Small disaster with GCSE options for next year

[JoanCallamezzo]

DD (yr 9) was told yesterday that school can’t accommodate her GCSE options now that they have worked out the timetable – she can’t do Geography, History and Art together and has to drop one. She loves (and is pretty good at) all 3 but is most committed to Art and Geography, so it looks like she’ll have to drop History. However, the only alternatives she’s been offered are Music (she doesn’t even play an instrument), Photography (not allowed in combination with Art), 3 vocational non-GCSE courses (Hospitality, Child Development, Health - none of which are right for DD) and Sociology (which is the only viable option but DD has zero interest in it and I feel it is quite limiting as a subject compared to the breadth and scope offered by History).

We are deeply disappointed and feel that DD, who works hard, and was on track for good grades in all three of her choices, is being let down quite badly by the school. She's really upset and stressed. It is being presented as a fait accompli and DD was told she had to decide by today (we have asked for more time and for a meeting to discuss.)

Has anybody managed to resolve a situation like this or do we just have to suck it up and find a way to help DD feel happy about Sociology and less sad about dropping History?! Any ammunition for our meeting next week would be great, as would opinions on Sociology over History at GCSE!

Yes, I’d agree. Many grammar schools and independents have too small a range of subjects at A level because they either don’t have the staff to teach them, they don’t have the resources for subjects like photography or they can’t afford to run the smaller class sizes for those wanting to take those subjects.

DD had to rethink her gcse options due to her preferred combination not being possible due to timetabling.
After being very initially annoyed at the school for their inflexibility, we actually found it a very useful exercise in thinking about her interests and skills and how her choices would influence what she might study later. It was also useful to understand what studying a particular gcse really involved rather than making assumptions based on previous study in ks3. DD ended up opting to drop a subject that she'd previously insisted was top of her list.
I'd suggest that it's useful for OP and her DD to revisit all the options with an open mind.

Just reading through this thread again to give me a bit of bravery before I go and meet the deputy head! I'm still torn between feeling disappointed with the school and wanting to push them to find a way to allow DD to do her original option, and thinking 'oh well, they can't please everyone, let's just make the best of it'.

What WombatChocolate said about 'The other thing is, if you don't do it at GCSE how can you be sure that A Level History is what you really want to do' does bother me because I can see that DD has a love for humanities at the moment, and I feel sure she would do either Geography or History (maybe both?) at A-level, depending on which one she liked most at GCSE, it seems such a shame that she is being forced to choose now.

Anyway, trying to be as positive and open-minded as possible for our meeting - I'll let you know how it goes. Thanks a million for all the really helpful advice on this thread

Update: we had a fairly positive meeting with the deputy head, although (as I suspected) there’s no change in the combination of subjects available to DD. He was very approachable and it was a constructive talk.

He explained how the options system works and that this genuinely is the outcome that disappoints the fewest students – DD is one of only 6 (in a year of 210) who was only able to do 1 of her 2 ‘free’ options and neither of her reserves (around 30 got a reserve subject instead of both their first choices), and only one other person in the year chose the same combination as her of Geography, History and Art. So we were unlucky that DD's combination of options wasn't more popular.

Apparently Art wasn’t as popular this year, otherwise there would have been an Art class in each of the blocks like in previous years, which would have made it work for DD. I asked whether there was ANY chance of adding an Art class and he said it simply isn’t viable as there would only be about 8 of them in the class (lovely as that sounds!) and timetables, staffing and budgets make it impossible, I did feel that he was being straight with us and that he had done everything he could to try and make it work.

So it does look like DD will be doing Geography, Art & Sociology and dropping History, she’s going to have a chat with the Sociology teacher tomorrow to find out more about it before we confirm. He did say that she will be in a high ability class and so will be quite challenging, so that sounds good, and it turns out the teacher is one she has had previously for RS and really liked.

He also said that he would find out about the History A-level question and get back to us – although I can’t honestly see DD choosing to do it if she hasn’t done a GCSE anyway.

All rather disappointing but not the end of the world, as many have pointed out on here. I made the point about how it had been communicated so badly and he apologised. The main thing for me is that DD is feeling much happier than she was on Thursday. She’s handled the whole thing really brilliantly and was so mature and positive in the meeting, so I am feeling really proud of her.

That sounds positive in terms of the teacher being a known quantity. I would try to push them for something in writing if they agree to the history a level option. It is definitely possible at dd's school so can't be too outrageous a proposition.

So glad your DD sounds to have made choices she can live with. Glad you got an apology over communications.

Glad you are feeling more positive and DD is too.
I would up with an email to thank them for the meeting and briefly reiterate your disappointment and look forward to confirmation about History A Level still being possible without the GCSE. This email will prompt the teacher to get on with finding an answer and get back to you. Make sure you keep the reply, in case there is an issue later....although as you say, she is unlikely to choose an A Level that she didn't pick for GCSE in reality.

I guess a few are disappointed in many schools. It is a shame though and a consequence of funding cuts which mean smaller classes are not viable and then affect which blocks they appear in and possible combinations.

I might consider again if art can be binned as a GCSE to allow for Geog and Hist. Does the school offer any extra curricular art which means she can still be involved? How likely is an arts based degree? You seem to think she is very humanities based so would those be better and give her more genuine choice at A Level, bearing in mind that she is so unlikely to choose History without having it at GCSE. To be fair, I expect Sociology will be interesting and amongst lots of GCSEs it won't reduce the overall profile. Worth bearing in mind that at A Level it's good to have 2 facilitating subjects - if art is still loved and chosen, but with a humanity in mind for degree, she doesn't have a direct route into 2 facilitating humanities A Levels and Sociology might be fine as a 3rd subject at A Level, but for competitive humanities courses might not be great in a profile of just 1 facilitating subject - fine if there are 2. It's just about keepingntheboptions as open as possible isn't it, so everything is still possible later and doors aren't closed. I can see why you're disappointed because you feel doors are being closed or at least pushed almost closed by this, and that it's not heartening,mespeciallybwhen it's a door that your DD might like to go through later.

If your DD isn't likely to be aiming for top notch courses at top notch places, to be honest, having Sociology as a 2nd subject and only having 1 really academic high profile subject won't matter really and having 3 decent grades will be the key thing.

And assuming the school confirms A Level History is possible still (and I would want to speak to the Head of Hist if it comes back as a 'no' b ecause there is no good reason why an academic child can't do A Level History without GCSE- I'd be extremely surprised to be honest) then it's important to hold onto that.
If you really feel it's likely to be a genuine interest and strength, make it your responsibility to keep fostering that interest with visits and books, so that the A Level remains a genuine possibility for her. Perhaps ask the school if you can borrow some GCSE textbooks for her in abyearvir two so she can have a look and see what's been covered and if it grabs her, as well as looking at some A Level books when it comes to A level options. The door isn't closed but you will probably have to work a bit harder to keep it genuinely open - it's up to you if you think it's worth the effort or she will be receptive to it.

If your DD is still interested in history in a couple of years time, consider taking the EPQ on a history based topic. She could research something she finds interesting and use it to supplement her other A levels.

The Head of Sixth Form has confirmed that every year they take students for History A Level who haven't sat it at GCSE so that's reassuring. And DD has had a good chat with the Sociology teacher who has convinced her it will be interesting and challenging and that she will be well suited to it. So all good.

Good points WombatChocolate. We do do a lot of historical/cultural stuff as a family (museums, historical places, watching documentaries etc) so hopefully that will continue to foster a curiosity and love of learning in DD and not close off any interest in history, whether for study at A level or for her own interest and enjoyment as she gets older.

The EPQ is a good idea. There's an option to do one alongside their GCSEs as an extra but I think it's probably too much for DD at this stage (she's chosen a mindfulness option instead).

This is definitely partly a consequence of school funding cuts - the deputy head said that if they gave everyone all the options they wanted the school would be bankrupt! I guess if there was more funding available the art class of 8 would potentially be viable.

Anyway, it's all sorted now and we've confirmed her doing Geography, Sociology and Art.

Thanks to everyone who has given such good advice on here

Well done, a good outcome.

I’m glad you feel reassured OP. And DD is happy.

You don’t need two humanity facilitating A level subjects to do a humanity at university. For example, Geography, Biology and Sociology would be fine. Geography being the one facilitating humanity. History can be studied without any other facilitating A level so Sociology and, say, Maths, wouldn’t stop anyone getting a place on a History degree.

As for Media Studies, Photography and Sociology getting you a place on a competitive humanities course - I think as there is no facilitating subject, the course must be aligned to one of these subjects and therefore would not be Geography, Law, History or Psychology. It is important to choose A levels according to what course you want though!

The grammar schools around me are 1000-1400 pupils. They would teach Sociology if it was deemed necessary. They are not small schools but they teach what the majority need. Most secondary moderns do offer it.

Sorry: for History I meant no other facilitating Humanity A level!

Yes, mine is doing sociology, and she didn’t even get an A in that at A level. But is en route for a first now. I too bought into all the hoohah about how hard it would be to get into a good university and I was concerned too, especially with the A level choices. But I’m now cynical and think it’s all rubbish. I’ve never known anyone be rejected for their university place. I’ve seen it over and over again over the last eight years. If the child doesn’t get the grades, the university lets them in anyway, or offers a foundation year first, or they get into an equally prestigious university on a different but related course, even through clearing. Maybe if it was Oxford it might be different but they’re not applying for that. But they all applied for good universities- think Edinburgh, Bristol, Bath, Nottingham, Leeds, etc. A friend of mine was very worried when her son mucked up one of his A levels last year and she was very concerned about his university place - and I said it’d be OK, and even if he underperformed he would still get in- which is what happened. Accepted at the university with no quibbles without getting the grades required.

It’s not hard to get in for Sociology. It tends to be a bums on seats degree. A bit like Arch and Anth. A friend’s DD took a year to get a job with a first in Sociology. Not great A levels and that doesn’t help as employers look at these.

The universities mentioned will be far more choosy for History and they will want an A in it. However years vary. You can get lucky in a low birth year but you cannot bank on it.

Gosh @BubblesBuddy take a day off, eh?

Timetabling can be very tricky so I doubt the school is being deliberately difficult. I would avoid Sociology- not highly regarded at GCSE. RE has a philosophy element these days and is quite academic- would this be an option?

It depends very much on the Uni and the course. It’s absolutely not a given ( I’m a teacher and 6th form tutor so have plenty of experience). UCL, Oxbridge and certain popular courses will require offer grades.

Charming, bubbles. I’m perfectly aware that my dd was not top notch A star material at that time. But there’s a huge industry of vested interest from grammar schools and independents explaining how hard it all is to get into good universities, and that is not true in my experience, and I wished I had realised it earlier. From engineering to history to medicine to maths to psychology, etc, it’s proved straightforward. All universities have a bums on seat approach nowadays. My dh has a history degree from Oxford and that was as much use as any other humanities degree - ie, not a lot. I would never advise anyone to take history or sociology or English, etc, at any university, no matter how prestigious, but it wasn’t my choice.

They would teach Sociology if it was deemed necessary. They are not small schools but they teach what the majority need. Most secondary moderns do offer it.

only 37,895 entries last year for GCSE Sociology which confirms my experience of the comprehensives I've worked at/know well

I would avoid Sociology- not highly regarded at GCSE

I really wish this nonsense would stop on MN! Not all GCSEs have to be "facilitating" (I've quoted this as there is no such thing as a facilitating subject at GCSE); as long as students have their core and some 'academic' subjects a couple of other subjects/qualifications are not going to stop any young person having a future!

Young people have gained Oxbridge places, RG places, A Levels, apprenticeships, jobs with non 'academic' subjects at GCSE and shock horror a vocational qualification in the mix of their L2 qualifications.

My dh has a history degree from Oxford and that was as much use as any other humanities degree - ie, not a lot.

Don't you start @daisypond

I was on your side!

Yes this idea of facilitating gcses is a load of shite. As i said upthread dds bf is off to ixford and he has shcok horror a sports btec at gcse level

Yep. My eldest also somehow managed to sneak into Oxford with an (IT) BTEC concealed amongst the GCSEs. Shocking