Frustrated guy here

[user1496529599]

Hi, hoping an outside view will help me out here.

Our sex life is pretty poor and I would dearly love to get it on track. Before kids we were never really wild, but we had plenty of fun. We have 3, oldest 7 and youngest 2. So absolutely she is tired. OH is a SAHM, 2 are at school now and youngest it at home with her all but 2 afternoons so she has plenty going on. She has very houseproud so cleaning takes a while as it’s always thorough. She is the primary organiser of the family, making sure the kids have what they need for school and that planning holidays, Christmas, birthdays etc so I totally understand she has a lot on her plate.

Over the last 5 years sex has dwindled to about 3 or 4 times a year. Nothing yet in 2018. I have a higher drive than her, I masturbate everyday for the release, i would like to cut it down as it’s probably not helping. I sat her down and discussed how I am struggling about 24 months ago, and then again about 10 months ago to say I miss the intimacy and going so long is hard.

Both times we have talked she said it’s stress of running the house and tiredness. Both fair points. We have been getting good sleep most nights for about 6 months now as kids are all sleeping well. I think I do my bit, I get up at 6 when the kids get up, feed them breakfast etc before i go to work at 7:30. Work is very difficult and stressful and I am pushing my limits as I got promoted to a job I am not experienced in so working hard to be at the right level. Unfortunately, OH sees this as a break from the kids each day, pretty much a holiday. I get home about 6pm and if I’m exhausted ‘I haven’t had the kids all day so have no reason to be tired’ and need to man up. She cooks dinner, I do the dishes, I put the kids to bed and I tidy up the kids toys at the end of the day. Aside from sorting out bills and accounts etc my only other job is ironing. Which i do over one or evenings a week. She carries a huge mental load running the house, but I carry the same thing at work in the day and it can be hard to switch that off and make room to remember all the family stuff. I have to be reminded things quite a bit. She wants me to do more to help out which I want to do but I’m knackered. Plus she does nothing in the evening apart from phone stuff... probably 50/50 between looking things up for the family and Facebook etc.

I think she is a fabulous mum, and I want to help more but I don’t feel like I’m a total slacker.

So, tiredness and stress are what are identified as the problems, but surely these can’t be the problem every night of every week... we kiss and cuddle everyday and are very close but she doesn’t initiate anything and half the time I feel nervous making a move these days.

When she accepts we could be doing it a lot more, I don’t think she even thinks about sex. If I never mentioned it or came on to her I think we wouldn’t have sex ever again. When we do ever have sex it feels like she is doing me a favor.

Although she happily points out who she thinks is fit on telly lol that doesn’t help lol. I feel stuck, after talking I’m trying but struggling to address what she identified as the reasons.

Can anyone shed a female view of what i can do to help her more or has anyone had a similar thing and gotten past it? I’m only 32, she is 34. 5 years of minimal sex and dreading the thought of that being the norm from now on. Extra points, she is definitely not cheating, she does not masturbate, not in any contraceptives as I had the snip after no 3. I don’t know how she goes so long on nothing !

God, I need to show this to my OH, he thinks he's hard done by with once or twice a week!

My sex drive tanked after having a baby. Is she breastfeeding your youngest still (don't know if she did to begin with)? If she is, I can tell you now it completely kills your libido (well... for many women) for 2 reasons:

1. You've got a dependent who physically needs your body (add to that an OH wanting sex... well....).

1. Prolactin responsible for milk production suppresses oestrogen which plays a major role in sex drive.

And to the asshole who commented on OP's OH being 'hard work' - no. Hard work is having no libido, being constantly reminded of it, eventually feeling so guilty that you spend a good couple of hours trying to mentally prepare yourself to dish out a duty fuck and then having to go through with said duty fuck, probably not climax yourself, and walk away feeling like you've just gone through all of that with zero enjoyment just to buy yourself a bit of space. You've essentially allowed someone to use your body for their enjoyment to buy yourself a bit of unpressured time. It's fucking miserable. That, my friend, is hard work.

Sorry OP... I do sympathise with your frustration, but for women it's often dependent on their current mental load as much as it is desire... these days, my desire is zero so I just try to do it when I don't feel mentally overloaded. Have you spoken to your OP about how she feels about her body and how she feels mentally, particularly as a SAHM? I think sometimes for women who are SAHMs they can go through a bit of a crisis of confidence regarding how they are perceived by the rest of society... Is this something that may be bothering her? Does she feel valued? Something to bear in mind when approaching the topic of sex is that even if you come across sensitively and sympathetic, sometimes it can drive a woman deeper into a hole over it because of the burden of guilt... just something for you to be aware of.

Just to add, sounds like you are trying to be fully supportive and share the load, which is great, but it really is very hard to be intimate when it just isn't there. Only you can know if it's a deal breaker.

At the very least, hope some of this might help with perspective. X

Kikia , I bfeed my 2 yo through the night and have little to no libido. In fact I could have written your post myself. I still think she sounds like hard work .

He said he has discussed this once 10 months ago and the time before that was 2 years ago and that they haven't had sex at all this year . So how have you concluded that she is being 'constantly ' reminded if it's a once a year heart to heart ?
Despite this , she still comments about how attractive other men are in front of her dh who is going through massive rejection issues as well as trying to do everything physically and mentally possible to make her feel supported . I think you're jumping to conclusions and projecting your own experiences re the breastfeeding and libido .

A question for the OP: Has anything changed about you since you first met your wife that may have made your attraction to her dwindle? The obvious would be if you’ve put on a few stone, but there could be other things.

@moonmaker - sorry to hear you feel the same, it's a rough one, isn't it? I'd love to have even just a smidge but most of the time I feel like if I never had to do it again it'd be too soon.

RE my comments about being reminded, I'll hold my hands up and apologise - that was from personal experience and NOT based on anything OP has said, but a retaliation to what I deemed to be a rather unfair comment about her being 'hard work'. I'm not for one moment suggesting that he is badgering if indeed he has only had the conversation once. I just felt disheartened by the bluntness of the comment that she sounded like 'hard work', as a woman who also finds sex a difficult thing to do and so I wanted to give some perspective of what 'hard work' looks like from the opposite side of the table! I'd be upset if someone referred to me as hard work because my own body was out of whack. It's a horrible thing to have sex if you don't want it.

Mentioning the breastfeeding was a valid comment - it does reduce libido in many women and was only put out as a point to consider IF she was breastfeeding their youngest, which I made quite clear. That isn't projecting or drawing conclusions. It was a question based on my own experience of breastfeeding and I then went on to state the reasons why in the EVENT that she was, not because I somehow knew she most definitely was, ergo no projecting, no conclusions - just a simple "hey, did you know if she's breastfeeding that can contribute to lack of libido, here's why...".

I have simply shared my experience of a lack of libido to try to give the OP some honesty about how things can be for some women in this situation - perhaps they are relatable, perhaps not, but he asked for advice and we can only advise based on our own understanding/experiences of the topic.

Thanks for the responses. All greatly appreciated.

I have always done my bit. I already did my bit, but reflecting and if probably did start doing a bit more around the house in the hope it would lead to more sex, but that didn’t work and I felt it was stuff I should be doing anyway so just crack on now.

She isn’t breastfeeding, not for a long time. I think she is pretty happy with herself, she felt like she needed to lose weight after baby 3, I thought she looked great. But she lost the weight she wanted and seems happier for it.

I need to shift some timber. I will see if that makes a difference. It normally slides off pretty quick when I focus. That would at least help me rule out physical attraction but if she has gone off me more than physically I guess I’m screwed. (Or not screwed as it seems!)

Getting the balance between patience and not pressuring her into anything she isn’t up for is the hardest thing. Especially if she doesn’t open up, if tiredness is the reason fair enough. But if she is saying that when she really feels something else but doesn’t want to upset me then I am stuck. I guess I can only give it time, if I get into better shape over the next few months the littlest starts pre school 4 half days after Easter so see if that helps

Definitely get yourself in shape. Hopefully that’ll rekindle some physical attraction from your wife. Worst case scenario, it makes no difference, but at least you’ll feel better and healthier.

I recommend joining a gym and heavy weightlifting by the way - get yours muscles toned and burn fat at the same time!

Hi OP, read the thread and I think you sound like a lovely husband who loves his wife very much and you seem to do a lot around the house to help and with two kids in full time school, then at this point, I think your wife is just being a bit selfish of your needs. She obviously doesn't think that sex in a marriage is as important as you do (it really is important IMO). I would be quick to defend her if she was at home with 3 young kids and no breaks and you did nothing to help out, but you do your share and sound genuinely down about the change in your relationship, so at this point I also think your wife is being selfish and inconsiderate towards you. She does sound like hard work.
No real advice but wanted to let you know that so you don't blame the lack of sex all on yourself and hopefully she will let you know what's really going on with her.

Good luck OP, you sound lovely, I expect your wife is ‘just’ tired. With the youngest about to enter preschool it really does sound like you’re coming to the end of the toughest bit and hopefully things will sort themselves out soon.

People have talked about you trying to make her fancy you again. Of course, try to take care of your body - although remember that for many women, a surprise bit of extra help around the house can be much more sexy than working out. But please don’t feel that it’s you that’s the issue. Women’s hormones change a shit loads in our thirties and are affected by lack of sleep, proximity to young children, all sorts. Dunno how old she is but it’s quite possible that her hormones are just not making her feel interested in sex, you say she doesn’t masturbate so it seems to me likely her libido is just flat. That’s actually a very natural state for a woman with 3 young children, nature is telling her she can’t cope with another right now! Hopefully once she’s less tired and you have more time together things will improve.

Everyone gets tired. That's the bodies way of telling us to go to bed. What you need to work out is - is she exhausted at 7pm? Is she ready for bed as is staring to get sleepy at 10pm?

If it's the later, then i don't believe she's overly tired, tired at 10pm (ish) is normal and you would go to bed, kiss and cuddle and a bit of the other (on some nights) and be asleep by 11pm

I think she's got into a routine of thinking sex is going to be a hassle and she just can't be arsed.

Ask her what she thinks constitutes to good sex? Ask her what can you both do to make sure you both have satisfying sex.

She might just be bored with the predictability of sex (and it probably is shit if you've waited a long period of time)

When you last spoke, did you ask her how she feels about the lack of sex? Does she ever feel sexy? Does she have sexual urges toward you? Or anyone else?

I think if you ask direct questions of her, rather than how you feel, her answers may be more telling

Google "Athol Kay".

Hey!
First of all I'm so sorry for what's going on with your sex life! I went through with some What of a similar issue with my husband and we talked it through and worked it out (and we have sex a average 3 times a week!). I understand your wife does a lot and it's not easy having 3 children but at the same time it's essential to make some time for your other half! You can't have a good relationship without any intimacy (3 times a year doesn't really count). I'm sure I'm not the only one if I say that even when I'm tired or can't be asked I still say yes to my husband for the common good. I think a healthy relationship involves different types of sex - sometimes if I want to enjoy it I get on top,if I'm tired we'll have a quickie or he will be on top etc. I don't think being tired is a real excuse to be honest. If you fancy your partner I think you would find some energy to get intimate.
Maybe your wife needs a nice day/night out where she can dress up and feel like a wife rather then just a mum?
Hope you can sort it. You seem to really value her and your relationship and reading this just makes me sad :/

Wow, OP - what a brilliant reply to Joey. Sadly there are a lot of men who would have the same unhelpful, blunt and completely unempathetic attitude to giving “advice”. You on the other hand sound like a wonderful husband, understanding, grateful, loving and caring. The way you talk about your wife is so nice. She’s a very lucky woman to have someone like you.
Sometimes it’s easy to under appreciate your partner when the daily grind is so exhausting.
You say she cleans meticulously... I suffered with OCD as a part of anxiety/depression for several years, and another symptom was loss of sex drive and feeling incredibly resentful towards my partner, which in turn made me stop finding him attractive.
I wonder if it might be worth asking your wife how she feels emotionally. Maybe even some marriage counselling would help?
I also think it would be a good idea to ask her if there’s anything you could do that might make her more attracted to you again and help yu both find that spark?

OH and I completely second what Boiing says. Hormones play a huge part in our sex drive. I always had a very night sex drive before having a baby, but after had barely any and - tmi alert - I was even completely dry down there for about two years straight! My body was just telling me it wasn’t time.

I've got three kids, I've had various jobs and trust me, those jobs really did feel like s break compared to parenting. Try doing your Job with three kids constantly demanding, arguing or needing you for something. That's what she's likely dealing with as that's what I'm dealing with atm.

I would get more help in to do cleaning, maybe one more day a week nursery too. She's lost her identity and only sees herself as Mum by the sounds of it.

Thanks for the responses. She is tired as in exhausted by 8pm (although she doesn’t go to bed till much later) so she is going to go to the doctor to check iron levels etc.

Assuming she isn’t unnaturally tired for any reason I will discuss with her in greater depth what exactly she considers a good sex life and where she would like us to be. That should give a better bodies where shen wants to be vs where we are.

InthinknhavjgnanfiarlybregukarnbabysitternwI’ll also helps so we can spend more time together

Do you go out together without the kids, just the two of you? And do you each have independent social lives and go out with your friends independently of each other and without the kids? That can help, I think. It's easy to get caught up feeling like a mum rather than a woman with her own life and lose yourself a bit.

I could have been your DW in my 30’s.
I can’t really explain why, I had 3 young children but they were good sleepers. I loved my life as a sahm.
Basically I shut down sexually. We maybe had sex twice a year and I never masturbasted. I think I saw myself as a ‘Mummy’ and at some level this shut down the sexual side of my personality .
I do not know how my DH managed to put up with it. Eventually he pretty much gave up, he concentrated on work and gym. He, like you, was always really hands-on with the children.
Unlike other posters we stuck with the marriage and, once our youngest got to around 10 (sorry!), everything changed. We have more sex - and exciting sex- than ever before. This situation has lasted for 5 years so far and shows no sign of slowing thankfully.
Like you, we always loved each other and our sex life was the elephant in the room. I am writing this with tears in my eyes thinking how easily I could have effectively have lost the opportunity to be enjoying such a great marriage and the family life that I have now.
I would actively avoid nights in hotels together, always booking family rooms on holiday.
I don’t know what advice to give you, nothing would work for me. I guess it is down to you if you can hang on for the long haul or not.
Best of luck to you both.

I wonder whether you could suggest taking your wife away for a weekend just the two of you. This would remove you both from the context of the domestic and work areas of your life and would encourage you to see each other as a couple again. Young children can be draining and can erode the sensual Identity and it can be difficult to switch that back on again as it involves shuttling between different versions of oneself which takes energy, something often in short supply. But I think you're right to take the issue of your intimate relationship seriously and it's laudable that you wish to address it. I wonder also if your wife might be feeling lacking in confidence, if shy even, about approaching the subject and the longer it's avoided the more of an elephant in the room it becomes.

We just had a few days away which was nice and a good chance to reconnect a bit. Think it’s something worth making an effort to schedule just like date nights. We chatted and she described herself exactly like you did Peakypolly. Just as a mum, the sexual side has pretty much shut down.

She doesn’t drive which we are going to get her doing this year so she can go out and be more independent. That might help give her some freedom and then she can join some local classes/clubs to give her more of a life away from the house. That or she may find a part time job.

After our latest discussion I feel there is currently quite a mismatch in terms of sexual appetite, which if these steps don’t help with, will hopefully recover once the littlest is at school sometime in the next couple of years.

Hard work and patience are going to be the only way to improve things going forward. I would like to think there were a magic fix but I don’t see one. If things are going in the right direction that’s something.

Your solutions seem very much based on her and the expectation that, providing that she’s stress free etc,, then she’ll automatically want to have sex with you if her life is easier. I’m afraid it doesn’t work like that. Women get turned on and want sex when there’s something about a man (or woman) that presses their buttons; they don’t get horny because the housework and childcare has been done for them.

What I’m saying is harsh and slightly against the grain for mumsnet, but from your original post (and also personal experience); I really do think that the problem isn’t so much that she doesn’t want to have sex, but more that she doesn’t want to have sex with you. It’s fine to help with her workload, but concentrate on yourself as much, if not more.

I think @Joey7t8 makes a good point. It's possible it's not valid for this scenario, but I think it may well be. Earlier, I suggested that you google "Athol Kay" (an American author who writes on these matters) and I reiterate that.

I’ve totally lost my sex drive due to hormonal issues. This has happened several times in my life always due to hormonal changes (contraceptives, hormonal treatments, breastfeeding etc). Now I can’t even take the pill without it going completely.

I can’t bear the thought of sex, let alone have it. I have no sexual thoughts or response to seeing sexual things. I don’t masturbate. I am absolutely exhausted by motherhood and the mental load. I don’t feel like a human being any more much of the time. I am a robot catering to everyone else. I don’t even have the energy to take good care of myself, let alone my husband, even if I did have some libido left. I know once my hormones balance out it will be back with a vengeance, just hoping it won’t be much longer.

What a lovely husband you are!
I'm sure with your love and support things will get better. What about getting intimate but offering to give her a back massage once a week in the evening and don't expect it to lead anywhere but hopefully in time it will. Hope things improve for you soon xx

Been there, done that mate.
It'll eat you up and spit you out.
Patch up, pack up or find a 3rd way.....pm if you want to chat.
(I'm not sure how or if you can pm here.)