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Secondary education

Connect with other parents whose children are starting secondary school on this forum.

Short school skirts "sending the wrong message"

142 replies

BeingFluffy · 18/05/2012 20:56

DD (13) at a Comp had assembly today for girls only. The woman teacher was going on about how some girls wear very short skirts and it "sends the wrong message". From what DD was saying she seemed to be making a link between girls' skirt length and sexual violence. I agree that some girls wear skirts that are no more than belts and it does not look particularly smart, but I really object to that apparently making them more at risk of sexual violence or paedophiles which seemed to be the suggestion.
I feel that I should complain about this but wonder if DD misinterpreted what she was saying, as I really can't believe a teacher said this. Should I just shut up and ignore it, or fire off an email?

OP posts:
boxyfoxy · 18/05/2012 22:44

*these not theses.. it's late!

Bunbaker · 18/05/2012 22:45

Well said boxy

PuppyMonkey · 18/05/2012 22:54

It's just young girls trying to be fashionable. As young girls do. And grown ups will always go Hmmand the world keeps turning.

Loshad · 18/05/2012 23:05

puppy, but school is not the place for fashion, and it is good for schools to enforce dress codes so teenagers do not feel under pressure to conform to ridiculous peer pressure.

PuppyMonkey · 18/05/2012 23:10

Of corse school isn't the place for fashion, but teenagers are rebels. That's their job.

startail · 18/05/2012 23:12

Loads of time is wasted on this.
If you can bend down in a normal lined smart skirt and not show your underwear that's fine.

The stretchy belt things that are decent only by being as tight as hot pants should not be seen out side a night club.

Like wise boys trousers need not show underpants either.

faeriefruitcake · 18/05/2012 23:13

When you have teenage girls wearing less than prostitutes it's embarrassing. As staff we dress appropriately and the students should learn this as well.

Loshad · 18/05/2012 23:15

sure puppy, just as it is my job to enforce standards, not least so that students are let off the pressure to conform because "miss" will tell me off Grin

ravenAK · 18/05/2012 23:18

You just say to all students:

'Flashing your pants in school, which is an environment for work, is inappropriate. Other people, whether students or adults around school, may well find it embarrassing, & frankly, it looks scruffy & as if you haven't any idea how to dress in different contexts - exactly as you would look a complete plank if you went clubbing in THIS indicate own boring teachery garb. Therefore, pull your trousers up, gentleman, & ladies, please ensure your trousers or skirt cover your bum. No-one wants to look at tomorrow's dirty laundry, thank you'.

Absolutely no need to single out the girls or suggest it 'sends the wrong message' with all the woman-blaming guff that implies.

BeingFluffy · 19/05/2012 07:50

Thank you for all your comments. I am still quite angry at the teacher because DD and her friends did definitely get the impression that the teacher was saying short skirts attract perverts and by wearing them, the girls are giving out the wrong message.

I agree that very short skirts look horrible on school girls, but as the school uniform is basically a business suit, I think the message should be that they don't look smart rather than inviting the attention of perves.

OP posts:
yousankmybattleship · 19/05/2012 07:53

OP, I'd say ultimately it doesn't matter why the teacher was saying they shouldn't wear short skirts. If it is a school rule then your DD and her friends need to suck it up and do as they're told. I don't think you'll do your DD any favours by complaining.

GRW · 19/05/2012 07:59

Our local secondary school has actually banned all girls from wearing skirts, because they did not take notice of requests to wear them longer. It caused quite a lot of discussion in our local newspapar.

CailinDana · 19/05/2012 08:06

If there is such a bloody hoo ha about skirts then why not get rid of them altogether the way GRW's local school did? There's no point in requiring the girls to wear something then complaining about how their wearing it - if it's not working, get rid of it. Everyone in the school should wear the same uniform - ie smart work trousers.

heronsfly · 19/05/2012 08:06

I agree with Evil too,I was sitting downstairs on a bus the other day when,a school girl came down the stairs in a very short skirt and nothing at all was left to the imagination !

QueenEdith · 19/05/2012 08:08

How short is short?

I think you need to check also exactly what was said. I would be very, very surprised if a school was saying (directly, or even by implication) that shirt skirts provoke criminal behaviour in others. I think it is very likely that they were talking about appropriate dress and standards. And if you know what was said, you can at home reinforce the good part of this message, and encourage her to think about any parts where your views and those in this presentation diverge (bit like anything in school which includes a subjective component).

I think you also need to find out what was said to the boys whilst the sexes were separate.

AThingInYourLife · 19/05/2012 08:09

Ick! girls look awful in uniform trousers.

Nice knee-length skirts much nicer.

FallenCaryatid · 19/05/2012 08:17

A belt-length skirt is not suitable for a work placement, nor for a school setting. Any more than going topless for males or females when the weather is hot.
We sent back work-placement boys who thought it appropriate to have their underwear on display, and they were shocked that we did, despite the verbal warning and the consequences being set out for them.
Trousers are a useful alternative if you want o stop the hours that are wasted on fussing about clothing being devoted to something more useful.

FallenCaryatid · 19/05/2012 08:18

'Ick! girls look awful in uniform trousers.'

What about boys?

deliataughtme · 19/05/2012 08:19

I agree with much of what has been said. I also agree that if the school has a uniform, the school needs to ensure that girls arrive and leave dressed in the correct uniform. IMO that means speaking to the girls who break the rules directly. I don't understand the stretchy belt/skirt thing. If it isn't the regulation skirt, they should just be sent home to change or given something from the 2nd hand cupboard/lost property cupboard if they claim not to have keys.

I was shocked to receive a first class letter posted to the home of every girl from my daughter's school last term - it must have cost hundreds of pounds and at a time when the school has a huge budget deficit. It reminded parents of the uniform and took a very hard line indeed about skirt length. I was shocked principally because behaviour at the school is declining - only two or three weeks ago five girls were suspended for assault (in the street) on another pupil, and intimidation breached health and safety rules terribly. Even the two who pulled a girl down and bashed her head on the pavement are back at school.

It is time, in my opinion, that schools got their priorities back in the right order. The uniform issues are important. The right to exclude those who pose a danger to others is an even biggger issue. And I do not want to hear headteachers tell me it is because they come from difficult backgrounds - lots of children do - but they behave and they refrain from beating up quieter girls or indeed girls who might be more vulnerable than themselves.

When I went to school the head stood at the main gate every morning, welcoming the girls. At the end of the day the deputy was there to say goodbye. I would like to see more of that, I would like to see a reorganisation of priorities and a return to identifying the difference between right and wrong. In the meantime, for as long as a child who has assaulted another and been unspeakably badly behaved and intimidating for almost two years remains beyond consequence, I would advise any teacher not to attempt to discipline my daughter for forgetting a piece of homework, for having a button undone or for being late to school when there is a signal failure. It doesn't take a great deal of intelligence to work out that a detention for forgetting gym kit is wholly disproportionate when those who assault and potentially put the school at risk of fire are allowed to get away with it with nothing more than a five day fixed term exclusion. Had they been employees they would have been summarily dismissed - 12 months ago.

Unfortunately, my daughter is losing respect for the head; I lost it several months ago and I imagine that is being repeated in schools up and down the land.

CailinDana · 19/05/2012 08:23

Nice knee length skirts might be nicer AThing but the girls won't wear them at knee length so it's not working.

When I was at school they introduced a skirt with massive pleats. If you tried to roll it up it looked absolutely ridiculous so that put an end to the short-skirt problem. Unfortunately the pleated skirts were hideous, so when they introduced trousers for girls a few years later practically all the girls switched to them. They were a hell of a lot nicer.

One school in Limerick famously introduced ankle length skirts.

nkf · 19/05/2012 08:27

Yes to checking what was actually said. But the short skirt on a school uniform does feature in a certain kind of Lolita porn. So the head might be worried that young girls are looking like pornstars rather than schoolchildren.

AThingInYourLife · 19/05/2012 08:28

"What about boys?"

Confused

What about them?

Boys look fine in uniform trousers, since they are designed for boys.

CailinDana · 19/05/2012 08:31

Girls can wear trousers too AThing. I agree though that they should be designed specifically for girls so that they fit right.

BeingFluffy · 19/05/2012 08:36

My daughter agrees with what the teacher said, and thought that girls look "slutty" (DDs words) which bloody shocked me as I couldn't understand where she got it from. She and her friends do not alter their skirt length which is just above the knee. Some girls alter it to bum length. In fact I have walked behind girls from the school in the street and you can actually see the gusset of their tights.

Hearsay from daughter re the boys was that they were apparently told they were very rude generally. They were also told that wearing their trousers down sent out the wrong signal (which was interpreted by the girls as that it was also sexual; but though I thought it derived from belts being removed from those in custody). Anyway I will contact the teacher and let her know that while I agree with a smart uniform DD has got completely the wrong impressionl

OP posts:
StealthPolarBear · 19/05/2012 08:45

excellent suggested wording ravenAK

Agree with edam and Loshad

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