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Secondary education

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Original poster

Maths streaming - should I push for my son to move up a set

89 replies

boinoo · 26/01/2026 18:34

I just need to check in with other parents (and hopefully teachers) who can advise.

My son is in year 8 in a mixed comp. He's a quiet kid but I get in impression he contributes to lessons and is doing ok academically. He was placed in bottom set for maths which came as a surprise because he is bright, just quiet. I mentioned it to the teacher at last years parents evening but she wasn't keen to move him up. He got one of the highest score in their term test at 83% and we are fortunate enough to have a weekly tutor too. Two children with worse grades have been moved up and he's been told he has to stay in that set.

Parents evening is coming up. Should I ask the teacher to move him up a set?

OP posts:
Original poster
boinoo · 27/01/2026 08:21

Octavia64 · 27/01/2026 07:46

maths teacher

setting in year 7 is usually based on the ks2 sats. Then teachers adjust if a child is clearly in the wrong place.

year 8 groups are then often based on an end of year 7 exam.

go back and check what he got in his ks2 sats (did he do them? We always got a few kids who fit various reasons hadn’t done them). How did his end of year 7 exam go?

if there are three sets then it’s likely these are quite big groups.

speak to the teacher and ask what he needs to do to move up. You say he got “one of” the highest marks in the most recent test - it’s quite likely that in order to do a move he needs to be visibly top of the group.

Good advice, thanks

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Original poster
boinoo · 27/01/2026 08:23

duckfordinner · 27/01/2026 07:57

It’s better to be in a higher set than lower set from my experience. Could it be that it’s convenient for teacher to keep your quiet child in a lower set to offset the behavior in the group. Teachers do that sometimes to make their life easier.

This is my worry as he is quiet. It doesn't sound like the class are disruptive as such, just sounds like he spends a bit of time waiting while the teacher helps other children (understandably). Some struggle a little with their tables etc so it takes up time. Only going by what my son says of course.

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Original poster
boinoo · 27/01/2026 08:24

Tiswa · 27/01/2026 07:49

I think sometimes we forgot that is a difference between asking and opening a dialogue on something and demanding and we tend to lump it all under demanding as something we shouldn’t do.

Asking and opening a dialogue about where he is and how best to support him is absolutely fine

Yes absolutely. Just don't want to be 'that' parent who's a pain in the backside but also need to advocate for my son.

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Original poster
boinoo · 27/01/2026 08:27

PluckyChancer · 27/01/2026 07:38

What sort of kids are in the bottom set?

In DS’s school they don’t stream any subjects which is hopeless as every class will have some percentage of disruptive kids in it. DS is stuck with a lot of disruptive kids in most of his classes and the teachers spend most of the lessons firefighting just to keep control of the classroom.

Presumably also, the bottom set will be taught at a slower pace and given lower level work?

However, if your DS has a Maths tutor who can take him through the curriculum, then perhaps it doesn’t matter too much what set he’s in?

I don't get the impression they are massively disruptive. Think the pace is just a bit slower but that's not always a bad thing. That said, I'm not sure my son would mention behaviour as I think he has quickly got used to the rough and tumble of secondary school!

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Original poster
boinoo · 27/01/2026 08:27

BobbieTables · 27/01/2026 07:30

I'd definitely question them on the decision - it may be the right one but also it might not.
My thinking on this would be

  • could he keep up with the work in the next set up?
  • will he feel more confident at the top of the bottom set or near the bottom of the next set up?
  • what's the behavior like in each of theses sets? (Bottom set can be a zoo)
  • is bottom set a nurture group and does that support him?
  • what GCSE paper are they working towards? (Foundation is limiting but less stressful - he's in Y8 now so it doesn't matter that much but come Y9 or 10 it would be good to be in the set that's the right fit in this regard, and worth knowing that it's a lot easier to move down than up with this)

Great points, thanks

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Oricolt · 27/01/2026 08:28

Absolutely raise it with the teacher and ask for clarification.

Also consider: you mention a couple of times in your OP that he's bright but quiet. How quiet? The teacher only knows what he's willing to contribute. If he doesn't / won't join in mathematical debate or justify his thinking in a group situation, she may not have any legitimate reason to think his learning would be well supported in a more robust mathematics group.

Original poster
boinoo · 27/01/2026 08:28

wafflesmgee · 27/01/2026 07:30

Speak to the teacher respectfully but ultimately you have to trust their judgement and that they know what they are doing, surely? My daughters school has six “top sets” I think to appease parents, in reality I’m sure it’s just a name and they set within them!

Yes, I hope they do. There are 3 sets in his school but I'm not sure how they're carved up in terms of numbers. I don't want him in top set but the middle one could be good for him.

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Bluebluesummer · 27/01/2026 08:29

Yes ask for him to move up. Same happened with my DD she got the highest grade in her A level equivalent maths and was probably the best in Maths in the school but because she was dyslexic assumptions were made inappropriately. If you feel that the same is happening because your child is quiet definitely speak up.

Original poster
boinoo · 27/01/2026 08:31

Oricolt · 27/01/2026 08:28

Absolutely raise it with the teacher and ask for clarification.

Also consider: you mention a couple of times in your OP that he's bright but quiet. How quiet? The teacher only knows what he's willing to contribute. If he doesn't / won't join in mathematical debate or justify his thinking in a group situation, she may not have any legitimate reason to think his learning would be well supported in a more robust mathematics group.

The overall feedback at parents evening last year was that he's a quiet boy, has a good friendship group and is able to contribute to lessons and ask questions. That last point did surprise me a little because I always imagine him being too quiet to do that but it was the feedback I got from more teachers, including maths.

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Original poster
boinoo · 27/01/2026 08:31

Bluebluesummer · 27/01/2026 08:29

Yes ask for him to move up. Same happened with my DD she got the highest grade in her A level equivalent maths and was probably the best in Maths in the school but because she was dyslexic assumptions were made inappropriately. If you feel that the same is happening because your child is quiet definitely speak up.

Good to know. Glad your DD is doing well

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Original poster
boinoo · 27/01/2026 09:04

modgepodge · 26/01/2026 19:23

Do you remember what he got in his KS2 SATS? If he got 100+ he probably shouldn’t be in bottom set (unless it’s a grammar school perhaps).

It can be very difficult for teachers to accurately assess how well children are doing in a class of 30 especially if they’re just quietly getting on. 83% sounds like a good score, but did the middle/upper set do a harder test?

I definitely think you should have a conversation with the teacher at parents evening. You can’t demand anything, but you can ask politely and ask what their reasoning is.

Just dug out his results from year 6 and it was 103 for maths

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modgepodge · 27/01/2026 19:23

boinoo · 27/01/2026 09:04

Just dug out his results from year 6 and it was 103 for maths

Show quote history

103 is the national average, and just few points off the ’expected standard’. Unless something has gone badly wrong with his maths in 18 months I’d expect him to be middle set at a non selective school.

He will have targets set based on the data, probably a grade 5 for GCSE, which bottom set may not be aiming for. Worth raising with his teacher I think.

Original poster
boinoo · 27/01/2026 20:37

@modgepodge that's good to know. Thank you

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GreenHuia · 27/01/2026 23:36

boinoo · 26/01/2026 19:00

Thanks, good points. Always happy to work with them. No problem there. I know teaching isn't easy, I just never know when to step in.

Show quote history

As a teacher (admittedly primary not secondary teaching a much larger number of students), I always welcome parents to get in touch with questions or concerns. I'd hate to think a student or parent was worrying about something when I could put their mind at ease, or make a change if it was something I wasn't aware of or had overlooked. You know your son best, please always advocate for him! As long as you approach the school with respect and go in with questions not accusations, no one should mind you getting in touch. Good luck!

ClawsandEffect · 27/01/2026 23:52

It could be that maths and English are streamed together (illogical I know because children are often great at one and bad at the other) and therefore he can't go up because his English isn't good enough.

Original poster
boinoo · 28/01/2026 08:59

ClawsandEffect · 27/01/2026 23:52

It could be that maths and English are streamed together (illogical I know because children are often great at one and bad at the other) and therefore he can't go up because his English isn't good enough.

His English grammar, punctuation, vocabulary and spelling was 110 and his English reading was 113.

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Araminta1003 · 28/01/2026 09:21

Did he do Cat4? Do you have the scores? It would be helpful for you to know whether he has more of a verbal reasoning brain so will be good at languages, humanities etc and unlikely to do Science and Maths to a high level.
He may be good at algebra and perfectly capable of a 6/7 at GCSE.

TreadSoftlyOnMyDreams · 28/01/2026 09:40

I would ask for a meeting ahead of parents evening. Or raise it there and ask for a meeting to discuss further.
It is likely that the bottom set will do foundation maths or they will create 4 sets for GCSE's. Ideally you want to understand where he sits in regard to year 9. Will they review all the sets again for the start of that window?

We were in a similar position, with extra tutoring to support from year 8 and my DC was moved up at the end of year 10 with one year to go in GCSE's. Has gone from top of lowest set to bottom of middle [4 in total] but wants to do higher maths which wasn't an option in bottom set of 4. Confidence has definitely taken a knock and teaching style with new teacher really isn't helping. If the current teacher is working for him and he can work to the level he wants for his GCSE's personally I'd leave well enough alone.

CatatonicLadybug · 28/01/2026 10:26

In your discussion, ask for targets. You are flying blind right now while the teacher has all the info, because the teacher will know the few top kids with a likely chance of moving up but you won’t know where your child sits in that mix.

‘DS would really like to aim for moving up a set, either during this year or by the start of year 9 at the very least. Is this a realistic goal? If so, what targets should he be working toward in order to achieve it?’

Write them down then and there.

This will help you find any concepts that are holding him back and then work on those with the tutor. If the tutor and you feel the targets are met and no move has happened, email the teacher recalling the target setting conversation and ask for an update.

You rarely know which teacher is doing the setting nor what method they are using. When I was setting children for another core subject, it was very difficult to listen to (and appease) the number of parents who would just ask for their child to be moved up but when parents and students showed an interest in actually working toward a move, everybody saw a benefit and they almost always followed through and earned the move. It’s also a great life lesson for the student to work toward that goal and have it pay off in such a clear way.

Newbutoldfather · 28/01/2026 10:36

As a teacher, it sounds strange that he has been kept down if he objectively did better than other pupils in his class who went up.

When we set, we have a fixed number who go up or down (say, in a class of 24, top two go up and bottom two go down) but, then, maybe more go up or down depending on other tests, class work, CATs and teacher’s opinion. It is a discussion between the teachers. But we have to be able to justify our decisions to parents.

If your son is achieving at the top of the set and is bored and actively seeking more challenge, it is perfectly appropriate to ask if he move up. Evidence is really powerful here.

However, in year 8, if a parent made a reasonable request, I think it would e reasonable to move them up and give them a try (at the appropriate time).

yikesanotherbooboo · 28/01/2026 10:49

I usually think that being top of the bottom set is better than being bottom of the top set . The only reason that I would move a quieter child up would be if their class is genuinely being given less challenging goals .

Musicaltheatremum · 28/01/2026 10:57

My daughter was moved to top set maths in P7 (Scotland) she really struggled. Got her back down again and then into middle sets in senior school. She thrived and got an A at Intermediate 2 (old qualification slightly higher than standard grade). Hope teacher gives you some good explanation

BrownTroutBluesAgain · 28/01/2026 11:05

modgepodge · 27/01/2026 19:23

103 is the national average, and just few points off the ’expected standard’. Unless something has gone badly wrong with his maths in 18 months I’d expect him to be middle set at a non selective school.

He will have targets set based on the data, probably a grade 5 for GCSE, which bottom set may not be aiming for. Worth raising with his teacher I think.

Show quote history

I wonder then if this is a class size issue
Perhaps the middle set is full

perhaps lots of kids are working just above average

Bottom set in one school could be similar to middle set in another

OP I’d ask what level bottom set are working towards

BrownTroutBluesAgain · 28/01/2026 11:06

Newbutoldfather · 28/01/2026 10:36

As a teacher, it sounds strange that he has been kept down if he objectively did better than other pupils in his class who went up.

When we set, we have a fixed number who go up or down (say, in a class of 24, top two go up and bottom two go down) but, then, maybe more go up or down depending on other tests, class work, CATs and teacher’s opinion. It is a discussion between the teachers. But we have to be able to justify our decisions to parents.

If your son is achieving at the top of the set and is bored and actively seeking more challenge, it is perfectly appropriate to ask if he move up. Evidence is really powerful here.

However, in year 8, if a parent made a reasonable request, I think it would e reasonable to move them up and give them a try (at the appropriate time).

A test is just that
One moment in time

Other kids may have been doing better throughout the year

Original poster
boinoo · 28/01/2026 15:41

Araminta1003 · 28/01/2026 09:21

Did he do Cat4? Do you have the scores? It would be helpful for you to know whether he has more of a verbal reasoning brain so will be good at languages, humanities etc and unlikely to do Science and Maths to a high level.
He may be good at algebra and perfectly capable of a 6/7 at GCSE.

I don't recall this. Are parents party to these results as standard? I can't remember cat4 test

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