Short school skirts "sending the wrong message"

[BeingFluffy]

DD (13) at a Comp had assembly today for girls only. The woman teacher was going on about how some girls wear very short skirts and it "sends the wrong message". From what DD was saying she seemed to be making a link between girls' skirt length and sexual violence. I agree that some girls wear skirts that are no more than belts and it does not look particularly smart, but I really object to that apparently making them more at risk of sexual violence or paedophiles which seemed to be the suggestion.
I feel that I should complain about this but wonder if DD misinterpreted what she was saying, as I really can't believe a teacher said this. Should I just shut up and ignore it, or fire off an email?

Send the wrong message could mean leisure wear rather than smart?

Have you ever seen Ladette to Lady

Young ladies do not represent themselves in this manner

Frankly, I'd just tell DD that the woman is barking and forget about it.

I agree that it sends the wrong message. Why do girls wear very short skirts? It is inappropriate for school age girls and whether you like it or not is is perceived as tarty/encouraging sexual interest. If I were you I'd be pleased the school were looking out for the girls rather than trying to look for trouble.

If the school are going to take this view they need to just state a skirt length (no more that 2 inch - yes I know schools don't measure in inches any more!)about the knee and leave it at that.

At what age are girls too young to be sending out this supposed sexual message? 11? 9? 6? Should I put my 6 yo in a longer school skirt, for fear of attracting sexual interest?

I totally understand your objection, OP. Fire off an email. You may well be ignored, but I think you need to make your point with the school.

i have noticed some girls skirts are really ridiculously short and these are quite posh schools. surprised me as our local bog standard comp would not allow it

Not sure about this one. I don't agree with girls (or anyone) being told that clothing invites sexual violence. On the other hand, I do think very short skirts are inappropriate for school and invite sexual attention. I have seen the knickers of some girls at our local school, as their skirts are sometimes shorter than the bottom of their knickers!

(I send my DDs to a school which requires knee-length skirts, and anything above the knee, never mind shorter, is considered too short.)

I teach in a secondary school and the girls' skirts are ridiculously short. I ask girls to pull their skirts down constantly- a large number wear them with tights, and the skirts are so short you can see where the tights change colour at the top. It DOES send the wrong message-it says "I do not respect myself". I do not for a minute think that girls who wear short skirts invite sexual violence, but wearing skirts so short that your knickers are practically on show does invite sexual attention, and girls need to be aware of that. And school is not an appropriate place for that.

Was it to do with sex or the fact that they are there to work and flashing knickers is not appropriate at work. (Hmm. Now to tackle the problem of boys with low trousers revealing pants or worse. Boak!)

agree with evil, spend a lot of time asking girls to unroll their skirts. It is done to invite sexual attention, and my lessons are not the place for that, plus i don not want to see thier knickers

Two different things here. Fair enough to make the point that ridiculously short skirts are not acceptable at school. But most definitely NOT acceptable to say anyone other than the culprit is responsible for sexual violence, harassment or intimidation. It doesn't matter what clothes someone is wearing, sexual harassment - or worse - is WRONG.

No teacher in their right mind would ever dream of justifying racist language, abuse or violence. They should apply the same reasoning to every other form of discrimination, including gender.

and if the 'it's all the fault of girls wearing short skirts' brigade were right about sexual violence, women in strict Arab countries where people have to cover would be free from rape and abuse. Sadly they are not.

I agree with Evil as well. It just sends the wrong message. DD's school had a uniform check yesterday. I bet there were a fair few detentions handed out.

Can anyone argue that it's right for teenage girls to be showing their knickers as their skirt is so rolled up?

What are the boys meant to make of it? What message does it give?

It does not forgive rape, nothing does

But still

I got a letter yesterday saying dd's school (she's 13) are now going to be selling skirts to stop the 'short skirt' problem. They will be a kilt type skirt that have a waist panel that stops the skirt being "rolled over" at the waistband. They have also banned the lycra type girl's trousers and say they have to "fall away from the leg". The skirt will cost £20

The boys are meant to be able to think 'gosh, you know what, that girl may be wearing a very short skirt but that still doesn't give me the right to touch without permission'. It's not that difficult.

I really object very strongly to such a dangerous message being sent out to impressionable girls. 'It's all your fault if you get attacked, you were sending out the wrong message'. Women of all ages are raped - do you think 90s are 'asking for it'? Women wearing all sorts of clothes are raped - a pair of baggy jeans is no protection. It is incredibly dangerous to start girls off into adult life believing it is their responsibility to avoid being raped. That is something that is not in their control. Rape is the fault of rapists. Doesn't matter how you behave or how you dress - wearing baggy unflattering clothes does not protect people against sexual violence.

Round our way, it is the girls at the girls private school that wear the shortest skirts.

DD has an ingenious skirt which she can roll up or down according to requirements

"I really object very strongly to such a dangerous message being sent out to impressionable girls"

I am not convinced that this is the message they would be trying to get across. The fact is that exceedingly short skirts are simply inappropriate for school and for the office. Several year 7 parents have said to me that they don't approve of how short the skirts are.

I don't think anyone is suggesting that teenage girls are being given the impression that short skirts = asking to be raped. But teenagers are full of hormones, and both boys AND girls should be taught to dress appropriately. Girls in tiny skirts give the impression that they want to be looked at. It is not necessary to hoik your skirt up so high that your gusset is on show. How many of us would go to work like that? Both girls and boys need to be taught to respect themselves, and dressing appropriately is part of that.

Yup, as I said in my first post, telling pupils they must not wear exceedingly short skirts is fine. But the OP's dd says the teacher told them 'it sends the wrong message' and linked it to sexual violence. That is a. dangerous and b. wrong and c. potentially very damaging.

The OP says her that was her DD's interpretation, not that the female teacher said that short skirts = asking for sexual violence.

But it does send the wrong message regardless of whether some people think it is linked to violence.

Whoah, whoah. They are not being told 'it's all your fault if you get attacked.'
they are being told it sends the wrong message. That message may be: you can look between my legs. I want you to. It's not the message they intend to send. they are too young to know it. But if they wear tiny skirts that give glimpses to men, they will get looked at inappropriately.

I think it's very important for teachers to protect girls from unwanted sexual attention when they are too naive to really understand how sexual attention works.

As long as we live in a society where media and ads suggest that the sexiest look is long thin legs and clothes that almost reveal genitalia, then young girls who have that look will generate a massive amount of sexual interest from men they have no interest in themselves.

I think it is naive and unhelpful to say: 'men must learn not to look.' Why is it repressive to encourage girls not to be too revealing of parts of their body that are bound to arouse sexual interest?

I never say to the students, not do i think it, that it is inviting rape. But i do think very short skirts are inappropriate in the classroom. I apply the same rule to boys, i don't want to see their pants, but oddly at my school we only have a few boys who err on that front, but lots of girls who think appropriate workwear is showing your knicks if you stretch forward for a textbook

OP- your daughter could be going to the school where I work. I don't condone anyone saying a short skirt invites violence, because the statement is simply not true, but I do agree that wearing skirts so short is not acceptable in the school environment, for many reasons.

We are having a "crackdown" pardon the expression, on short skirts and makeup, and the boys with their disheveled look!

the expression is "skirts must be closer to the knees than the knickers"

It's embarrassing to watch as theses girls struggle and wiggle in these skirts, and basically show their knickers when they sit down. Sometimes it appears as if they are trying to out-do each other. Makeup as well, a girl recently came to school with fake eyelashes on. We want them to take a little pride in their appearance, to look professional.

I have to dress to a certain standard at work, I am not allowed to wear many of the clothes that I would wear everyday, it's business attire, so the teaching and support staff are subject to the same rules.

What we are trying to do is put girls on an equal footing here, stop the fashion show and get on with what matters, learning and respect for all.

I am not a prude, I love clothes, I love extreme fashions, but there is a time and a place and school is not it.

Yes and it's clearly important to clarify what the teacher said and to make her aware that even if she didn't say it, at least one pupil has taken away a very disturbing and dangerous message. When you are communicating important messages, it's your job as the person giving that message to reflect on the way it was understood and received, and to adjust your communication if it's not worked the way you intended.

Also, other people have piled in on this thread to add to the 'sends the wrong message' theme. It's really important that we are very careful about this. 'Sending the wrong message' has often been used to excuse sexual violence. Only two weeks ago a judge excused the rape of a 13yo girl by saying she 'looked older' and brought it on herself. Not enough has changed since the days when judges in rape cases used to justify pathetic sentences with the excuse 'well, she was wearing a short skirt...'