Difficulties with schools, various discussion's

[SharpLeader]

I'm just putting it out there, civil discussion's. Secondary Schools are not supporting our children, with the expectancy to comply with all their Rules and Sanctions while some staff do not, where does the superiority come from? What do you search for when looking for schools? Fighting a system for children to be educated. What rules/sanctions do you disagree with? Whats your experience?

Tell us you experience and thinking OP.

Can you elaborate please

the expectancy to comply with all their Rules and Sanctions while some staff do not

Interested to know what you mean by this? Staff do not have to follow the same rules as students, obviously. To take an obvious example, staff at a school will have a dress code, but will not have to wear school uniform. Could you explain a bit more what the issue is?

Noted on clothing of course. Behaviour of teachers towards students, a student will be sanctioned for their behaviour while a member of staff will not, it is on record. Your views please😁

Tbh the things that students do to be sanctioned are unlikely to be an issue for staff. Not doing HW, being late to class, talking over the teacher, violence, poor behaviour with equipment – unlikely or impossible that a staff member would do these things.

If you mean a staff member (say) repeatedly swearing at a student then I would expect something to be done. Or are you talking about violence against students? Again, this would be sanctioned. Tho I have to say in my years as a classroom teacher, while sadly I witnessed swearing and violence from students, I never saw it the other way round.

Teachers, like any employee, are subject to certain rules. But of course they are different from those that students at the school are subject to. What sort of thing do you mean?

where does the superiority come from

Generally from teachers being adult employees in a position of responsibility with the authority to direct pupils to follow reasonable instructions.

Without clear examples it is difficult to understand what your problem is.

Well I mean teachers verbally abusing students, do they get sanctioned, what kind?

Eh?

Depends on if it is reported, and it depends on what was said.

Sometimes a kid says 'verbal abuse' and actually they mean 'telling off'.

Superiority....Some have shown this to parents and students with intimation tactics, So I ask has anyone come across this behaviour in situations?

Perhaps you should just say what has actually happened if that is what you want opinions on.

It’s called an HR process and if you report the school will investigate and act appropriately.

my experience is that I’ve had amazing conversations with secondary teachers and leadership (3 teenage daughters). Only one teacher I wasn’t happy with their patronising response and I escalated to the head of dept who called me, apologised and sorted the issue. We clearly have different experiences.

Bloody hell, I pity teachers more and more on a daily basis when I read nonsense like this.
Imagine actually telling kids to behave so they don't disrupt others, how horribly abusive 🙄

Perhaps, I see that. What if it is reported, it's direct abuse and discriminatory. A student would be sanctioned immediately but for staff that is not so (report) little chat.

Define what this 'verbal abuse' actually was?

As Noble says, it really depends.

I have never sworn at a student; I think if a staff member was abusive to a student and swore at them and about them then it should be escalated and would be dealt with by senior management. It would very much depend on what actually happened tho. IME it's very rare for teachers to swear at students (as I say, I have never witnessed nor been aware of it). Worrying about this as a possibility would not be top of my list.
If a teacher is being persistently verbally abusive to my child I would raise it with the school, as described by @TeenLifeMum

I don't understand what you mean by the superiority tbh - yes can you give an actual example?

Yes, teachers can be ‘sanctioned’ following an evidence based complaint. This follows the school complaints process on the school website and involves governors and a formal process. Would also involve HR, LA or trust.

You wouldn't know about it @SharpLeader as this is confidential. What do you do for a living? Would you expect your customers or colleagues to know if you have been disciplined at work?

However, for very serious misconduct and through this process, teachers can be struck off. This is published and freely available.

Government document - teacher misconduct

Government Process

Outcome of hearings

Direct Discrimination/Racial abuse from a teacher/school to a student year 8.
Complaint made. Intimation and Superiority tactic's by staff to parent (patronising and condescending).
Where a student exhibits behaviour such as this, they face strict sanctions that must be complied with, yet if a teacher does the same, it is dismissed as jest or addressed informally with a brief chat and put on report

What if the School did not follow their own policies and guidelines?

Helping kids with placement of apostrophes would be a start.

What actually happened OP?

That's a good point. You can request for extra resources to support the child, bitesize is very helpful

Staff are different to students.

If a student is talking while a teacher is talking then as a teacher you can ask them to be quiet.

A student is not expected to ask the teacher to be quiet while they are talking and it is considered rude to do so.

Equally, neither staff nor students should be hitting anyone or racially abusing anyone and I would expect both to be sanctioned in these circumstances. Teachers might receive a written warning or similar. Students would receive isolation etc.

The consequences are different because staff are employed and students are not.

There is a procedure to follow. Look up the complaints procedure and follow it.
It’s my experience that teachers do not get away with this stuff, but… you will not be party to what has happened. The processes and punishments are confidential (and when you consider the right to reply and appeal which need to exist, the process can be long).

"Staff are different to students"

There is the discrepancy that creates the imbalance in accountability, that is double standards.