Grey Coat school admissions - how to get in?

[Luna9]

Hi,

My daughter is in year 3 and I have started looking at secondary schools and set my heart on the Grey Coat School; I have read the admission criteria and am aware of how difficult is to get it; I would like to find out from other families with girls attending the Grey Coat School how did they get in? Was it a language place? Open place? Do I still have time to start going to church? Do I need to move in front of the school? In other words how do I increase our chances of getting a place?

Thank you

That has to be one of the most complicated set of entrance criteria there is!

Is it Michael Gove who has a daughter who just started there? I wonder which criteria his child got in.

Thank you; it looks as complicated as I thought; we will have to rely on luck to get a language place. It looks like we don't have time to apply for a church place even though it is still 4 years until she starts secondary school

I'd be really interested to see some evidence that Greycoats idiosyncratic 'language aptitude test' correlates with anything in particular, tbh. I know of three girls from different primary schools and year groups who didn't pass the test, but went on to Oxford (1 girl) and Cambridge (2) to read...

Modern Languages.

I guess some girls must get in that way, but prob best to treat it as a lottery rather than a reflection of academic or linguistic potential.

Yes; it is definitely a lottery; not sure how they test aptitude to languages; saying that my daughter speaks a second language as English is not my first language; I know this does not guarantee a place though.

No, it doesn't, because they don't test actual languages, they set some kind of 'Martian language', or at least that's what they used to do. Really don't set your hopes on it, it's a gamble, no more than that.

Quite a few schools used to use Swedish for this, that may have fallen out of favour now, especially in London where they might well be an actual Swedish speaker taking the test .

they don't test actual languages

That's because they are required to test aptitude, not knowledge. If they tested, say, French they would simply be prioritising children who know French already. They should use a test that tells them how good the pupil will be at learning a foreign language.

Note that I have not seen the test used by this school. I have no idea how well it tests for aptitude.

The music aptitude tests I have less of an issue with, because they are generally using well-established methods of testing abilities like pitch discrimination that are known to correlate to musical potential, and hence an acceptably fair way of trying to assess aptitude without covertly selecting children who have benefited from extensive musical training. (Though it must be added that quite a few schools that have music places use the aptitude tests as an initial screen before a second round involving auditions, where preparation and teaching is clearly key).

My issue with the GCH language test is that (afaik) it is set by the school and I don't know of any evidence to show that it correlates with actual linguistic potential or subsequent achievement - clearly anecodotal evidence of dc with high linguistic ability (as evidenced by A* grades at A-level and places at Oxbridge) is just anecdote, but enough to make you wonder. I'd be really interested to see whether the school have actually attempted to evaluate their selection tests against outcomes for the pupils thus selected.

The point I was making was really just to warn the OP that however potentially able an applicant is, it would be unwise to assume that the outcome of the test will reflect htat ability and hence lead to an offer of a place.

Admissions criteria like this make me froth with rage. This is a state fucking funded so-called comprehensive school!

I believe that there is likely to be a new set of admissions criteria as a result of an adjudication which found like other leading faith schools - oratory, coloma, - the criteria were being used as selection through the back door. I suspect you will see a constant cycle of slight change to admission, adjudication, another tweak... So the criteria that apply now could well be different in 3 years time.

I remember doing a language aptitude test at school and I did very well at it. As far as I remember it was basically a logic test; identify the rules of the test 'language' and apply them to set questions. I am quite a scientific person so this appealed to my strengths. What I am definitely not is a linguist. I have no 'ear' for language or music and found learning GCSE French difficult.

My DD did the test some years back and said it was like an alien language and mostly aural. One of her friends was offered a language place but didn't accept it. She is fluent in an oriental language - not sure if that helps.

I would go and have a look at it. Personally I didn't like it but most people I know rave about it. St Marylebone was the more fashionable school a few years back and many people apply for both.

Our nearest school. A few years back DD sat the test and thought it more of a logic test than language. There were sittings on at least two different days and queues round the block, so the odds are slim. Some local children seem to get tutoring for it. I have not read the admission criteria but people living really, really close seem to have a higher chance. I also don't know if things have changed but rules used to demand a high level of religious participation so easier for girls from evangelical church backgrounds for whom church was a big part of family life. The slight downside here was that some of these pupils might be less tolerant of homosexuality and other facets of a liberal society. Not a school for a child of gay parents.

Locally Pimlico Academy is becoming increasingly popular, to the extent that people now turn down Greycoats for Pimlico. More liberal, good pastoral care and less rigid. That said, Greycoats delivers a good education. They take boys in sixth form.

DD did not get a place. Frustrating to see pupils travel in from far and wide, with a mini traffic jam of parents dropping pupils off out of sight of the school. And unlike pupils from other schools, Greycoats pupils regularly fail the bus behaviour test. I wish one of their teachers would tell pupils that they should give up seats for clearly elderly and disabled people, and not block the entrances. but that's what comes with having, effectively, a London wide catchment.

dd1 got a place some years ago but didn't actually go. she sat the aptitude test but got her place on faith grounds - as did everyone else we know who went there. And those that didn't get places were actually those from the more evangelical churches - if your church doesn't baptise babies then your dd won't get full marks on the faith score. this may have changed though as I know one family who complained about this.

Needmoresleep, I don't understand how anyone could turn down a place at one state school for another one in the current system. Do you mean that people are putting Pimlico down as a higher choice than Greycoats?

Using the common application form, or whatever it's called, parents get one offer (or none) from their state school applications. If a family puts Greycoats down as #1 and Pimlico as #2 and both schools would be able to offer a place in the first instance, the system will automatically hand back their Pimlico place and Greycoats, which releases the Pimlico place for another family. The family will never know that they would have got a place at Pimlico.

I suppose if they had a change of heart when they get the Greycoats offer they might be able to go to Pimlico and ask if there are any vacancies there - is that what you mean?

(The current system is so much better than the position ten years ago before this came in when some families did end up holding multiple offers and took their time deciding which to accept, while other families had nothing at all.)

hold onto the Greycoats place

Must preview!

Yes, scenario 2 happened to a friend of my DD's. Got a place at Greycoats, was offered St Marylebone from the waiting list and took a place there.

Awww my mother went there during the 1950s. Good luck!

Thank you for all the information; it is very useful. The conclusion is we will be very lucky to get a language place but will try anyway; no chances of a religious place

Allmimsy, it might have been loose wording. What I meant is that I know people who are pretty certain to get Greycoats (live v. close, baptised, in a feeder primary) will look often look very seriously at both Greycoats and Pimlico. I can think of one family who simply preferred Pimlico, another who received a late offer for Greycoats, but decided not to give up their Pimlico place.

Pimlico really is much improved. Greycoats certainly offers a good education but there seems to be a sense that it is resting on its laurels.

Dosen't really matter though. Greycoats seems near impossible to get in unless you are seriously religious.