Should I move heaven and earth to get DD (13) into a better school?

[FrazzledY9Parent]

DD is in Y9 at our local secondary school. The school has some really good features and I know lots of parents are very happy with it. However, it does not stretch DD at all and she has become bored and frustrated. (They only set for Science.)

At parents' evening the teachers all said how great she was, and that she was top of the class, but she says she's operating at 30% of what she could achieve. Her attitude towards school has completely deteriorated and she makes little or no effort with her homework (which is largely pointless copying bullet points from a handout, so I can see her point).

She has high aspirations and wants to apply to Oxford. I know that she has the ability to do very well at GCSE despite the less academic ethos of the school - she'd have good support from me. But it saddens me that she's not stimulated/engaged by school, and I worry that she'll lose interest.

Should I move her before Y10 (when GCSEs will start)?

Every secondary in our city is oversubscribed, so we'd have to move very close to one and go on a waiting list. Having spoken to other parents, I don't think there are any that really have an academic ethos (a lot of people go private and I am beginning to understand why).

Private is off the table for financial reasons plus her dad would never agree.

So realistically we would need to move out of the city and into the surrounding area where there are some more academic state schools.

Is it worth it? Or should I just hold my nerve and hope things pick up a bit in Y10/11?

Would greatly appreciate input from those who have been there/done that!

What does she want?

If she's happy enough where she is, you can address the 'stretching' issue together.

Find out her options choices, the exam boards and course reference numbers. Then go for it. Look at each syllabus, do the basics, then enrich. For example, school might take them on two theatre visits. You could make that two a month, talking about the topics in the syllabus as you go. In class (or privately after class), she can utilise the teacher as a resource, ask some in-depth questions that haven't be covered in class. Approach GCSEs like a computer game, with different levels and obstacles to overcome. It can be fun.

That's good advice, DoesHePlay, and I'd definitely want to do that.

I wouldn't say she's happy enough where she is though, she's pretty frustrated and is getting a bad attitude. She drags herself into school, and I feel like she's lost respect for the school and the teachers - it often feels like she's a bit insolent? This really bothers me, as I have always been very respectful about school and she had a great attitude in primary and was really looking forward to secondary. Obviously Covid and adolescent hormones haven't helped!

The risk is that you move and no spaces become available at the other schools. Realistically you wouldn’t want to move her once she’s started GCSE courses as it would be too disruptive, so you’ve only a small window of time.

Have you spoken to school? Specifically raised your concerns and asked for their help in addressing them?

How would your DD react to the idea of tutoring outside of school, with a view to enrichment rather than catching up?

I've spoken to school but the response hasn't been brilliant. I do get it - it's not top of their priority list with a very socially-diverse catchment, and the aftermath of Covid.

I think she'd enjoy tutoring, but I think the fundamental problem is that she is bored in school all day and this is sapping her morale and motivation. I knew the school wasn't super academic, but I hadn't anticipated the impact it would have on her mentally.

So you’d move closer to an oversubscribed school with a better work ethic, on the off chance she’d get accepted, and pay £££ in removal fees, solicitors fees and estate agent fees and tax to boot, plus an increase in mortgage payments, but see private school as out of reach?

Or, she needs to suck it up and learn some resilience. I know that sounds hard and harsh. But if she capable of the very top grades, she should get them wherever she is. And by all accounts, it's a decent school. To use not being stretched as an excuse to opt out of the work involved is the sort of silly logic a 13 year old applies to situations and needs telling that she is being silly.

Kids who knuckle down get the best grades and what's to say she'll knuckle down at the next school.

By all means, tutor her, stretch her that way, but as her parent, you tell her to knuckle down and get on with the business of achieving the grades she needs to get into oxbridge, because they don't like shirkers or applicants with shit grades.

Don't bloody move.

I know it all sounds harsh, I'm sorry about that, but I do think it's true.

@BluebellsGreenbells

So you’d move closer to an oversubscribed school with a better work ethic, on the off chance she’d get accepted, and pay £££ in removal fees, solicitors fees and estate agent fees and tax to boot, plus an increase in mortgage payments, but see private school as out of reach?

If I was moving it would be out of the city to a guaranteed school place where houses are the same price if not cheaper. The last time I moved it cost me £15k which could be absorbed in the mortgage - school fees here are a minimum of £15k per year which absolutely is out of reach.

@JuneOsborne

Or, she needs to suck it up and learn some resilience. I know that sounds hard and harsh. But if she capable of the very top grades, she should get them wherever she is. And by all accounts, it's a decent school. To use not being stretched as an excuse to opt out of the work involved is the sort of silly logic a 13 year old applies to situations and needs telling that she is being silly.

Kids who knuckle down get the best grades and what's to say she'll knuckle down at the next school.

By all means, tutor her, stretch her that way, but as her parent, you tell her to knuckle down and get on with the business of achieving the grades she needs to get into oxbridge, because they don't like shirkers or applicants with shit grades.

Don't bloody move.

I know it all sounds harsh, I'm sorry about that, but I do think it's true.

She does knuckle down, she gets 90-100 in all her tests. It bothers me that she can be doing so "well" but yet be disengaged and bored, seemingly doing minimal homework.

Having said that, I do agree with you that you can get good grades in any school and it's a much better preparation for Oxbridge/life to do so in a ok school than in a great one.

I just feel bad when I talk to friends who have kids in private/great state schools and they seem to be having a much more interesting time and be far more stimulated.

But I do appreciate your perspective @JuneOsborne, and think there's a lot in it!

Have you looked into state boarding schools and bursaries in private schools? Lots of top private schools help driven and talented children with no means to pay.

Which subjects is she drawn to? What excites her intellectually? What is she reading? What does she say attracts her about Oxford?

I think it's important to understand what makes her tick - as a thinker and learner - in order to figure out what might help.

@Innocenta

Which subjects is she drawn to? What excites her intellectually? What is she reading? What does she say attracts her about Oxford?

I think it's important to understand what makes her tick - as a thinker and learner - in order to figure out what might help.

She loves Science, Geography, Maths, Music. Definitely more of a facts person that an interpretation person. I am the other way round, so don't always know what would float her boat.

Re Oxford she likes the idea of being somewhere challenging - she would like to have a peer group that stretches her intellectually.

@Sunnyfreezesushi

Have you looked into state boarding schools and bursaries in private schools? Lots of top private schools help driven and talented children with no means to pay.

Thanks @Sunnyfreezesushi I did look into this a little, but I suspect we'd fall between being low-income enough for a bursary and high-income enough to afford fees. I am a professional on a decent salary, but single parent so just one income.

I was like this at school. I wouldn't have been able to put it into words and no-one was bothered in my crappy comprehensive school in the 1980s, but I so remember being bored day after day, scoring really highly in all assessments and wondering what on earth was the purpose of going to school.

There wasn't anyone at home to support my learning and I was very depressed (for different reasons).

If I had had support at home, what would have helped me was being encouraged to pursue additional interests. Does she play instruments? Does she want to do grades? She can work towards those at her own pace.

Is she involved in any online/f2f extra-curricular stuff to stretch her academically? Young mathematicians/geographers/scientists groups? If she feels that she's only working at 30% of her capabilities, it's up to her to decide how she makes the most of herself, with your support of course.

To put things into perspective, it sounds like she's having a boring, rather than distressing, traumatic, frightening or lonely time at school. If all that is missing is academic stretching, that sounds very make-up-able outside of school.

Encourage her to see school and GCSEs as a means to an end - just get on with it - and use her other time to challenge herself intellectually.

There's a 13+ I think. Maybe see if she can take that at a nearby grammar?

Thank you for sharing that @christinarosetti19. I'm sorry you had such a tough time. I hope things looked up after that.

She is learning an instrument and also plays a sport. The school are starting up drama again and she's keen to get involved with that. That's a great idea to look for some groups - I'll get onto that.

You are dead right that at least it's just being bored. There are some very kind teachers at the school, and she has a few nice friends too. So it could be much much worse!

We don't have any grammars around here, unfortunately, @AlbertBridge.

Sadly I think quite a lot of bright kids experience this,esp in years 7-9. I certainly did at my ‘good’ comprehensive. It was a perfectly reasonable comprehensive but was certainly not stretched in any way until a level. (Except music gcse composition which I sucked at)

I would
A) raise your concerns with school - being bored is not great, much worse is losing interest in education because of boredom
B) find out if they set for more subjects at gcse
C) consider entering her for local private school entrance. You might well qualify for a substantial bursary and if she is really bright schools will want her.
D) consider things which are challenging outside school- music, drama, sport, extra gcse from home this year

I went to a crappy comprehensive. Was bored. Ended up with mediocre results. Wasted. Find alternatives.

Regarding bursaries, you can always ring around and just ask. All circumstances are taken into account including being single parent. My DD knows children whose mums are eg nurses and one child whose parents are quite well off but have 7 children. The youngest is very bright and was having trouble at school and is an ethnic minority - he got so much help including free therapy and ended up at oxbridge. So it can be worth a try.

Some suggestions for out of school things, that will keep her interests going and ultimately make her a more prepared candidate if she does apply for Oxford - or any other top university!

Subscribe to science and geography magazines - while there is a lot online, the reading experience is different with a physical text.

There are interesting ongoing programmes to bring children into cyber security (at an appropriate fun level). The main 'challenge' isn't currently running, but check out cybersecuritychallenge.org.uk/what-we-do/schools-programme# - they do have games etc to try out now, and I'm sure will open up their larger programmes.

Oxford's own online resources for students in her age group is a fantastic portal with links to each subject. When she is eligible (should be in year 10), she should start considering whether she wants to enter their science essay competition - it's a challenge that will really help her to start thinking in the way she'll need to later for interviews. And you can bet plenty of kids at private schools enter! Plus, a good way to push herself and work independently, with a tangible goal.

Since she is musical, she should consider studying for ABRSM music theory exams. It will hugely enhance her instrumental work later and will certainly challenge her.

Hopefully this won’t sound harsh but I think the ‘boredom’ thing can be a bit of a cop-out.

Do you (or she) really think that if she was at a super academic private or grammar school that she’d be stimulated and engaged and stretched all day? I doubt it. I think you’d be more likely to get more of the same. Any school will consist of a certain amount of seemingly pointless tests, sit here, do that, repeat that.

I think it’s really easy to make assumptions about different schools but they are all probably more similar than different - as much as every school claims to have an individual ethos, they don’t, really.

Personally, I think moving schools at this late stage has the potential to cause a few difficulties.

@Magicalwoodlands Boredom is a genuine problem with gifted children, which OP's daughter probably is. Of course every school has some less interesting lessons, but more academic schools go faster and spend less time trying to raise the grades of low attaining kids.

Differentiation is supposed to happen in state education, but realistically teachers are struggling as much as any of us - and doing their best! It isn't easy to differentiate for one notably gifted child.

She probably does have an attitude and is being lazy, but that doesn't mean the boredom isn't real.

You could look into scholarships at 13+ at biasing schools? Lots of mixed schools have a reasonable intake at that age. Don't know when you need to register by though, but worth exploring if she's academic.

Should say *boarding schools!

By your description of the school, it's clear the School is not an academic one and neither does it claim to be as it takes in students with a wide range of ability. The high achieving students it seems either go private or to the 2/3 oversubscribed schools.

Unfortunately your case is not unique as there are loads of schools up and down the country similar to yours. If as you claim your child is working at close to 30% and is acing every single one of Her test, then there I say it, we might have a mini genius on our hands so She better start applying to Private schools who would be more than happy to have Her.

Alternatively, She could copy what most Bright students who are left with no choice but to attend middle of the road Secondary schools do which is knuckledown and get go great GCSE results and then change schools. In London for example, I know a good chunk of pupils that attend sixth form colleges like Harris Westminster,Newham Collegiate Sixth-form,Brampton Manor,Woodhouse college,King's college maths school, London Academy of Excellence et al are from these said schools.