How to know if child is smart enough for 11 plus

[Gettingthereslowly2020]

DD is in Year 4 (state school) now. She's always been quite bright and she always says the work at school is too easy for her.

School don't give much feedback on how she is doing academically. At the last parent's evening pre-Covid, they showed me a chart that said she is working at the expected standard. At the last parent's evening during Covid, it was done over the phone and the teacher said she sometimes gives her some Year 5 work and she keeps up with them.

I've noticed her spelling isn't great and she doesn't do any work outside of school. I have to force her to do some reading but she does really enjoy learning at school. She seems to be in the top group in class from what she's said.

How can I find out if she is smart enough for grammar school? School do assessments but they never share the results with parents. Can I request that they share her results with me?

I don't really know where to start with all of this so any advice would be much appreciated.

Just get a Bond book from WH Smith or Amazon for her age with 11+ prep and see how she finds it

You honestly don't have to be mother to a genius to sit the 11+ exam. It's free anyway, so why not try to do some home prep with her and see how she gets on?

Ask for an appointment from school to ask for assessment results. They won’t tell you how she compares to other children in the class but you can ask how she compares nationally. As stated above, get a book on how to pass the 11 plus and see how she does. Ask the school if they think she’s a candidate for the 11 plus.

You need to find about the grammar schools locally. How do they select ?
Locally here they are super selective- filling from the top exam scores down , till they are full. The goal post is set very high to get a place. Top 10% when my kids went and , certainly out of a year of 90 6 or 7 went when eldest did.
Working at expected standard with occasional work from the year above wouldn’t really fit with a potential grammar applicant for local schools. abut other areas are different.

Also think about your kids psychology. Do they work best and feel best about themselves if they are “top of the class “. If so thrn go to the comp and be the big fish they need to be to grow. Absolutely avoid the grammar where they will have to work hugely hard to keep up , but always be at the bottom of the group- and be feeling rubbish about it as well.

Bond books are fun but ge equivalent. Again depends on your entry criteria but doing the age 11 bond books at 11 wouldn’t get you into grammar locally ( and they don’t issue past papers either , some places might )

Thank you to everyone who has responded, you have all given me some great advice.

I've been looking at the Trafford Consortium grammar schools but I think they're quite competitive.

I'll ask school to send me a copy of her assessment scores and where she is in comparison nationally. Hopefully that will give me more of an idea about how she is doing.

I've heard that the 11 plus topics aren't taught at school until after the test has taken place so when I get the Bond/11 plus workbooks, should I select the age she is now or get the year above?

Remember it's not just about whether you can keep up at grammar school, but also whether you enjoy it. I'm not saying all grammar school kids have to be stereotypical 'geeks', but I do think that the kids who get the best out of it are intellectually curious and academically motivated. You say you have to 'force her to read' - to be honest from everything you write, that would raise the biggest flag for me - not whether she's capable of getting in, but whether she would actually enjoy the intellectual challenge.

I would get the books for now and the year above if you can so you can see what you’re aiming at.

She used to love reading but this past year, I really have to make a point of asking her to read. She will do it when I ask but she moans about it! She's always complaining that her school work is too easy but I can't tell if she's just moaning or if school aren't challenging her enough.

I don't want to push her into grammar school if that isn't what's best for her, at this stage I'm just looking at all options.

I'll see what her school say and then possibly get the year above for the 11 plus books and see how she gets on.

Quite right - the school will know her well and should be able to give you a view on whether a grammar would suit her abilities and interests.

I would think most kids who pass the 11+ would be working above the expected standard.

I live in a different area to you, you'd need to check just how selective the schools are. My area takes the top 25% but often end up being closer to 30% so much easier to get into than other areas where they take the top 2/5/10%.

Really depends on your area - many do not have grammar schools, some just have a handful left over from before comprehensives, a (very) few areas are still fully grammar school areas (these are easier to get in to because there's more capacity).

Depending on your child and the local schools, they may or may not benefit from selective education. Plenty of free online resources for 11+ prep but it does differ by school.

For the record I, my exh and my kids all went to comprehensives and are all university educated, I really wish they would close the remaining state selective schools, too much pressure on children and only benefit the affluent due to the emphasis on prep

Presumably in your child’s school reports they have told you if your child is working at the expected standard or above the expected standard. Any child taking the 11plus will be working consistently above the expected standard. It does depend upon areas. In our area only the highest one or two children in a class pass the 11+. Check with your child’s teacher once you’ve read last years school report. If they are working ‘at the expected standard’ and not above it then the 11 plus is probably not for them. About 25% of the class will be working above it and about 25% below the expected standard.

Our school runs CAT tests at the beginning of Y5, which gives a view of ability and provides a breakdown of performance in each area vs average. It's a good starting point.

Scores of 110+ might be ok, 115+ better chance, 120+ definitely grammar school calibre.

Update: school have said she's very bright and capable and she's exceeding the expected level.

I'll definitely look into grammar schools now as a serious option.

Thank you to everyone who has taken the time to respond. I wouldn't have contacted school without your encouragement, I'd have probably sat on it and kept wondering until the next parents' evening.

My two DDs sound very much like your DD, both of mine are at super-selective grammars now. So I'd say go for it!

Look at the eleven plus exams forum- everything 11+ on there including a talk forum.

@Maverick197

My two DDs sound very much like your DD, both of mine are at super-selective grammars now. So I'd say go for it!

From what her teacher has said and from what DD has told me, I think a grammar school would give her the extra push she wants.

@Lightsabre

Look at the eleven plus exams forum- everything 11+ on there including a talk forum.

I'll have a look and make an account on there, thank you

It will depend on how selective the grammar schools are. My DS1 has got into the super selective grammar near to where we live. His CAT scores are regularly 141 and never lower than 135 which puts him into the top 1-2% nationally. However, he only just got into the local grammar.

I live in Trafford. You need to pass the exam then it's distance from the school - check your postcode vs the admissions criteria as for example Sale have priority postcodes or at least they did last year.

@KatieMcKatie

I live in Trafford. You need to pass the exam then it's distance from the school - check your postcode vs the admissions criteria as for example Sale have priority postcodes or at least they did last year.

Thanks, I'll have a look

OP, also Trafford. It's a good start that the school has said she's bright and capable. Our Y5 parents evening (just before Christmas I think) was when school (class teacher) said yes, DC should pass or you need to have a Plan B.

As a pp says, it depends which of the Trafford Grammars you're looking at, they're all quite different in terms of pressure / achievement and even though its one exam, assuming that your DD asks for her score to be considered by all 4 grammars, she may pass for some and not others. The admission priorities are different for each school too.

Have you considered a tutor? We tutored during Yr 5 for exam technique and Yr 6 maths that they wouldn't have covered before the exam. In the meantime the absolute best thing you can do is encourage reading - the exam is CEM which is quite heavily weighted to comprehension/ vocabulary.

Hi OP. My DD is just about to leave Alti Girls so I may be a bit out of date.

However, when DD was in Y6 you could have predicted who would get into the Grammars. Generally the top end of the class. Sounds like your DD is up there.

Also, I'm not sure where you live, but if it's Sale/Timperley/Altrincham then there are plenty to go at and they're not 'super selective'. Sale Grammar is mixed while obviously Alti Girls is single sex. If you're Catholic you also have Loreto too.

Most of those that pass do have a weekly tutor throughout Y5 so you may want to look at that. It used to be the case that tutors' phone numbers were closely guarded secrets but I think that there are agencies now and shared sessions that are cheaper.

Some of my friends did the preparation with their DC themselves and were successful but I didn't have a clue about non verbal reasoning! (Still don't).

Finally FWIW, in DD's year we added up that almost half of the year group at her school went to one grammar school or another and it was the same in the school that I was working in at the time.

From your update, if your DD wants to, it definitely sounds like it is worth a go.

@Whiteroseredrose I think it's really changed since it became a consortium exam, just by way of example about 1800 sat for Sale in 2015, 2900 sat it in 2019.

Some good advice though OP, good luck!