With Oxbridge taking less and less private school students, is it still worth it??

[SillySmart]

stats shows that the number of private educated students Oxbridge enrolled has dropped 1/3 in the past 5 years. Any thoughts?

Can you elaborate?

Yep. I don’t think there’s any shame in aspiring for your child to be oxbridge material. I didn’t set out like that but I’ve always been invested in their education and made them believe they can achieve as much as anyone else if that’s what they want. I couldn’t afford to send mine to private so it wasn’t a choice but they’re at a good state school and I don’t pretend to imagine they’re not privileged. However I took dd round a private 6th form just to see what she thought and was quite amazed by the facilities and class sizes; there were presentations for each subject and goody bags. At her own school open evening it was rammed and the subjects were in the classrooms with students to help and have a general chat. Dd decided to stay on at her own school. She prob won’t apply to oxbridge, even though her gcse grades were higher than Ds’s. At the end of the day, go and have a look round the schools and find the one that is your best fit for all of you. You may find that at the private and grammar there are aspirational, there are rich and there are flashy. Think about the social group you fit in with too.

Come in, privately-educated children don't get a brain chip implanted in return for the fees, they still have to study and pass the exams.

Many primary teachers are Oxbridge graduates! Not the point of the thread, I realise...

I see your argument, but I also see UK2020’s argument. Imagine if you were a Westminster graduate. You got AAA and might not get an offer. Someone with ABB from a more humble background got an offer. What would you think? You got AAA not only because you are in private, but also the efforts you have to put in yourself, plus all the support your family provides. Do you think that’s fair to you? How much more does a private school student need to achieve over a student from deprived backgrounds, then we say the former has more academic potential than the latter?

bit the candidate who got ABB without the support may have far more potential than the candidate who got AAA with so much extra support

Lots of candidates with AAA dont get offers from top universities. They are often looking for more than just that

Just my opinion. If you had 2 Oxbridge candidates predicted A’s with one from private school and one from state. 20 years ago the private school student probably would have got in as they went to the “right” school and could probably articulate themselves better in interviews and not be so overwhelmed by the whole Oxbridge surroundings. Now it would probably be the state pupil that gets in as it’s recognized that if the state pupil had the same class sizes, extra curricular opportunities etc as the private school then they would likely be the better student out of the two.

If you think your kids will get top grades at a state/grammar school then they should now have an equal opportunity at Oxbridge as a private school student. However, if going to state school would mean your kids being less likely to get top grades then you’ll need to send them to private school to even have the possibility of getting into Oxbridge.

Exactly. On the contrary, I found from people I know, kids going to private school are much more hard working than state school kids. I’m a bit confused about the hostility towards private education here. I thought that shows parents commitment/aspiration for better education for kids and that can only be good?

That is a wild over generalisation

some kids going to private school are much more hard working than some kids going to state schools

some kids going to state schools are very much more hard working than some kids going to private schools

And some kids going to state schools are very much more hard working around multiple disadvantages that many private school children have never even dreamt of

I agree ! Oxbridge doesn’t “look down” on private school educated children, it is merely evening up the balance by taking more (SUITABLE ) students from state schools than before.
All children should have a chance of getting a place if they have the ability and the qualifications.

DD has an Oxford offer. She's fun, quirky, built great relationships with her teachers which most of the other 29 kids in her state school classes failed to do.
She researched courses, got herself to a subject day, got her act together and told the sixth form university teacher ( who also has a full time teaching post) then applied before everyone else in her year group.
If your kid needs more support then yes, you might have to pay but I think Oxbridge are wise to the dedicated Oxbridge tutors, the information sharing. There are schools sending dozens of kids. We need all schools to send their best kids, imagine the diversity, the lived experience, the connections between academic skills and every industry in every area in the UK. That would be truly inspirational.

For state school, need to difficiate between normal comprehensive school and selective grammar.

For the latter, especially in London, will have similar level of deprived pupils, if not less, compared to private schools..

www.bbc.co.uk/news/education-64714201

Those Middle class who want to choose grammar over private for better chance getting in oxbridge is just a wishful thinking

Wow. What an ignorant and discriminatory view of state educated kids. They are just lower riff raff to you aren’t they? This is the perfect example of why there is ‘hostility’ - it’s the fact that people like you have the ability to buy advantage for your children but mistake that for being intellectually and morally superior human beings. Shameful.

Oh. My. God.

This is why I'm glad people like you send to private schools, so my kids don't have to mix with the offspring of people who say things like that.

Have a you absolute snob.

I suppose one of the main reasons why parents paying for private school is to help their kids getting into a good university, right?

Not for me, no. My priority is for happy, resilient and well balanced DC, and I honestly think this is the same for many parents. I have come across parents whose priority is academic achievement, but mostly on Mumsnet!

It’s really not often that I am 😶 by a post but this one is unbelievable!!

I take it that you haven’t considered an apprenticeship for your child as an alternative?!

The U.K. is sending more and more of their best and brightest private educated pupils to the US for university. Go on a selective private school 6th form your and they all mention the US schools they regularly send pupils to. The problem is lots of them don't comeback so it's a massive brain drain. We need to level up the state schools not artificially tilt the scales.

Actually, our main motivation in sending our son to private school is that he has happy schooldays. Where he moves on to afterwards isn't really in my mind yet, but I hope that wherever it is, it won't just be seen as an escape route from school. I went to Oxbridge from state, but my schooldays were mostly misery of being bullied for wanting to learn in class, there was no sport, drama or music and the facilities were really run down. The good time I had at uni, and the subsequent earning power it gave me, doesn't really cancel out those miserable years.

Not all state is like that, of course, but I just felt that private seemed like less of a risk, and he is an only so we can afford it

Except they know exactly what you're doing so then will look at the DC as having not been bright enough to stay at their selective private school or too lazy to keep up

so lose lose really

Private school students with top grades are still over-represented at Oxford:

That data shows that of the children with 3As at A-level, 25% went private. Yet private school children take 32% of Oxford places.

Also as others have pointed out it’s not “discriminating” against private schools who proportionally to the numbers privately educated took a vast number of places plus the small class/no disruptive kids/coaching advantage - its levelling the playing field. A family member is a tutor at an Oxford college and is rather cynical about some of the private schools behaviour in getting their pupils in. They are wise to all the dimwit “state at 6th form” tricks as well.

If you have no parents who were tertiary educated / free school meals / go to a specified state school not a leafy middle class one (only one state school in our small city is in the list my dds all girl top of the county in results state school definitely isn’t and rightly so)

Girl at dds school has been scouted by one of the Oxford colleges so they are reaching out to the best pupils from disadvantaged backgrounds who might not otherwise apply. Single mum who is a cleaner lives in poorest bit of town her Dd incredible 9s all the way and innate natural intelligence. Bad for the country for those pupils not to use their talent because parent can’t afford private.

A friend of my daughter’s is at Cambridge. First in her family to go to university, super bright girl from a council house in a former pit village. She was eligible for various access to HE support which my (equally super bright) daughter wasn’t. I can’t think of a better example of levelling up and am disappointed that it isn’t more widespread tbh.

@SillySmart how dare you presume that your precious DCs are worth more than her? I’m gobsmacked by the snobbery on show here. Go join Therese Coffey in her ivory tower looking down on the peasants.

I think it is now common knowledge Cambridge gives offers also based on irrelevant factors. If two applicants are equal and only one offer can be given, the person from a state school will win over the other from a private school. If two applicants are equal and only one offer can be given, the person from poorer postcode will win over the other. I call it discrimination. It is no good for Cambridge itself and also the entire country.