APPEAL TOMORROW!!

[Hye000]

We have our appeal tomorrow and I am absolutely scared to death, so worried and just petrified it’s not going to go our way. Two other families we know who have had there appeal already, aren’t convinced it was worth while and one family have been offered a place for a school that was on their list so I am guessing there appeal won’t be upheld if the panel have offered a place elsewhere. I’m worried my emotions are going to get in the way and also worried how to summarise my case when my time comes to speak 😩😭

I don't see why the clerk has allowed the school to do this. It doesn't change anything.

I also find it bizarre.

It’s making me wonder whether they have had a lot upheld and the school are trying to find some way of getting out of taking that many… I just can’t see any other reason why they would cause a hold up now at the last hurdle!

@Hye000

But as the experts say, it is bizarre and doesn't change anything.
School can't overturn the Panel's decision, just like us parents cannot - If I'd lost, I'd have just had to accept it.
I don't think the Clerk would have delayed anything if me as a parent had asked them to.
It is all so strange.
But do listen to @PanelChair and @prh47bridge because they are chair / panel, so if anyone knows anything, it will be them.

I'm so sorry for you, the ten days I waited dragged and even though I didn't anticipate it, it was more worrying than I expected. I guess I didn't look past the hearing, I was not prepared for the worry of the waiting game.

How long have you been waiting so far?

Thank you, just got to wait it out.

we had our hearing last Friday so it’s been a week, we were one of the last ones luckily! But we’ve been this stressed since 1st March so it’s just gone on for too long 🫤

The school could take it to judicial review, but their chances of success are vanishingly small. They would have to show that either the panel didn't follow the correct process and this disadvantaged them (unlikely) or that the panel's decision was Wednesbury unreasonable, which essentially means irrational (also unlikely). It would almost certainly be a waste of time and money for them.

So realistically the Panel might not have decided until this Monday if hearings are still going ahead on Friday?
But even so, if you were told you'd hear today then you should have.
Mine was last Tuesday and I was told we would hear today, so nine very long days with them letting us know a day early.
Yes same here, a battle started that day, so it has been 2.5 months of so much uncertainty and worry.
Really hope you hear very early on Monday.

Seriously?! But the likelihood of the school wanting a judicial review would only happen if the panel have upheld multiple appeals I guess? They aren’t going to go to all that effort for one or two are they… could this delay even later than Monday then? I’m going to call the first thing Monday and check it will definitely be coming through Monday so we aren’t left waiting again, this is ridiculous and so unfair on these kids

It is extremely rare for a school to take an appeal panel's decision to judicial review. Unfortunately, no-one can take away the right of either side to refer an appeal panel's decision to judicial review. If that is what they are considering, I hope they are sensible and decide against it as it will cause considerable delay if they go ahead.

Our school lost an appeal a few years ago. The reasons given were indefensible (incorrect 'facts' were quoted), and one of the panel members who was very vocal at the hearing turned out to have an undeclared prejudicial interest. We could have taken it to judicial review, but didn't because it's too much time/money/hassle. Instead, we just made it clear to the LA that we would not accept that particular panel member again in future. We haven't lost any appeals since then.

... I do wonder what would have happened if we've spotted the prejudicial interest in the time between the panel making their decision and it being delivered to the parent. Any thoughts on whether that might prompt a re-hearing with a different panel @prh47bridge ?

Sheer logistics. There's more than just one email involved to get everybody notified and children entered onto the various systems. Especially as the person at the school could well have many other things going on at the same time (could give a list of everything that happens right now that are statutory requirements but I'd be here all day typing it) if they even work fulltime in the first place. If one person gets the letter, they then call/email to ask for uniform, induction dates, term dates, etc, etc, which then holds up the processing of anybody else, who then calls/emails because they haven't heard yet.

It's a far more sensible/realistic thing to do all the background stuff first for everyone and then send it all out in one go.

I’m going to call the first thing Monday and check it will definitely be coming through Monday so we aren’t left waiting again

..which, understandable though it is, proves my point.

Yes I understand.
I saw the length of my own decision letter, so I do see why there is such a wait for news.
However, OP was given a date by the LA, and school have pushed it back.
OP was given no valid reason for this.
I just find it strange.
As do a couple of the experts above 🤷‍♀️

With respect, @NeverDropYourMooncup , that's not the clerk's problem. It's up to the school to manage, and it seems they have already had a week where they have known the outcomes, and I'm not sure what they can be doing at this stage anyway given they can't actually do anything until the parents accept the offer (if they win). The clerk shouldn't be holding anything back just because the school is annoyed about the logistics for some reason.

The clerk will be sending all letters out at the same time anyway - that always happens with appeals, decisions are made at the end of all appeals. So that's not the reason either.

My LA send out very quick "yes or no" letters immediately and then follow up with the explanation a couple of weeks later, which I think is a good system! (for parents anyway)

All I can think of is either the judicial review as mentioned, or, possibly as @knotordinary said they have realised something about a panellist which has caused consternation - the person spoken to at the LA probably wouldn't know the detail at this point.

Interesting. I've not come across that. However, there is a clear requirement for the panel to be independent and it is up to the admission authority to ensure their independence.

If the school is its own admission authority and finds that one of the panel is not independent from the appellants, my view is that it has to live with the consequences. However, if the school is not the admission authority, it has legitimate cause for complaint in this situation. It would then be up to the LA, as admission authority, to decide what to do. I suspect most would tell the school it is hard luck, as attempting to reorganise the appeal(s) concerned could lead to the parents complaining to the LGO. Indeed, if they only reorganise the appeal directly affected, those parents who lost could complain on the grounds that their hearing may have been unfairly prejudiced by this panel member. But I really can't say for certain what would happen.

The school was the admission authority but it was using the LA's appeal service.

That makes it tough because, as far as the Appeal Code is concerned, it is up to the school to ensure the panel is independent. The school may have a case against the LA, but I think they would have been in trouble if they'd tried to re-organise the hearing.

It's only a possible suggestion for a delay as an alternative to a school is seeking a judicial review or a panel member not acting in good faith and therefore calling into question the outcome of all appeals heard by the panel. I would always tend to assume that logistics are behind any delay before something more nefarious or catastrophic. unless it's Harris.

I am very well aware of the amount of work that goes into panels, so I know the due respect is meant as exactly that, but sometimes clerks do try to accommodate their schools (and vice versa when the clerks are snowed under) when there's a 'Do you think you could possibly hold off until Monday?' request. Unfortunately, sometimes, particularly in the case of LA clerking and their Admissions Team, there can be far too high a workload and some interesting explanations for delays have also been heard that are actually nothing to do with the panel members or the school. Although going by the number of 'Just to let you know, I'm going on annual leave' emails received this week, I think our LA is finally experiencing a brief lull in the secondary section, having worked their backsides off for all but one week over Easter since the rankings deadline in January.

I'd still look for a simpler workload explanation for a delay first, as it is the most likely reason in the vast majority of cases.

@NeverDropYourMooncup yes, I do agree the simplest answers are normally the best!

It's also very possible that whoever was spoken to at the LA has the wrong end of the stick completely ;-)

@PatriciaHolm @prh47bridge is it possible for the Headteacher to overturn one of the panel’s decisions after it has been made??

I have heard through the grapevine that one set of parents who have appealed, they know the headteacher of the appealed school and the child’s grandmother used to work at the school (retired last October). Apparently the Headteacher has assured the parents “he will do everything he can to get the child in”.

is there anything he can actually do? If he argues this child’s case would that cause all the appellants to be delayed in getting an answer or is there nothing he can realistically do?,

The school is not allowed to actively support the case of an appellant.

But they must think they have some sort of “get out clause” if the headteacher has made that comment. Maybe they are going to argue that the Nan was a employee at the time of the original application as that’s one of the criteria (think it’s parent but maybe they are going to try to use that?) I don’t know. I’m thinking it’s a bit of a coincidence I have heard this aswell as finding out the school have delayed the emails being sent out

You're probably overthinking it and over-reacting to rumours. Just chill, and assume its a workload issue, if only for your own peace of mind.

I am but I know the parents personally (they are from my DD year at school) and they have previously told me that the grandmother used to work at the appealed school etc. so I’m pretty sure it’s not just a rumour. I’m only conscious that if the Head is going to try and do anything, is it going to delay everyone’s? I’m going out of the country next week and don’t want to have this still hanging over our heads, want it to be over on Monday 😩