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Secondary education

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APPEAL TOMORROW!!

113 replies

Hye000 · 11/05/2023 22:06

We have our appeal tomorrow and I am absolutely scared to death, so worried and just petrified it’s not going to go our way. Two other families we know who have had there appeal already, aren’t convinced it was worth while and one family have been offered a place for a school that was on their list so I am guessing there appeal won’t be upheld if the panel have offered a place elsewhere. I’m worried my emotions are going to get in the way and also worried how to summarise my case when my time comes to speak 😩😭

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prh47bridge · 20/05/2023 23:13

Hye000 · 20/05/2023 22:03

@PatriciaHolm @prh47bridge is it possible for the Headteacher to overturn one of the panel’s decisions after it has been made??

I have heard through the grapevine that one set of parents who have appealed, they know the headteacher of the appealed school and the child’s grandmother used to work at the school (retired last October). Apparently the Headteacher has assured the parents “he will do everything he can to get the child in”.

is there anything he can actually do? If he argues this child’s case would that cause all the appellants to be delayed in getting an answer or is there nothing he can realistically do?,

Within the Admissions Code, there is nothing the head can do. However, it is not unknown for heads of schools that are their own admission authority to ignore the Admissions Code and admit a child that isn't at the head of the waiting list. The head definitely cannot reverse an appeal panel's decision to admit a child.

knotordinary · 21/05/2023 07:51

prh47bridge · 20/05/2023 23:13

Within the Admissions Code, there is nothing the head can do. However, it is not unknown for heads of schools that are their own admission authority to ignore the Admissions Code and admit a child that isn't at the head of the waiting list. The head definitely cannot reverse an appeal panel's decision to admit a child.

Prh47bridge, it may not be "unknown" but it certainly isn't ethical, and it would require the school's admissions officer, and potentially governors (if the "exceptional circumstances" route was used) to conspire with the Head. So, please don't encourage anyone to assume that has happened! People who run schools are usually highly principled, as are people who sit on appeals panels.

prh47bridge · 21/05/2023 08:46

knotordinary · 21/05/2023 07:51

Prh47bridge, it may not be "unknown" but it certainly isn't ethical, and it would require the school's admissions officer, and potentially governors (if the "exceptional circumstances" route was used) to conspire with the Head. So, please don't encourage anyone to assume that has happened! People who run schools are usually highly principled, as are people who sit on appeals panels.

I am not encouraging anyone to assume that is what happened. It is not only unethical, it is unlawful as it is a breach of the Admissions Code. I agree that most heads wouldn't do this, but I have come across cases where this has happened. And the question I was answering was whether there is anything the head can do.

NeverDropYourMooncup · 21/05/2023 15:11

prh47bridge · 20/05/2023 23:13

Within the Admissions Code, there is nothing the head can do. However, it is not unknown for heads of schools that are their own admission authority to ignore the Admissions Code and admit a child that isn't at the head of the waiting list. The head definitely cannot reverse an appeal panel's decision to admit a child.

It's also not unknown for harassed heads to say 'Oh, I'll see what I can do' to get people off their case, knowing that in reality, there is no way on earth they're instructing the much put upon Admissions person to break Admissions Law and keep it secret so that Governors do not find out about it (as the Clerk/Governance Professional would also be obliged to report the lawbreaking, never mind the Governors themselves).

As it is, Governors on a ranking committee withdraw specifically when they have knowledge of a particular candidate - including the Headteacher - even when the rankings have been anonymised, just it case it could be interpreted as sitting on the committee without withdrawal, even when the list is anonymised, is dodgy/a conflict of interest - and whoever is actually responsible for handling the applications in school would be making it known if they are being pressured by anybody.

Hye000 · 22/05/2023 11:33

@PatriciaHolm @prh47bridge I have been told by one of the other families appealing that they called LA today and they have said they will send results in order of appeal hearing dates and will be sent in the next 3/4days. Is this right? Is this allowed? I thought they all had to be sent at the same time! Today is the 5th school day so it’s the deadline?! I feel like they keep moving the goal posts

OP posts:
ElinoristhenewEnid · 22/05/2023 11:56

educationhub.blog.gov.uk/2023/03/07/secondary-school-offer-appeals-everything-you-need-to-know/

On this link it states that it may take longer than 5 school days for results if there are a lot of appeals.

prh47bridge · 22/05/2023 11:58

There is nothing that specifically says all appeal letters must be sent at the same time, but they should all be sent by the fifth school day following the final hearing unless there is a good reason.

PatriciaHolm · 22/05/2023 12:07

As prh says, the code says " The panel must communicate the decision of each appeal, including the reasons for that decision, in writing to the appellant, the admission authority and the local authority. The clerk or chair must sign the decision letter and send it to the parties as soon as possible after the hearing but not later than five school days, unless there is good reason."

Realistically, good practise means they should be sent together, but that's not stated in the code.

Hye000 · 22/05/2023 13:12

I just called the appeals officer and she told me that the decision were being sent out one at a time but they had so many calls and complaints to the council and school that the school stopped anymore being sent out until all hearings had been heard and now there is a back log of letters to be sent out because of this, so they are sending them out in order of when you had your appeal (we were one of the last, great!) I don’t know how much more of this I can take, we are flying out of the country this week and may not even get an answer before then.

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prh47bridge · 22/05/2023 13:37

This is crazy and implies a huge breach of the Appeals Code. Send the Appeals Officer an email setting out what she has just told you so that you've got it in writing. If you lose, you can use this to try and get a fresh hearing as it clearly implies that the panel were making decisions as they went along, which is not allowed. They should not have made any decisions until all appeals had been heard.

Hye000 · 22/05/2023 14:51

prh47bridge · 22/05/2023 13:37

This is crazy and implies a huge breach of the Appeals Code. Send the Appeals Officer an email setting out what she has just told you so that you've got it in writing. If you lose, you can use this to try and get a fresh hearing as it clearly implies that the panel were making decisions as they went along, which is not allowed. They should not have made any decisions until all appeals had been heard.

I am also aware that the other parents from the school my DC attends, they had different panel members so if they were making decisions as they go along but then the rules changed for my appeal for example with different appeal panel. This will have an impact on the next panels decisions if some appeals have already been upheld. It’s an absolute circus!

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NatM70 · 22/05/2023 15:01

Hye000 · 22/05/2023 14:51

I am also aware that the other parents from the school my DC attends, they had different panel members so if they were making decisions as they go along but then the rules changed for my appeal for example with different appeal panel. This will have an impact on the next panels decisions if some appeals have already been upheld. It’s an absolute circus!

@Hye000
I've been waiting for your news.
I can't believe you're having to go through this.
It doesn't sound right at all.
As if it isn't stressful enough!

prh47bridge · 22/05/2023 16:36

Hye000 · 22/05/2023 14:51

I am also aware that the other parents from the school my DC attends, they had different panel members so if they were making decisions as they go along but then the rules changed for my appeal for example with different appeal panel. This will have an impact on the next panels decisions if some appeals have already been upheld. It’s an absolute circus!

Admission authorities are required to take all reasonable steps to ensure that all appeals for a particular school are heard by the same panel. It increasingly feels like this school is making it up as it goes along.

Hye000 · 22/05/2023 17:41

prh47bridge · 22/05/2023 16:36

Admission authorities are required to take all reasonable steps to ensure that all appeals for a particular school are heard by the same panel. It increasingly feels like this school is making it up as it goes along.

Who is the relevant person or team that I could I make a complaint to about all of this?? I can’t imagine how many different panels they must of had if the two families that I know personally had different people, they clearly haven’t stuck to the appeals code in many areas

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prh47bridge · 22/05/2023 17:57

There isn't anything you can do at the moment. However, if you lose your appeal you can refer the matter to the LGO if it is a community, VA or VC school, or the DfE if it is an academy.

Hye000 · 22/05/2023 20:44

prh47bridge · 22/05/2023 17:57

There isn't anything you can do at the moment. However, if you lose your appeal you can refer the matter to the LGO if it is a community, VA or VC school, or the DfE if it is an academy.

I would like to make a complaint either way, I think how they have handled this whole process has been a shambles

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prh47bridge · 22/05/2023 21:17

I'm not sure you can. The LGO will get involved with cases after an unsuccessful appeal. I suspect the same is true of the DfE.

SheilaFentiman · 23/05/2023 10:47

I really hope you hear soon, OP

Hye000 · 23/05/2023 12:19

SheilaFentiman · 23/05/2023 10:47

I really hope you hear soon, OP

Thank you @SheilaFentiman ❤️ one of the families from our school who had there’s two days before us have had an email.. they were unsuccessful 😔 xx

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NatM70 · 23/05/2023 14:25

Hye000 · 23/05/2023 12:19

Thank you @SheilaFentiman ❤️ one of the families from our school who had there’s two days before us have had an email.. they were unsuccessful 😔 xx

@Hye000
Do you know their circumstances?

Hye000 · 23/05/2023 14:26

NatM70 · 23/05/2023 14:25

@Hye000
Do you know their circumstances?

Both same arguments pretty much. Had put that particular school as first choice, was convenient for travel, friends are going there etc etc

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NatM70 · 23/05/2023 14:39

Hye000 · 23/05/2023 14:26

Both same arguments pretty much. Had put that particular school as first choice, was convenient for travel, friends are going there etc etc

@Hye000
Do you have any letters of support why this is the only school for your child?

Hye000 · 23/05/2023 15:03

NatM70 · 23/05/2023 14:39

@Hye000
Do you have any letters of support why this is the only school for your child?

Yes I had two with the appeal and her HCP attended the appeal and re-iterated what she had said in her letter and answered questions from the panel too

OP posts:
NatM70 · 23/05/2023 15:11

Hye000 · 23/05/2023 15:03

Yes I had two with the appeal and her HCP attended the appeal and re-iterated what she had said in her letter and answered questions from the panel too

@Hye000
That's evidence at least.
They might just not have had the evidence they needed for their appeal?

Hye000 · 23/05/2023 15:22

NatM70 · 23/05/2023 15:11

@Hye000
That's evidence at least.
They might just not have had the evidence they needed for their appeal?

Yes I assume not. They didn’t apply on medical & social so I guess there was no evidence they could provide x

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