Anyone get their child out of playing rugby? (head injury concern)

[BarqsHasBite]

Just that really - am determined that when my son moves to secondary (we are hoping to send him to an independent school) that he does not play any contact rugby, or head the ball in football though that’s less of an issue as he can just not head when he’s playing.

Has anyone tried to get their child out of playing rugby for the same reason? I’m sure someone told me that some schools have it in the parental contract that the boys will play rugby and it’s a condition of accepting a place at the school 😱

If I get pushback am hoping to find a neurologist to advise against playing rugby - is the school really going to insist on going against medical advice?
But interested to know if anyone has any experience of this.

I totally agree with him. Nowhere else in our lives do we have to accept this type of treatment, and if we are subjected to it it’s usually a matter for the police or social
services. My son’s school do rugby from year 8 and when we reach summer term I’m going to contact the Head of PE to understand what it entails and ensure it isn’t contact. I’m not sure I fancy him doing tag/touch either as I suspect there is the chance that might get quite physical too. I’m very keen on physical activity and run and do HIIT myself, but can’t see any need for contact sports.

It is in the news again today. Sports like these significantly increase the risk of dementia, MND etc.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-63133516
Rugby will have to change or be permanently banned as a sport.

I won’t allow my son to play contact rugby. He isn’t built for it and doesn’t enjoy it. He’s good at tennis and enjoys cricket, so it makes sense to focus on those.

In 1994 a school friend died after a serious injury playing rugby.

When my son started at secondary school. I made it clear to the Headteacher that he was ‘opting out’ of rugby to focus on his other sports.

Headteachers should listen to parents concerns regarding head injury risk. With the medical research on this now in the news, I believe we now have the power and opportunity to stand up to schools who continue to force children into compulsory rugby.

It’s only a matter of time before regulations change and full contact rugby will be ‘opt-in’. In the meantime, do what you feel is right for your child and talk to the school. The more parents who raise concerns and question the status quo the better.

I hated rugby too for the same reason. Mine was good at it and strongly built, so in top set/team. I kept having him put in to a lower middle team as they were less rough less contact. I was honest and said I was worried. It was the best I could do, as banning him looked OTT to others I spoke to. Thing is those people who say I am OTT don’t care like I do about ds, they won’t pay to fix his teeth or take long term consequences of broken bones. I saw some bad injuries with others and was nervous. I sent ds for a good academic education and for me the effing sports came alongside it. I know football and cricket injure too and tbh I thought they were a waste of time too

The Sunday Times is today running a series of pieces (“The Concussion Files”) about the serious neurological conditions being suffered by current and former professional players. 300 (!) such players are bringing a class action against rugby’s governing bodies. And it’s not all related to the historic approach taken to preventing and dealing with head injuries.

As one of the articles points out, there will be reluctance to make radical changes to improve the safety of the game as it may be seen as tantamount to admitting that up until now it has been quite unsafe.

Of course you can argue there are differences between school and professional rugby but reading these articles it’s much, much worse than I realised 😞

Ex-stars suing rugby for damage it did to their brains

https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/ef2fec54-bf9e-4505-b27b-38e90239b8db?shareToken=a6358479837b26c1c16a9b5a44934782

I went to a school where all boys would play rugby up to year 10 and around half would choose to play it up to year 13. They also had a number of boys in the county teams pretty much every year, and a few boys in my time at school went off to turn professional.
And I believe they've changed the game to make it safer since the 80s.

I can actually think of more injuries on the hockey pitch (girls played hockey, but not as much) than rugby. And definitely more (and more serious) car related injuries.
I've also known of broken bones and concussion from tennis on a number of occasions so even non-contact sports can have serious injuries.

I understand where you're coming from, but I would tell you to avoid a rugby playing school because, unless he has a medical condition it is going to totally mark him out if he arrives with "mummy won't let me play dangerous sports" on his back.
Otoh you may be safer with him at a only rugby playing school with rugby specialists, than playing it as one of many sports with PE teachers who didn't have the up to date knowledge.

Or send him and tell him to follow my dbro's example. One PE report was something along the lines of "If he looked towards the ball rather than away from it when it is thrown to him, then he'd do better".

I think this outdated attitude about 'mummy' belongs in the 80s!

There is no way there were more head injuries and concussions in hockey.

At DS's state high school they play tag rugby in PE, and only play contact rugby in the extra -curricular school rugby team, but even then it's non-contact up to a certain age - Y9 I think. Rugby Union is massive round here. By the time you get to contact-rugby age there are plenty of players who want to progress into the school team have been playing at grassroots level for years. I feel that the school has the right balance of caution and local culture.

Fortunately for me DS doesn't have a competitive hair on his head despite being quite sporty. He is just poor enough never to be picked for school teams! (He has other talents).

I asked the school where we are hoping to send our son - fortunately they offer tag rugby in parallel to contact rugby, including competitive tag fixtures against other schools. At no point is contact rugby obligatory, there is always a choice to do something else.

There may be broken bones and head injuries in other sports, but the point about rugby is that it is facing a tidal wave of claims from ex professional players about the effect of the head injuries later in life: chronic traumatic encephalopathy, early onset dementia, depression, behavioural changes (often leading to family breakdown), reduced life expectancy, chronic insomnia, urinary incontinence due to brain damage, memory problems, anxiety etc. There are concerns about heading the ball in football too, for similar reasons.

Of course you can argue the game is different at professional level where the frequency and impact of head injuries will be greater, given the huge size of professional players now.

But equally if the game hasn’t been kept safe at the top level, with access (in theory!) to the best research, most highly trained coaches and medics etc then why think it will be any safer at school level?

It’s hard to see how the RFU etc have been doing their jobs.

Depends on the school. Mine go to a school where if you don't want to play the main sport of the term (eg rugby) then you can do an alternative activity.
I would also add, having 2 rugby playing boys, that these days it's a lot safer and they take the risks of head trauma extremely seriously and there's little or no hard contact at younger ages. My 17 old is only playing full adult game this year for example

Sobering study from the US about the impact of contact sport on young athletes: https://www.bu.edu/articles/2023/young-amateur-athletes-at-risk-of-cte-study-finds/

notably most of the study subjects did not play at collegiate or professional levels, but still had shocking levels of brain damage. CTE can only be diagnosed post mortem, and is not proactively screened for, so most cases likely undiagnosed.

My son is at independent school in London, they send out a consent form each year for contact rugby and if you do not consent then they play touch rugby or row which I think is a nice way to do things.

At my son's independent secondary they do all play rugby in the autumn term. However, there is one class for boys who only want to play tag rugby and those that are in that group don't play any matches against other schools.

My son didn't want to play rugby - his school were hyper competitive with inter-school rugby matches etc. He just made sure he was so bad at it that he was put in the bottom group who basically were allowed to just kick the rugby ball around because the teachers were too busy with the first and second team that they let the bottom group do what they wanted. A good result for him!!

I'm glad the consensus of this thread is that rugby is really dangerous. People have focused on the physical injury side, but the effect of concussion on the brain is equally serious, and potentially life long. People should be told that concussion can damage the pituitary gland, the 'master gland' that controls many bodily systems. If the pituitary doesn't produce the hormones it needs to, the effects can be heart problems, osteoporosis, chronic fatigue, obesity, brain fog, memory loss, depression, anxiety. According to this research the risk of suicide is tripled after concussion. Teasdale TW, Engberg AW, Suicide after traumatic brain injury: a population study, J Neurol Neurosurg, Psychiatry 2001) jnnp.bmj.com/content/71/4/436.full

I have older boys. I didn't really want my son to play rugby either. But he did and he loved it. He seems to have survived it so far

I will warn you that the opinion of peers becomes so much more important in secondary and most boys of that age want to run with the pack. They do not want attention on themselves for any reason as that can become something they get teased about.

So, what you are proposing is doing is likely to be unpopular with your son (unless he is really not at all sporty) and also be aware what you are doing may jeopardise his social standing.

(And to be clear: I am not condoning this in any way. It stinks. I am just describing what happens).

Yikes, yet another reason to avoid it! I hadn’t heard this.

@parsely you raise a good point. It could change when he gets to secondary, but my son has told me (unprompted by me) that he doesn’t want to play contact rugby but is very happy to do tag rugby which he’s done in PE a few times. He’s not massively sporty and is very slight so could literally be crushed by bigger boys.

The fact that they have enough boys playing tag rugby to field at least one Y7 competitive team makes me think he wouldn’t be a massive outlier if he didn’t play the contact version. Here’s hoping anyway!

Yes, tag rugby sounds a much better option! I hope it works out for him.

From todays’s Times:

“Rugby in schools is a form of child abuse, say sports experts”

https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/43a86816-1553-457c-8393-8e35625540f2?shareToken=d92f8b778fa653086d8e73c49ec6e60a

It's recommendations apply only to children, not adults, and acknowledges the difference between contact sports that aim for incapacitation and those such as rugby in which loss of consciousness is an undesirable consequence of the nature of the game.

So not just about rugby, infact less about rugby and more about the sports which encourage blows to the head, and then a part lifted to gain media interest.

I am not playing down head injuries, and as much as I think rugby should be played in school I do not think it should be compulsory contact, tag/touch rugby is preferable for many students. But contact should be allowed for those that want it.