is entry automatic from junior to senior

[miller599]

My dd is 3 and is considering entry to an independent school for possibly year 3 as don't think we will be able to afford it for next year.

I want to know if my dd was to get into a private school in year 3 or year 6 (presuming she will have to sit a entrance test) would she have to sit another for entry to year 7 or is the transfer automatic. Schools im currently considering is old palace, Bromley or Croydon high, and possibly Farringdon or Babington but don't know much about these 2 schools

You'd have to ask the school.

Normally, if there is a 10+ entry, you'd expect them to take only pupils who met the standard for seniors. Ad hoc place candidates would also have to meet the schools standard, but if earlier than 10+ I would expect all pupil's, regardless of joining date, to go through the same processes to secure senior school places.

Automaticity now does not however guarantee it in some 7 years time.

It depends.
And it can change! I remember the moaning when a local Girls school had a new head who made entry to the seniors from the prep school dependent on passing the exam.

Well, from looking at the babington house website, it looks like there are separate admissions procedures for internal and external applicants. I'm not sure whether the same applies at farringdons.

That's not to say that all girls from the junior school are a shoe in, but rather that they have different procedures.

Neither school has a reputation of being especially academic. If you're local to them, and it transpires that your dd is academic, it might be worthwhile looking at bromley high for senior school, or bullers wood (state), both of which have good secondary results, although bromley high has selective testing, unlike bullers wood.

I actually know of a couple of people with dds at bromley high juniors who will be sending their daughters to bullers wood for secondary because the results are good and they've made the decision that the benefit of private, same school all the way through doesn't outweigh the costs involved.

Automaticity now does not however guarantee it in some 7 years time.

Well said. A lot can happen in that time.
I wouldn't rely on automatic transfer. Even if it appears that it happens it could be because pupils are 'managed out' before then.
Do you really want to go to a school where the entry criteria is 'how long have you been paying fees'? It might be nice for you to have the guarantee of a place, but I would worry that it disincentivises the school and makes them lazy.

At Croydon, from what I can gather, transfer is automatic unless it has been indicated otherwise. Obviously the school will know the girls and will be able to assess whether their ability at 3 or 7 has continued, and whether they are of the standard appropriate to enter the senior school. If it is deemed that they are not, then this will be indicated to the parents - I'm not sure when though, presumably year 5, or possibly earlier. I don't know how common this is.

Not sure about the automatic transition but I would stay away from Bromley High personally. Our Dd is just finishing there and although she has had a fabulous time and made loads of friends and enjoyed school she has completely flunked her AS and A levels over the last 2 years. I personally will never consider this school again.

How gutting re: bromley high.

I have no direct experience of the school, although nieces attend/ attended for senior school and I have friends with dd's lower in the senior school.

My own personal take is that while dns have done well in the sixth form, I believe that they would have done equally well in the grammar they rejected or in a bromley state secondary school. Hugh expense for minimal gain academically. But I can't knock them - they're lovely girls and have enjoyed it there immensely.

Thank you for your comments. I live in new Addington and would not be in the catchment area for bullers wood. In fact not in the catchment area for many good schools hence considering private. My daughter is at old Palace nursery and transfer to the school is not automatic although they are given first preference. From reviews and personally looking at the school I think it's one of the main options I wood be considering. My dd is quite bright and I wouldn't really want her to be traveling to far just to get to school and back.

I would ideas ideally want something academic but not over pushy

Have you considered a Royal Russell school? Or did you want single sex?

I don't mind about the school being single Sex or coeducational. I looked around the prep at royal Russell and did like what I saw. However I've seen mixed reviews about the seniors many stating it is not very academic or in the same league as old Palace. I'm definitely going to keep my options open

In

In North London/Herts, the child will be "managed out" if in the bottom fifth of certain schools with a senior school. This is normally done in cooperation with the parents and may happen well in advance of year 6.
So there are no guarantees basically.

I think that increasingly where there are Preps which are the Junior Section of a Senior, they offer automatic entry into the Senior. However, it is true that they all reserve the right to tell parents their child is not up to it. Usually this will be flagged as a possibility early on, perhaps Year 3 or certainly Year 4. There should be no nasty last minute surprises. It is a form of 'managing out' and often people innthismposition move before the end of the Junior section. Where I am, those are who are told they are not suitable for automatic transfer, can still sit the exam with external candidates. Few if any do though. So they have been effectively managed out.
It is a selling point for Preps which are Junior schools. It will mean that most don't have to do another entrance exam. They will expect most to progress on, it will only be the bottom few.

In a sense, Preps which are separate of Senior schools do this too. Good ones advise parents of the'best fit' for secondary. This is often couched in terms of personality, but is usually about ability mainly and managing expectation, so people apply to where they will get in. Good Prep Heads have good relationships with Secondary Heads, so the Secondary Head knows that if someone is being sent by the Prep Head, they are suitable. The problem comes when parents insist on ignoring the advice and applying where they have been advised not to.

As above, the school my daughter is going to say that transfer is usual but not automatic. I know someone who left at the end if the junior school and was given lots of warning that they didn't think she was suitable for the senior school.

Often if it is "automatic" those who aren't expected to make the grade are managed out before year 6. Also I think you as parents as well as children can suffer for fatigue if you stay in the same environment and social group for up to 14 years.

Thank you for your comments

@LIZS it won't be for 14 years 8 max. If my daughter gets into the state school we have chosen in which my dc attended many children leave by the end of year 5 and start year 6 in an independent school mainly Whitgift group schools and royal Russell in which then you would automatically join the seniors. It's usually around 10 children leave at the end of year 5 leaving just over half a year a yr 6 class.

Again it all depends on the school age gets into and how she is a few years years down the line but I know for sure we really want her to go to a independent school for secondary.

You orginally mentioned transfer at Year 3 - that is 11 years in same cohort potentially. Does OPW do proper Year 6 entry though, I know W and T do for boys but they are standalone senior schools.

Like Whitgift and trinity, the senior school starts from year 6. Those children in op would sit test in yr 6 along with external candidates. Because yr 6 is in the senior site they can accommodate more children and have spaces for a specific number of yr 6 spaces for external candidates. Those that join the school at yr 6 will automatically stay on in senior and would not be required to take part in the assessments. The number of yr 6 pupils are limited and they take up to a maximum of I think 8 children each year