How much work should year 11 be doing?

[SummerDuck]

So DS2 is going into year 11 next year and is probably your typical bright but lazy teenager. Very capable of achieving a good number of 8s and 9s next year with effort but equally would be happy to scrape by if left to his own devices.

Me and DH have agreed that we want to implement some more structure to his studying next year- i.e. handing over his phone when he gets in from school until some homework and revision has been completed.

What we can’t agree on is how much work he should be doing. I’m inclined to say he should be starting with 2.5 hours of homework/revision on school nights and then 3 hours a day at weekends, but DH thinks this is far too little.

So to parents of DC who have just left year 11- how much work did your DC aiming for top grades do?

I think 2.5 hours per school night is too much tbh. I’m sure his school will be giving homework/revision so perhaps wait and see how heavy that workload is.

I also believe it should be child led and that as parents we can encourage, incentivise and facilitate but not force.

I say this as a parent of a now year 13 child so I’ve been through it recently but also as a former GCSE exams officer who has seen many children forced into unrealistic revision schedules who then burn out and fail with during GCSE or more commonly, at A level.

The children who go on to thrive after GCSE were not hand held too tightly through them.

No way did mine do 2.5 hrs per night or 3 on the weekend. They were far too busy doing other things. They worked hard in school and did their HW, but that was pretty much it.

I think handing in the phone can sometimes cause resentment, rather than building the trust, structure and resilience they actually need.

Tbh, if they are a typical smart but lazy child, they work really well under their own pressure. Something myself and my siblings all experienced.

I'm a secondary a school maths teacher though and do understand that between year 10 and 11 is super important, but honestly, over summer, they need that mental break. As long as they can get structure and discipline in when they return, not a huge load of revision is needed now. Stress can cause more issues

I also think 2.5 hours a night is a lot. Just asked DD (who did GCSEs in 2017) and she says just do your HW until you get to mocks (in Jan at her school). HW on its own should surely be about 10 items a week (= 10 subjects) and maybe 30 mins or 1 hour max per subject. I taught MFL and if all my yr 11s spent half an hour a week on HW (eg vocab revision or a writing exercise) I would be happy with that.

DD did say that it might be helpful to start writing revision cards on (for example) geography case studies or Eng lit books already covered.

But honestly, 4 - 6.30 on HW, then dinner and time to relax - not going to leave any time for other activities. My younger two did lots of stuff after school - sports practice, Scouts, drama - which would not have been possible with that kind of schedule. They both did really well in their exams btw.

Too much pressure is not helpful IMHO - and a set "HW/revision time" does not mean that a student is actually getting anything meaningful done. What does your DS think about all this?

Nowhere near as much as that. YABU, never mind your son's prison warden father.

There is nothing to be gained from being confined to barracks every evening and weekend, other than complete overload by Christmas.

My dd is going into Y11 next year. If she did 2 hours a day Mon-Thu then 3 hours on either Saturday/Sunday then I’d be really happy happy. However, my dd is motivated and independent so those expectations are high. For less motivated students, I think keeping on top of all homework (including assessment/mocks preparation) would be a good goal.

My dd did a lot more than that. I think you really have to but the work in if they are capable of good results.

@flowerchop

We are happy for him to have the summer off but want him to be more disciplined when he goes back to school.

DH is from a country where DC work extremely hard at school so thinks this is the year to get DS’s nose to the grindstone. I can see where he’s coming from to an extent.

Can I ask how you know this as an exams officer? Anecdotal or have you actual evidence to show that parents who clamp down have children who perform less well at a level or gcse? Because my very anecdotal evidence suggests the exact opposite for bright but lazy kids😀

Just from watching them move through sixth form. The drop out/burn out was always children who’d been forced into the extreme revision. Children in year 11 would often talk about this and they were also the parents nagging teachers for extra work.

The children who wanted it for themselves and who’d learned hard work paid off never seemed to do this.

Add in the fact that the jump from GCSE to A levels is the biggest of all, these children resented their forced GCSE path and couldn’t handle the necessary self discipline and independent study that A levels need.

So anecdotal yes. But a pattern of children and overly involved parents I saw too often.

@SummerDuck out of interest, if your DH thinks 2.5 hours a night is far too little, how much does he suggest?

Does your DS do any evening extra-curricular activities?

@clary

DH wants him doing 3.5-4 hours a night and 6 hours a day at weekends, with more closer to mocks and exams.

Wow good luck with that 😳

I think your DH's expectations are very unreasonable.
If you ask that from September then he will either burn out or just down tools.
Even that amount in Easter holidays would be a good ask.

It's not the hours, it's the quality anyway.

Does he have revision cards / mind maps for topics covered so far? That would be my starting point. Then keeping up with them, and revising well for tests / mocks. Revision for mocks - a proper revision timetable.

y11 is a marathon, they need to pace themselves. There needs to be mini peaks and some rests. You can't run a marathon at sprinting speed.

Wow. I mean assuming he gets home from school around 4pm, say 30 mins for a snack and a drink, then work till 8.30? Dinner and then 30 mins to chill? Every evening? For the next seven months? Nope that's not going to fly. Listen to @TeenDivided who, as ever, speaks sense.

If you want a very stressed anxious and depressed teen then you're going the right way about it.

Y11 is a long slog and starting with a schedule that offers not one single day off studying will lead to burn-out. It's too much.

How many sets of mocks does he have? That sort of schedule in the direct run-up to mocks would possibly be ok, but outside of that he should certainly have one weekend day clear of work, and I would suggest also Friday night. It's also important to make sure that he is maintaining some hobbies/social life and has time to exercise.

Most importantly, any revision time should be productive and planned, not 'oh, I'm meant to be revising now, what should I do? I'll read a couple of pages of my biology textbook'.

As a teacher, I think this is a terrible idea!
There's a long way to go until the end of the exam series and students burn out. I set an hour and a half max a week until January, and then suggest up to 2.5 hours of revision activities per week thereafter. Even the hardest working can't sustain the kind of work rate your husband is suggesting.

2.5 hours a week for your subject is still quite a lot, MrsH, given the number of subjects they do.

DS does do swimming, which he will continue so there will be some balance. I think DH mainly doesn’t want him having lots of time to play Xbox or watch Netflix.

Is your DH going to help him structure the work that he does?

He should absolutely have some time to play Xbox or watch Netflix though.

Is he a competitive swimmer? That shouldn't count as downtime!

Is this a wind up! Poor kid! There’s more to life than studying for hours in year 11 … where’s the sport, the socialising. There has to be a balance.

He will resent you guys!

As a former academic deputy head, I can say with some confidence that if he actually does all the homework he’s set properly, as opposed to doing the minimum to get by, he will (a) be in a significant minority and (b) have out in the groundwork necessary to achieve genuine revision rather than playing catch-up.

Are you joking? That's far too much. When is his rest day? I think during the week he should do his homework and that's it! At the weekend, homework and organise his notes, however long that takes,

You will not help him by micromanaging his time