Cheltenham Ladies College or St Mary’s Ascot?

[Strifle]

Looking for any feedback on each school, settling at a boarding school and costs please.
Need to choose one by Monday but haven’t been able to go inside either.
Two issues: boarding/ location for coming home, and costs.
CLC is a solid 3 hours away, St Mary’s Ascot 1.5-2 hours.
She wants to go but would prefer flexi boarding which is not an option, she’ll probably want to come home as many w/es as possible at the start.

CLC is much bigger, St Marys feels safer.

The missing piece if the cost of extras and clubs, neither has supplied a price list, just a list of which clubs cost extra but no indication of the price.
I don’t want her to be unable to continue her lessons and clubs if they are super inflated prices. Any feedback on costs for activities and non academic lessons?

I’m wondering if I should heed the the old adage “if you have to ask the price you can’t afford it”.

She has the best local day option and the free grammar on the plate but it feels we’d regret not letting her have a go at something we assumed she’d never get when we applied as it’s outside our circle.

Well, I live in Cheltenham - and CLC is certainly pricey!

Could you delay the place and send her when she is 13 and take up the grammar place in the meantime?

I’d like to do this but the deadline is 10am on Monday. Hub is dealing with the schools and has not asked the Q. The idea was to ask one of them the Q, if they took it negatively we’d still have one offer on the table but it’s too late to ask now.
That said, St Mary’s has indicated they want girls straight out of their junior school, they say not to go to another new school for years 7&8 so I expect they’d say no.
It wouldn’t work if she had to do the common entrance exams in year 8 as the grammar does not teach Latin which is a key topic tested.

It sounds like she doesn’t really want to board and isn’t ready to be away from home 5 days a week

I think if you’ve got a local grammar why not try her for that and save the money you would’ve spent on school fees? I think in this climate, a huge house deposit is more advantageous.

Can't you just ask on Monday?

Realistically, I doubt there will be much difference, at least, not when you think of it in terms of a percentage of the fees. The extras do add up. If you are in a position where the fees are going to be a bit of a struggle to the extent that music lessons and clubs will push you over the edge of what you can afford, that is quite a precarious financial position.

If you have an excellent day option and grammar nearby, maybe that might be better, especially as your DD would prefer flexi-boarding? Perhaps 13 or 16 would be a better age to start boarding for her and the savings in boarding school fees might help put you in a better position financially.

It wouldn’t work if she had to do the common entrance exams in year 8 as the grammar does not teach Latin which is a key topic tested

All the money you save on fees would cover the cost of tutoring.

DD is at St Mary’s Ascot in Y11. She loves it and we could not be happier with the school.
Our only concern was academics as our DD is very academic (and had offers from the most selective girls’ schools) but we don’t regret our choice as the school caters for all types, from the most academic to the least so to speak. What strikes me is the value added and the results the school gets despite it being nowhere near as selective as other schools in a similar position (or even further down) in the league table.
Socially she is very happy and has made very good friends. Last but not least facilities, extra curriculars (and the food!) are amazing. Feel free to pm me if you need more.

I forgot to add - yes the school is full boarding but many girls (those in London or close enough to school) chose to go home every Sunday after mass, at least before covid times. They can also take floaters (floating exeats) in between exeats (one per term).

OP, as well as extras don't forget fees inflation, all private schools fees have been held back due to the pandemic but they are due to rocket up due to lots of reasons including the high cost of teachers' pensions.
I would gauge your dd's reaction when you get the grammar place confirmation on Monday against the cost of 7 years of fees with the shorter term dates (@ 30 weeks a year so at least 20 weeks at home) and cost of fuel going to and from boarding school.

I really wouldn't chose CLC. IMO it's not a very nice school. One of my many criticisms of it is the way they treat 6th form age girls like small children and they have far too little autonomy to grow up and then cope with the real world.

For what it’s worth I went to a local grammar school and my sister went to an independent girls’ school that was mega bucks and a bit of a drive away.

Obviously the grammar is very academic, but I’m also glad that I had a more ‘normal’ experience of making friends from the town I lived in. They are still my friends to this day whereas my sister’s school friends were all from further afield and she struggled to maintain the friendships after leaving. I guess I felt more like part of the ‘community’ than she did. I also had the fun of weekend parties, trips to cinema, sleepovers etc because weekends weren’t always ‘family time’.

I also think a lot of universities etc are becoming less inclined to make offers to pupils from top independent schools because of social mobility.

@DK123

I really wouldn't chose CLC. IMO it's not a very nice school. One of my many criticisms of it is the way they treat 6th form age girls like small children and they have far too little autonomy to grow up and then cope with the real world.

I agree with this.

My experience is 20 years old, however.

@Strifle, we've found that music lessons at our school are the same or less than we paid outside of school. Horse riding and golf are generally the ones most schools charge extra for, and sometimes fencing, but every school is different. I have never come across a school that has been unhappy to provide costs of extras.

Is your daughter 100% ok about boarding as it doesn’t sound like she is? It can be a miserable experience if the whole family isn’t on board so don’t just be wowed by school names and results - will she be happy?

That aside, I would always go for the closer school if there was nothing else to sway you. If your daughter makes a sports team it is lovely to go and watch, or if she wants to come home most weekends.

As for extras, I have found that odd bits of uniform keep needing to be purchased, particularly team kit. As everything is personalised with name and shirt number the £££s add up. Apart from that everything is “normal” prices for music, LAMDA, dance lessons etc.

COVID has put pay to residential trips but I would factor in a few extra thousand over the course of her time there. They usually aren’t compulsory but when it gets to GCSE stage most girls seem to go on subject relevant trips.

Also be mindful that fees are likely to rise a lot too. Many boarding schools are feeling a real pinch with international students not returning. We have already been warned that fees are going to go up in September. A local school (Princess Helena College) announced this week it was closing as a third of pupils were international boarders who haven’t returned. All schools will have to try and raise the shortfall somehow.

@Wondermule

For what it’s worth I went to a local grammar school and my sister went to an independent girls’ school that was mega bucks and a bit of a drive away.

Obviously the grammar is very academic, but I’m also glad that I had a more ‘normal’ experience of making friends from the town I lived in. They are still my friends to this day whereas my sister’s school friends were all from further afield and she struggled to maintain the friendships after leaving. I guess I felt more like part of the ‘community’ than she did. I also had the fun of weekend parties, trips to cinema, sleepovers etc because weekends weren’t always ‘family time’.

I also think a lot of universities etc are becoming less inclined to make offers to pupils from top independent schools because of social mobility.

Although it's true that your friends live all over the place in boarding school so you don't have local friends, I'd say the one of the (few IMO) plus points of boarding school are the friends you make. You're all in it together and so form a pretty strong bond. I have a group of 6-8 boarding school friends that I'm still regularly in touch with 20+ years on. It may all be different now but at my school, which was pretty similar to CLC, we were allowed to the cinema from age 14, and there I often spent weekends at friends' houses, as my parents lived abroad.

My DDs were at the local comp but went to St Mary's for some sports fixtures and dance exams. The facilities are amazing. They also learned Mandarin and Russian there (St Mary's doing its charitable bit for the poor people up the road). It's a beautiful school and the girls seemed very nice.

I confirm what @mumsneedwine wrote. Barring a few exceptions, the girls are very kind and polite. It is a relatively small community (40 ish in Y7-8, 60 ish in Y9 onwards) so they all know each others very well and get on well/are very close. It's actually the main reason why DD chose the school over other schools - it felt like a warm school on open days and various events that took place ahead of accepting the offer (which I believe your DD wouldn't have been able to experience this year).

As an example, one year St Mary's were hosting the county hockey final and our comp had qualified for last 6. We beat St M and got through to the final where we were up against Wellington. They had about 6 different coaches (we had a PE teacher) and also had masks. Ours never had masks so short corners were always a hazard ! St Mary's lent us their coaches and masks and cheered our girls on. We still lost 😂 but was lovely to watch.

I’m sure the girls are very kind and polite, and that it is a lovely school.

If OP had the choice between a local dump or an independent school, I would say choose the independent one every time (don’t want to come across as an inverse snob!).

But if the grammar is as good academically as a private school (probably better, as far as results usually go), which is free, means DD can come home every night, and make local friends to grow up with, why go for the alternative? The money saved could go on a house deposit, tuition fees, anything.

It’s a huge price to pay for pristige, which doesn’t get you as far as it used to. I think there was a thread on here recently about private schools not getting as many oxbridge offers as they used to.

That's a great anecdote @mumsneedwine
@Wondermule I fully agree with your post. I didn't want to address the money issue in my post as every situation is different and it's a very personal decision. The reason why I was keen to talk about our experience is to help the OP with her decision if she was keen to pursue the independent route. What we have experienced with St Mary's is indeed very different to what we have experienced with other (independent) schools and DCs.
I also agree with @Zodlebud - if you struggle to make up your mind between two similar schools, just pick the nearest. 100 times.

Thanks for all the input.
Part of the problem if trying to find out what DD truly wants, we’re not clear if she really wants to go to boarding school or is she thinks she should as they’re both fabulous schools. She’s heard us talking about making friendships and contacts for life, and seem how excited we were when the offers arrived, but until the they arrived she was seemed excited to go to the grammar.
She’s always been driven an hour to school and had no local friends, the idea of catching a bus from the end of the street and knowing local girls seemed ideal.

In terms of results, the grammar, whilst free (very attractive), is bottom of the rung. The senior division of her current prep school gets better results, then the best day, CLC then St Mary’s at the top.

Atm she’s keen to go to the US for university, more likely from a boarding option, (CLC does the IB), but less likely we can fund that after paying for the school!

She likes coding, maths, tech, rather than English and humanities.

She is very academic but has two sisters who are not, we will have to pay for them to maximise their outcomes but can’t pay for 3 top end boarding schools without selling the house!

I know one of the senior teaching staff at St M's and a couple of members of teaching staff as Ch college - the brother school to Ch Ladies. Obviously none of their viewpoints are unbiased!! But from various conversations around them, unless you actively don't want a small school then I think overall St Mary's is the better choice - better pastoral care, and just a healthier atmosphere.

However, if you aren't sure your daughter wants to board and are worried the fees are a stretch, why don't you send her to the local independent as a day pupil (assuming you like it) till she is 16, then she can pick where she wants to board for 6th form?

I am quite pro-boarding, but the child needs to want to. 11 is also quite young compared to 13.

I know a few happy girls at CLC - but if you want closer I’d go to St Mary’s.
Cheltenham College is definitely not the brother school to CLC. Its been a rival for many, many years!

@Brenda2021, one of our key worries is that the girls will be in such a different social circle that DD will feel left out or grow to be dissatisfied with her home life.

She’s a lovely girl, kind and giving, not judgemental and well spoken so we feel she’ll fit in, but we’ve heard so many are in the super rich league. Will we be the only family dropping off in a Ford Focus?😆

I'm a CLC girl.

I left 40 years ago though.

It was an awful, deeply unhappy school then.

I'm sure it's a bit better now - but I'd choose the smaller school, closer to home any day of the week.