OXBRIDGE again....DS head of sixth form 'advice' today grrrrr

[RiaParkinson]

DS is hoping to do medicine

Today the head of sixth form called all the boys hoping to do medicine to a meeting. He asked them all where they were hoping to go and then with much tut tutting - told them to have a rethink

The schools head boy has this year received NO OFFERS and the teacher is 'warning' them off the top universities

DS said the teacher said look 'further down the list' ...

DD (14) was in the room when ds recounted this tale to me and she said ' I see - so basically what MR Soandso is saying is 'Aim Low'

I agree with dd

How would you feel ?

My gut reaction is to ring the school - but is it irrelevant what this bloke says???

Or should ds be heeding his advice- despite misgivings?

Ria just to add when I was applying we were told that the newer, more modern colleges tend to take a higher proportion of kids from non-independent schools than the older, more traditional ones. Not sure if this is still the case however? If your DS is serious about Oxbridge it's definitely worth researching as colleges (and tutors) vary so much in their "preferred" student types that it's not just about ability unfortunately. There were very few students in my year at my college from state schools - I don't know if it was an active bias or not however! A friend at another college was one of the only students in her year from an independent school so it worked both ways....IMHO St Anns and St Catherine's Oxford both used to take a high proportion from state schools and I've heard that Somerville, Queens and Keble are quite balanced in this respect too....

You may also want to look at the Tompkins and Norrington Tables here

In my day - Kings Cambridge and Wadham Oxford had a reputation for taking mainly state school students. St. Hilda's Oxford has only very recently started taking boys, so may be worth considering as a tactical choice. In my day Oxford had a system where you could make an open application - so you would automatically be allocated to one of the colleges which had lower levels of applications in your particularly subject.

nother very good forum where your DS could sk for dvice on med school applictions.

www.admissionsforum.net/

Lots of info on different unis. I second everyone who says that Nottinghm hs a very good repution, but then I'm biased!

If the don't apply to the best then they've given up their potential place to someone else iyswim. So what if the head boy didn't get an offer - your ds could.

Can we knock this on the head about the timing of applications!

Generally, Oxbridge have an earlier timetable than the rest of UCAS so if Ria's DS was applying to read English then other Uni (who do not know where else you have applied to, unless the applicant is tricked into revealing in interview!) would guess from predicted grades and early application that he was also applying to Oxbridge.
However, Riason is applying for medicine which has its own timetable but it is universal to all Medical Schools.

For college statistics at Oxford google the oxford gazette admissions statistics. It shows you admissions for 2007 by type of school/course and college. It makes interesting reading. However making the choice based on these statistics is a mystery to me.

Perhaps this year is unusually competitive because fewer students are taking a gap year before starting university for credit crunch reasons. I'm just guessing, I don't know for sure that fewer students are planning a gap year, but in times of recession people tend to be more focussed on getting paper qualifications over life experience. Anyway, it doesn't necessarily mean that next year will be as competitive for your DS, although it might be.

I hate all this nonsense about colleges favouring particular types of pupil and Oxbridge in general favouring independent schools. It is not true. You can't get in if you don't apply. And if you look at my earlier link you will see that schools other than independent have a good enrtance success rate relative to their applications rate. But you have to apply to get in.

Oh and by the way you get four choices for medicine and five choices in general so someone wanting to do medicine can apply to four medicine course and a fifth other subject choice.

ALL medicine/vet science/dental and Oxbridge (for ANY subject) applications have to be by an earlier deadline, by 15 October this year. All other applications to other universities and for other subjects were in by 15 January.

So ALL medical school applications will have been in by 15 October, regardless of whether doing Oxbridge or not. Therefore, the medical schools cannot 'tell' that they have applied to Oxbridge by the timing of the receipt of the application, if you see what I mean.

The universities cannot see which other universities have been applied to, but it is true they will be able to hazard a guess that the pupil has applied to Oxbridge to do, say, English if they suddenly get the application by the 15 October deadline. But not with medicine/vet/dental!!!

Bagsforlife - Thanks for that.

University's preference for applicants from the state sector www.independent.co.uk/news/education/higher/bristol-must-come-clean-599670.html story here

Two of my three DCs are at university so have been through this process twice recently. They were at state grammar school.

Neither did Oxbridge or medicine BUT many of their friends did.

Those that didn't get into Oxbridge are ALL now at Russell Group universities. So it is not going to disadvantage anyone particularly, although they may be at Durham rather than LSE or something, but they are all at 'top' universities, including Nottingham... in fact a lot at Nottingham. Also pupils have gone to Bristol.

As many admission tutors have said on other threads, the top universities only care about the 'cleverness', for want of a better word, of the student. They don't care where they went to school.

It is becoming very difficult to differentiate between the 3 A grade students who are all applying. Everyone will have excellent GCSEs (all As, A*s).

So Ria's son SHOULD apply to Oxbridge to do medicine and hopefully will get in and if he doesn't, he will probably get a place somewhere else.

If he still doesn't get a place, he should re-apply next year.

I know several of DCs friends who have done that, and they have all got places.

Now he needs to find lots of work experience....

RP - your son like mine will be taking A levels in summer 2010. This is the first year they will have introduced the A. Does anyone know if this will affect university offers? I believe you have to get over 90% to get an A !

But at the moment Oxbridge ask for all your UMS marks in AS exams so they can see if you are on target for A* - and some stipulate 90% or more in their offers already!

Both Oxford and Cambridge are not going to be using the A* in 2010 as they want to see how it works out.

I have never heard of Oxford or Cambridge making offers dependent upon attainment of percentage marks in A2, only grades.

This was cut from a STudent Room thread about Offers here

"I need to get 92% average UMS in each of my A-level subjects to meet my offer conditions.
I'm not terrified because I have a good insurance choice. However, having come this far, I would be pretty annoyed if I missed my offer."

"Im absolutely terrified!!!! Mine is 4A's at 90% in each subject which are maths, further maths, physics and chemistry.... its chemistry that im most worried about- i find it SO difficult so ive had to start revising now!! i need 94% in it this year to get an average of 90%....ahhh!!
I'm so grateful to get an offer at Cambridge but i think its unrealistic and im just so worried and every time i think about it i get upset as that uni has put me through quite a tough time during the application process so i was so happy to receive an offer but then i found out the grades and cried! The time i have left until my exams is going to be very stressful im sure....... I'm definitely going to try my best to get those grades though and i hope all my work will pay off "

and more 90%+ offers here

Milliways Thanks for that info. Gawd. That is tough isn't it. I have just found this article from the Daily Mail Perhpas they are more likely to do it if the candidate is marginal in some way. It seems arbitrary to demand a percentage in modules from some candidates and just grades for others.

Milli - Did your daughter have a grades only offer?

In some ways (possibly in humanities/arts rather than sciences) I think it is more difficult to get in the mid nineties in a so called 'dumbed down' A level than it would be to get a 75/80% in a more gritty exam. It gives absolutely no room for error, even the exceptionally bright can have slight mishaps which are not a sign of lack of potential for a top uni.

Yes Swedes, she was lucky to just get a 3A offer (and is taking 4, so has some margin).

Milliways - Oh I am glad. It takes some of the pressure off.

Woah Milliways - some of those offers do sound scary. Glad your dd isn't among them. I wonder just how common it is?