Really helpful thanks ladies.

yes you see that's the attraction melmog. I want to be able to swan about town without continually getting wedged places!

I think I am partly feeling guilty that DC2 won't be in a lovely carrycot then rear-facing then forward facing as DS was, but I am coming to the realisation that compromises are required somewhere along the line!

I've lost count of the times people (normally old ladies with mouths like cats bums) told me my little dd2 was crying because she couldn't see being "stuck down there". I managed to be civil as I knew that as soon as I was moving she'd be back asleep. Dd2 positivly loves the freedom of climbing in and out on her own to have a rest.

I've got the sport I forgot to mention.

We have a P&T with the exact same age gap, we used the cocoon until nearly 5 months, then DS was quite happy in the back with bigger DD in front (who is also broad of shoulder), we don't use the back as much now as she is 3.5 and walks alot more, but have been very happy with it.

1] buy the sleeping sac so dc2 is snug.

2] yes the second seat reclines some. dc1 will be above dc2 initailly and by the time dc2 wants to look about alot dc1 will be walking much more.

3] yes main seat will fit a 3yo but remember main seat should be occupied at all times so if dc1 is in main seat and wants to walk you will need to move dc2 into main seat.

4] not had prob with dc not liking second [under] seat.

we had main seat for dc2 and second for dc1 and worked well, if on all day trip then at nap time moved second seat to top and reclined it as well as main seat.

How much walking does dc1 do now?

DS1 does a bit of walking now, but not for too long. If we are popping quickly into our nearest not-very-big town just to a couple of shops, he'll walk. If we are going out for longer, he goes in his Zapp and is happy doing that, so he's not desperate to walk all the time or anything, and can't for too long before he gets tired.

It's difficult to know how that will change though isn't it?

The cocoon is nice. Lasts about 3 months tops, but is great for a newborn as one can slide them in and out without waking up.

Problem with buggy board is that it assumes your DS' cooperation. Stroppy toddler? No problem -- just strap them in and go!

The double seat goes in the front when in newborn position and then it goes on the rear when baby is able to hold up head. And as others have said, it does recline...

how about duette?

Yes I agree about the buggyboard ilove. Someone suggested a strolli instead, as the buggyboard won't work with the Buzz, and I thought that being a bike-seat-type-thing would be fine as DS would love it and would in theory therefore cooperate. However the weather issue is swaying me away from that towards some type of double option.

That duette looks interesting matnanplus. I might be being completely blind but does it say anywhere that you can recline at least one of the seats all the way back for a newborn?

Both recline tho not fully flat.

what about this ABC?

Or I can sell you my P & T and I can buy the ABC.

I had a phil and teds for a year (dd 2-3/ds nb-1) i now have a buggyboard and single/just a single

P and t is good to push with two in, i put the buggyboard on my maclaren and my back kills for days, on my icandy cherry it is comfy but heavy fine as dd doesnt need it much but full time would be awful. You need slime for wheels as punctures are not fun though

The cocoon doesnt last as long as you like, but is lovely being able to slide them in and out, perhaps try and get one second hand (mine was used for 14 weeks or so, and although they are second hand the ones sold will prob have been used a similar amount) After the coccon has been outgrown just put baby in the seat, i bought a sheepskin liner (not a p and t one just a universal one) at this age some toys hangging inside are good, i used the tiny love arch this attached to sides of coccon then i hung it upside down) At about 4/5 months i would put ds in the rear seat reclined, padded with sheepskin liner (easy to swap across from one seat to the other) for an hour or so (similar incline to bouncy chair) if we were out for a long day and he was fed up of lying down

In winter I had two buggy snuggles instead of the p and t sleeping bags theese were cosy and it is easier to swap kids acrosss seats if snuggles the same. I found the p and t more irritating in the summer, your lo will be 6 months ish then and so in the back/main seat, i found the sun protection poor tbh, there is no hood on the reaer seat ( i took the hood off my britax baby car seat and used that on the back seat but does block vision a bit) The front seat does have a hood but it doesnt provide much cover as sun can creep thtough gap at the back and shade doesnt cover half the child from the front. I had a single shade a babe from before but it didnt stop sun from the back, the pand t sunshade has a section for the rear but is £££. I didnt buy any more sun accessoreies but you can get things that help but i got fed up of spending so much on an already expensive buggy

I did manage to push around two sleeping children a fair amount but the seats do recline about as much as car seats which isnt ideal. Even if the baby is in the buggy as a single (rear seat can fit in basket) then the recline isnt great as once baby is in harness their feet end up raised above head if seat is fully reclined

When working out prices i think you need to add in the price of dbl raincver/buggle snuggle type things/pannier bag (these are good i still used one on my maclaren)/some kind of sunshade. If you can find a good one second hand this is prob wise, or at least buy all the accessories second hand

I got a P&T sport for my two and have a 17 months age gap. DS2 was born at the beggining of November and it was great for cold winter mornings on the school run as he was snug as a bug in a rug. I used the cocoon until he was over 4 months, and then just with a blanket over him. We started using the rear seat for him when he was around 4/5 months and he was fine in it on the slight recline (which is better than some pushchairs that say suitable from 3mo)

Now, DD is 2 and DS2 is 8 months and he is usually up front as she likes to pop in and out of the back when she is tired or wants to walk. She actually fights over having to sit up top these days and prefers being in the toddler seat at the back. They aren't too different in weight either now!

I have tested a fair few doubles for a baby magazine and would definately say that my P&T is the best of the bunch when it comes to versatility and manoeuvreability. Never have any issues with it shops or getting in and out of the house, but side by side doubles don't fit through my front door so the DC have to be loaded in outside; not great if it's raining.

I tested an icandy pear once and the seat units were too small....my dinky DD was all squished up at 18 months and her head was wedged up underneath the hood.

Like all doubles, there is a certain amount of compromise, but I really do think it's the best of the bunch if you have two different aged DC.

And once the older DC is walking more, you have the mother of all storage capacities.

Re the sunshades, I bought a Protectabub sunshade made for the rear seat of the P&T which was about £25 that works well. It looks a lot nicer than the full coverage Baby Burka shades. The front hood is too high up to properly shade the little one when he is in the front seat, so I use the protectabub shade the other way round there. It isn't an ideal fit that way round, but does the job.

There are known issues with quality of workamnship though and I'm currently on my third seat unit and have had a new doubles seat fabric and hood as well. The UK distributors seem happy to keep replacing them for me though!

OBaby now do an equivalent design which might be worth looking at....exactly the same configuration which is more like the vibe and is a lot cheaper iirc and you get cosytoes thrown in as well.

and congratulations, I didn't realise you were pregnant

I've been thinking about a Phil & Teds for when/if we have no.2. We currently have a Bugaboo Cameleon and as we got it from new the DH is very keen to keep using it. I, however, feel that the DS won't be happy just being on a buggyboard if it happens in the next year as he will only be about 2.5.

So..... is hubby right and we should get the buggboard or should we get a vibe & doubles kit and then use the Bugaboo again when DS isn't using a buggy at all.

Sorry for the hyjack

I had a e3 to begin with and hated so sold that and bought a sport (it was pink so swayed me!) and now im in love!!

My dd3 (21mo) doesn't like the rear seat much but dd4 (8mo) isn't bothered by it and will happily play with toys i hang from the back of the front seat.

I have the double sun mesh thing and it is great, the poppers stop it flapping about and they seem a lot cooler under there.

I had a duette and you can lie the seats flat which is lovely for a newborn but it takes up a lot of room in the car!

O/t - oooo flowery I didn't know you were pregnant!! Congratulations!!

think the sun mesh is equivalent to SPF 50?

The sun mesh is SPF 50 but i didn't feel it provided enough shade so got the shade a babe which is darker and closer knit, baby seemed happy and the temp was lower inside this way, also shade a babe was alot easier when out and about to move and when folded.

Everyone is so lovely and helpful!

Thanks for congrats juney and daisy

That Obaby one is much cheaper isn't it....Hmmm...Has some good reviews as well. Wonder if the little seat reclines in that as it does on the P&T?

That ABC looks amazing MatNanPlus! I think if DS were younger I might be tempted but the thing with the P&T (and now the Obaby as well) is that it can convert back to a single easily when DS starts walking all the time, which given his age will be a bonus.

Scattykatty if I were in your position with a Bugaboo rather than my Buzz I'd be at least trying it with the buggyboard first before forking out for something new tbh.

I need a trip to Kiddicare to try them out really, and hopefully see how the Obaby one compares for the bargain price of £250.