APPEAL TOMORROW!!

[Hye000]

We have our appeal tomorrow and I am absolutely scared to death, so worried and just petrified it’s not going to go our way. Two other families we know who have had there appeal already, aren’t convinced it was worth while and one family have been offered a place for a school that was on their list so I am guessing there appeal won’t be upheld if the panel have offered a place elsewhere. I’m worried my emotions are going to get in the way and also worried how to summarise my case when my time comes to speak 😩😭

The HCP needs to make it clear that school x is uniquely able to cater for your child's needs.

I'm a presenting officer. Lots of HCP letters say "Junior needs a small school, with good pastoral care, etc" without saying why our school is the only one capable of meeting those needs. Some do add a form of words along the lines of "therefore, in my opinion, School X is the best school for Junior", but that still doesn't necessarily meet our threshold, because nearby School Y is also small, undersubscribed, and has pastoral staff too. Yes, our School X may currently have a stronger team of pastoral staff than School Y, but that is no different to saying we have a stronger maths department than them, and certainly does not make our school uniquely capable of meeting Junior's pastoral needs.

We also get HCP letters which parrot whatever the parent has told them without applying their own knowledge or even their critical thinking skills, e.g. "School X is the best for Junior because it has a low noise environment." It doesn't - it's a school.

My point is that it is not the form of words that is important, but the strength of the rationale.

I appreciate that but they didn’t say it was the strength of rationale or that the letter didn’t express the need of the school enough etc. even when I questioned her on the fact that it’s down to words, she didn’t elaborate and say, well it’s not just that it’s that the letter didn’t expressly say that that school could give your child xyz and there is no other schools that can etc. I think it’s a dangerous game to write children off down to the lack of detail in a letter from HCP’s who may have never wrote a letter like this before and have no idea what they are supposed to say or do. If this were any other criteria it wouldn’t be as detrimental as making decisions on behalf of child who are already at a disadvantage if they are needing to apply on medical and social grounds

The threshold for Exceptional Circumstances is very high, and schools have to apply it fairly and equally to all. It is not like an appeal, where the balance if arguments can be considered, and the panel can look into parents' eyes while they elaborate on their case and (sometimes) add crucial details that swing the decision. A school's Execeptional Circumstance panel only has your documents in front of them, nothing more, and must apply the policy to the letter. They can't "read between the lines" or embelish arguments on your behalf. Some rejections are painful because we know the case is probably stronger than it appears from the documents. We hope those parents will appeal, so they get their chance to ellaborate and be questioned about the circumstances, but it would be unethical for us to tell them that.

... just to add ... many schools don't have Exceptional Circumstances criteria. Where it exists, it is best to think of it as a "fast track" to avoiding an appeal for the strongest and best documented cases. It has a higher bar than the appeal process.

The school we are appealing for removed the exceptional social/medical criteria for the first time this year typically :-( And they had admitted about 3 children each year under that criteria previously.

Yes, many schools are removing it, because it takes so much time from staff who are already stretched to breaking point. When it works well it saves time, because it avoids cases going to appeal. But the vast majority of cases are too weak to meet the threshold, and then many of the rejections end up lodging appeals anyway.

@Hye000

I only had one document stating they believed school X was the best one for my child's needs.
It was from the school's psychotherapist and mental health lead.
Our GP have me a letter with diagnosis, but stated 'mum believes school X is better suited for...'
I knew the letter from the GP wasn't enough as even though they confirmed diagnosis, they put 'mum believes', and it has to be their opinion, not mine.
I had CAMHS referrals, which whilst they cannot recommend a certain school, they did write that my child needed a graduated plan at the very least, and an advanced transition to secondary school.
So really, I only had the one letter from the current school's psychotherapist, with supporting documents from other professionals making recommendations and saying 'mum believes...', but the panel assured me (I did check this with them) that I had provided enough evidence.
I'll find out this coming work.
Wishing you so much luck with yours.

Fingers crossed for you, please let me know. We find out this week coming also 🙏🏽 xx

@Hye000
Thank you, I will let you know.
Really hope you win.
You have a document naming the school and that bears weight.
Please let my know too!

Will do hun, I had the healthcare professional who wrote one of our support letters actually attend the Teams appeal hearing so I’m praying that they listened to her concerns even if they didn’t 100% believe mine 🙏🏽 will update here as soon as I know!! Just want to put my daughter out of her misery. Praying for you and your DC ❤️ xx

That should be enough. They need a professional to state that they think school X is the right one for your child, so if that happened at the hearing it is as good as having it in the written appeal. You don't need a document if the professional stated that in person for you in front of the panel.
My experience was that they tried really hard for me, and asked questions that helped to enhance my appeal.
The PO didn't ask any questions at the individual hearing, just the panel.
Really got everything crossed for you 💖

@NatM70 any news for you yet?? This week has dragged so bad. Still not heard anything, constantly checking my emails! It’s driving me insane. I’m coming up with mad theories in my head thinking that they are saving all the “No’s” until last… praying it comes tomorrow AM 🙏🏽🙏🏽🙏🏽

Hiya @Hye000

Yes, I found out late this afternoon...WE WON!!!!!!
This has been the longest ten days of my life so I totally get that.
I was told it would be tomorrow I would hear, but they sent the email today.
Thank goodness, my nerves are wrecked 🤣
Haha, I get that, I did the same.
Hearing so late doesn't mean anything - all parents must find out at the same time. If you've won you won't find out before those who haven't.
I was doubting everything and worrying myself silly. Which was futile as the hearing had been and gone so there was nothing I could do...I guess I just like torturing myself.
When did they tell you that you could expect to hear by?
I waited ten very very very long days 🤣🙈

OMG NatM70!!! I’m so so so pleased for you! I bet it’s been the longest wait but so worth it for that outcome at the end. Parent win!! Good for you ❤️ your DC must be so pleased (probably not as pleased as you thought!).

I just find out tomorrow latest so my nerves are just creeping even more than they already are, I just keep running through everything in my head, second guessing what they were asking questions about and how they felt about my answers. Praying so hard for my daughter, she really needs this!

so happy for you and your DC, I know how much this means to you guys ❤️❤️❤️

I can’t believe you are all having to wait so long. I thought you had to be told within 5 school days. Or is it 5 school days from when the last appeal is heard. Our hearings are Mon- Tues next week and the panel will decide on the Thursday, so I was hoping we might hear on the Friday, but who knows. It’s half term straight after so I hope they don’t keep us waiting until after then 😬

@Hye000
Thanks so much!
Absolutely over the moon.
Every day has seemed like a month!
Checking emails every few minutes, it has been very hard.
My boy is absolutely thrilled to bits.
It's like a weight's been lifted.
I was the same as you and analysing everything over and over.
But I felt the panel really tried to help me rather than hinder me. They suggested things that helped my case, I couldn't have wished for a better panel. They really seemed to care about what was best for my boy.
I'm really praying for you too, I really am 💖
Please let me know!

I've waited 10 days.
The appeals were over three days (I was heard on the first day, 9/5) and they had to let us know five working days after the end of all appeals, so tomorrow was the latest date, but they let us know today.
They have to decide, then write up comprehensive detailed letters to all parents - given the length of the deciding letter I received today, I can see why it takes so long.
But the waiting is so so hard!!

@SuperSue77 our appeal school has had 3 weeks of appeals! I’m so glad we were one of the last as I would have been an inpatient somewhere by now… seriously!! First appeal was 3rd May!!! Last was 15th so they have until Monday latest but when I called they said we should hear by the end of the week which is today 🥴🫤🫣 I’ve turned my notifications on for my emails because I’m just checking constantly, it’s taking over my life. I’m going on holiday next week and I haven’t sorted anything because I just don’t have the brain power to think of anything else until I know! I never want to have to go through this again, it has been horrendous!

Totally agree, every day does feel like a month! So glad it’s not just me that’s felt like that and been constantly checking my emails and stuff. Really don’t want to get my hopes up but same as you I felt like the panel were asking good questions and really trying to get to know my daughter. Even asked how she would cope in the allocated school as it’s such a big school etc. will let you know later hopefully! 🤞🏽🙏🏽 xxxxx

The panel can't make any decisions until they have heard all the cases, so 5 school days from when the last appeal is heard.

@Hye000
I think it is only natural when something means so much to you.
That sounds positive.
They really tried very hard to get a picture of my child - Even my husband who managed to join me for stage 2, and who is a total pessimist, said he thought the panel seemed to want to enhance our case.
He went as far as to say, he thought they'd made their decision before we entered the room, and anything we said or were asked was just to strengthen our case in their minds.

Not sure if this can even happen, I know it does if you can't be present, so who knows.
My written appeal was very long though, so there may be an element of that, but that's just me speculating, and I've no idea if they can even do that.
The written decision letter I received is very comprehensive, hence why I think it took so long.h
They had to write that to every single appeal, and it was all about the school's case and my child and what they'd taken in to consideration.
To do that for over 20 appellants, I can see why we had to wait. Panels work very hard, and for free!
They didn't ask me about the allocated school, but that's because I spoke about it quite early on in the appeal and said that my child wouldn't be able to completely be removed from the bullies as he'd see them at break, lunch, and doing the same journey as them. Whereas the preferred school takes him away from that completely.
If I'd not said that, I'm sure they would have asked.
I feel really positive for you.
Please let me know as soon as you can! 🙏xx

@NatM70 just called the Appeals team at the council to check it was definitely today (they told me yesterday it would be), he told me the clerk said the school have put a stop to them being sent out today, he doesn’t know why but they will be out on Monday… so frustrated and stressed, just want this to be over. I don’t get why or how the school can do this.. they have no control over what the panel decide so what are they trying to do @PatriciaHolm @prh47bridge any ideas or experience in this occurring?

Oh gosh.
What a disappointment, I'd be really upset having geared up to hear today.
I have no idea why they've done this as I'm no expert.
Like you said, it is the Panel's decision, so I don't know why school have been allowed to do this.
Hopefully the experts can cast some light on this for you.
I'm gutted for you having to wait when you were told today.

I wouldn’t mind if it was just one day but the whole weekend and then potentially all day Monday aswell. Ridiculous when the panel have already made a decision that is binding by law, what is there to discuss or sort out 🤦‍♀️

The Panel we had made their decisions the day after the appeals ended, last Friday.
The school knew about their decision just after lunch last Friday.
I do understand why we had to wait, as the decision letters are very comprehensive.
But I do not understand how the school can put a stop to letters being sent out, as the Panel's decision is binding for all.