OXBRIDGE again....DS head of sixth form 'advice' today grrrrr

[RiaParkinson]

DS is hoping to do medicine

Today the head of sixth form called all the boys hoping to do medicine to a meeting. He asked them all where they were hoping to go and then with much tut tutting - told them to have a rethink

The schools head boy has this year received NO OFFERS and the teacher is 'warning' them off the top universities

DS said the teacher said look 'further down the list' ...

DD (14) was in the room when ds recounted this tale to me and she said ' I see - so basically what MR Soandso is saying is 'Aim Low'

I agree with dd

How would you feel ?

My gut reaction is to ring the school - but is it irrelevant what this bloke says???

Or should ds be heeding his advice- despite misgivings?

Peninsula.

Not Penninsula.
Nor Penninsular.

Spell it right if you are going to apply there.

I'm not a medic but I know people who teach the medical students at Peninsula. They are very enthusiastic. It's a new school, everyone is keen. Lots of mature students. Lots of face-to-face time with tutors.

As you are only allowed 4 Med Applications, I would suggest at least 1 to a "lower" ranked Uni. Although, DD applied to 1 non Russell group Uni this year - and it gave her one of the highest offer conditions!! (Not a med course though).

I work with over 20 GPs and a lot of them turned down Oxbridge Med places as their course is not so practical - but things could have changed since they graduated. Southampton seemed popular, along with St Thomas's.

Apparently the London Teaching Hospitals are getting lower numbers applying as it is sooo expensive to live in London!

Has your DS looked at The Student Room Medical forum ?

thanks for that milliways

all feels so 'contrived' somehow i cant help thinking it should not be like this

i am just naive

Is it just because A levels are not the barometer they once were

But even when I applied to unversity (and that was ages ago) we were given the back-up choice advice. And A levels really meant something back then blah blah blah

my poor dcs

they must think dp and i were child prodigies when we start ranting about how 'hard' it was to get into University back then!

Was it? I don't remember it that way really. And of course we could apply to more. 5 universities and 4 polys IIRC. I don't know anyone whowas left with no offer at all, even if it were one they had no intention of taking up.

People had to make these strategic choices about which unis to apply to for subjects like medicine, even back in my day. My sister applied for medicine and had to work out how to apply so that you hedged your bets without avoiding applying to the better schools.

I don't think it has changed so much, from what people are saying on this thread, and the school is just warning the children how to be strategic and realistic.

So the advice is not Aim Low but Think what you really want - Oxbridge as the priority, or medicine as the priority.

Have name changed. Went to cambridge to do pre clinical medicine and then to clinical in london.

I applied over 14 years ago so things are very different (never heard of russell group?) but would suggest going for oxbridge if he will get the grades (predicted as well), and then putting another good uni eg bristol, edinburgh, then a couple of less popular ones.

Its true that some colleges are not as popular - at cambridge for example churchill, robinson, girton so may be easier to get into.

Things that will increase his chances of getting into oxbridge are - not just being academic - so being sporty or musical or into drama etc preferably at quite a high level. Also being able to think outside the box, laterally etc and generally coming across a bright spark, interested in life.

Oxbridge medical pre clinical degrees are definitely more academic and less clinical than other universities. The cambridge 2nd year exams are meant to be the hardest of any in the country. There are advantages and disadvantages of this more traditional clinical/pre clinical divide. It is perhaps hard to see where you are going in the first year - but you feel like a normal student and mix with non medics which i think is crucial. Also, to be honest you do most of your proper learning to be a doctor in house jobs, and on the job rather than at medical school and a good science base stands you in good stead, eg for postgraduate membership exams.

In your third year you get to do something diffent - it can be science but it can also be politics, sociology, theology - this is a fantastic opportunity and can really contribute to making a more rounded doctor.

Its also true that aren't enough places in oxbridge for clinical school and you have to reapply. however there are enough places everywhere - in my year most of the fun people went down to london and we all had a fantastic time. I felt we were leaving cambridge on a high after a really special time, and wouldn't want to stay longer. People from cambridge can go to oxford for clinical as well, and edinburgh as well as london.

if he really wants to go and has a chance then give it a go, its totally wonderful, but there's not point applying if hes not going to get predicted straight As.

hth

I'm not sure whether Oxbridge is the best choice for medicine....very difficult first 3 yrs and then often no place for the next 3!
Also many universities don't make offers to candidates who have applied to Oxbridge..unless that has dramatically changed. Unless he's very sure, meh!!

Ria - I went to university longer ago than anyone else on Mumsnet, and it was like this way back then. And A levels were what they used to be then!

You put the top places at the top of the list in case you get brilliant grades and are really lucky - then you put the slightly less top places in case your grades aren't as good as you hopes or you aren't lucky, then you put a couple of Okish places as a backup.

Doesn't seem contrived to me - just a pragmatic approach to a situation fraught with variables!

the fallen madonna my parents were awful snobs there was no way a child of their applied to a poly

they were checking the shade of red on the bricks

(nips off to read huge posts! thanks)

I'm no expert on this but don't different Uni have different entry procedure (BMAT etc). Choose your Uni so that you have a variety of routes in, so if you score badly on BMAT (or whatever the other paper is called ?UKCAT?) then you haven't spoilt all your chances.

camdoc - will show him our post in the morning

you make ME want to apply! thanks for that it really helps!

Sorry that didn't work; it's called Getting into Medical School: the Pushy Mothers' Guide.

Written by a mother who discovered, the day after her son failed to get into Oxford, that there was a whole world she didn't know about but her 'friends' (whose kids had got places) did.

When her DTDs announced they wanted to study medicine, she made it her full-time job to achieve this, and imparts the wisdom she discovered here.

Might be worth a look.

God, I applied to everthing. I had a wealth of 2E offers from polys. Could never quite believe I was going to get the grades for my first choice. I remember agonising over which university offer to go for as my second choice (we had to narrow down offers to just two IIRC) because I wanted to go for the lowest but my head of sixth form wouldn't let me. Never quite believed in those grades until I got them. The joys of non-modular exams I guess.

yes we did

5 universities - UCCA form - ahhh the joys!

i disagree ronaldinho - i think oxbridge is a great place to read medicine. It is difficult but def do-able, and he will have the time of his life when there, with so many opportunities outside of academic life.

There aren't enough places at the clinial school - but many people actively choose to leave rather than not get in to clinical school, and experience something different ( a huge plus IMO). The combination of oxbridge pre clinical and london clinical is fantastic and most of this cohort go on to become very high flying docs.

Thankyou yetoxichighroad
may invest

your name is fab btw....meaning?

Why thank you - was nontoxic but changed to be seasonal.

the combination of Cambridge and London would be ideal for ds

he is obsessive re oxbridge but drawn in a sweet and naive way by london and all that holds...

He is incredibly driven for a 16 year old - bloody egocentric with it but driven!

That is my understanding and opinion camdoc...

Excellent gcse grades, strong supportive references, excellent AS levels and solid A predicitions added to an absolute desire to be there seem necessary these days almost more than ever before.

I'd be very sure that this was the case for my dc and investigate other schools carefully before making an Oxbridge choice that might effect their other offers

Ria - If your son is predicted straight As in his A levels, I think that's a ridiculous thing for the head of sixth form to have said.

DS's school had 20 applicants for medicine this year and all 20 got at least one offer (a few got offered all 4), subject to grades (AAA or AAB).

Don't forget that as well as A levels med schools look at BMAT or UKCAT scores. I think there is normally a direct correlation between those scores and offers.

thanks swedes

he is predicted that and even two years ago at parents evenings - teachers said if he wanted to he was Oxbridge material (unprompted)

I may ring school to clarify...

Disagree Swedes about BMAT/UKCAT, not in all cases - see my point earlier. One of DD's friends did below average on her BMAT and so was not offered for two of her choices. Ended up going to ... Oxford!