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Secondary education

Connect with other parents whose children are starting secondary school on this forum.

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Original poster

Shocked regarding standards of attire

36 replies

bronze · 28/09/2010 20:28

I left secondary school 13 years ago so completely understand if times have changed.
Lately there have been a lot of programs on tv about education and following real schools and classes. One thing I have noticed in all of them are some things we would never have got away with. Skirts are knicker length; very obvious makeup (we were allowed none); shirts hanging out; high heeled shoes; ties so loose you could fit 6 necks through; ties so short the back end could be wrapped around the waist twice, the list goes on.

Now either they're focusing on very slack schools, things have changed a lot, my school was very strict or I'm a complete fuddy duddy.
Please tell me. I'm dreading my children moving up the secondary if this is what school is like now. Of course I know uniform is not anything but I do think it is a fairly good reflection on standards.
Or am I wrong again?

OP posts:

senua · 28/09/2010 20:35

A school near to us has changed their tie recently. You know those elasticated already-tied ties that they used to wear in infant/junior school? - well, the Secondary school specifies those. Hey presto: no ties "so loose you could fit 6 necks through", everyone has the regulation fit and they have not found a way to subvert it yet.

greenlotus · 28/09/2010 20:38

Sorry bronze, all the things you list were in evidence at my secondary school and I left it a lot longer than 13 years ago, possibly not to such an extreme but my sister definitely got into trouble for high heels, makeup and skirt length in 1985.

muggglewump · 28/09/2010 20:40

That sounds like the school I went to!

Original poster

bronze · 28/09/2010 20:42

We were made to go and scrub faces if makeup was in evidence though people tried many a time. We were also made to tuck our shirts in and retie our ties, even if people then went around the corner and disassembled themselves again.
The school at least made the effort though whereas these ones I've been seeing the teachers haven't said a thing even when the makeup has been inch thick or the skirt indecent.
Persistent offenders got sides or detentions. Some were even sent home to change and then had to do detentions to make up the time they missed.

I had assumed it was normal as the other two schools in my town were similar. It seems not.

OP posts:

alicatte · 28/09/2010 20:55

This is really what they look like. I had some experience of Hertswood, on tonight, in a previous incarnation. They really do look like that.

I did that 'big tie' thing in a very nice school back in the 70's and no one ever said a thing to me - it was seen as 'personal expression'. I didn't behave like those children though. Well no-one did at my school but then as I said it was one of the high achieving variety.

usualsuspect · 28/09/2010 21:06

I see no problem with teenagers expressing themselves ..years of looking like an old fuddy duddy ahead of them I hate school uniform

Mutt · 28/09/2010 21:06

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

Original poster

bronze · 28/09/2010 21:16

U.S.
I prefer no uniform to badly worn uniform.

I wonder how some schools manage to enforce it and others don't. As we filed into class the teacher would just say shirt Bob, hair back Jane, sort your tie out Nick and we would do it.
We did big tie etc but not to such extremes and it was stamped on.

Alicatte- Hertswood tonight was the most recent in a line of them. The school standards otherwise didn't look too bad. How difficult would it have been to make looking smart part of the secret student. Not very I wouldn't think.

I guess my school (also in Herts) was of the high achieving types too, it was just me who wasn't a [n academic] high achiever.

OP posts:

usualsuspect · 28/09/2010 21:18

I'm glad my ds's school didn't focus all its energy's on uniform, at all those rows of clone like teenagers

Algebra18MinusPiEquals16 · 28/09/2010 21:21

It is a world away from my old (grammar) school. I much prefer smart uniforms! The primary schools here seem to have pretty high standards.

usualsuspect · 28/09/2010 21:22

I never really wanted my children to look smart ..wasn't really my priority

Original poster

bronze · 28/09/2010 21:23

Haven't studies shown that uniforms improve behaviour? ( I may have dreamed that , I have very odd dreams)

OP posts:

mnistooaddictive · 28/09/2010 21:26

When I was at school in the eighties. very long narrow skirts were in fashion and they made it virtually impossible to get up and down stairs. We had a Maximum skirt length. There are also strict regulations about excluding students for appearance. You can't exlude for hairstyle now and as students know this, you can't do anything!

TheProfiteroleThief · 28/09/2010 21:27

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

ColdComfortFarm · 28/09/2010 21:28

Ah, my yummy niece, who wears makeup every day to school, has just got a whopping clutch of A*s and is no trouble at all. It's very trivial stuff really.

southeastastra · 28/09/2010 21:29

my son was always very smart at his shite comp. (which he is now doing very academic a levels at) so stick that up yer bum.

i think it's very easy to focus on a few scruffs and then make up your mind about the whole comp system (if you're looking for something to moan and pick holes about)

alicatte · 28/09/2010 21:29

They do say that bronze.

Look on the Government Standards Site - I think it has some links. From what I remember, they said that uniform colour also affects behaviour, I think red was not a good choice but cannot remember anything else.

Where I work now uniform is enforced with iron discipline.

usualsuspect · 28/09/2010 21:32

For goodness sake,how can the colour of a uniform make a difference..straw boater anyone?

alicatte · 28/09/2010 21:37

I really can't remember what the study said, or how they did it. It was about 4 years ago, I heard about it from my headteacher at the time.

Original poster

bronze · 28/09/2010 21:38

sea- thats why I was asking if it was normal as it was different to my experiences at my state secondary. My sil is/was a teacher and she was strict on uniform too so I was trying to establish what was the norm as the only others I have seen have been on tv recently (also the teens in my road who look like they forgot which items of clothes go on which body part)
I have to admit I don't like it but my husband went to public school and I can pick a whole load of holes in that too and his parents paid for that!

OP posts:

scurryfunge · 28/09/2010 21:45

My DS' school appears to be quite strict...must wear blazers, ties , shirts tucked in, top button done up, no jewellery, no unorthodox hairstyles or make up.

It is a bog standard large comprehensive. I love the fact that they enforce these standards as it leaves no room for interpretation or argument. Yet....the pupils still adapt their dress subtlety.

I wear a uniform to work and even as adults we try to customise our uniform. There is an innate desire to be an individual.

cory · 28/09/2010 23:14

My dd's secondary has no tie, a sweater instead of blazer- and the best behaviour in town. On the other hand, our catchment school which insists on white shirt, blazer and tie has severe discipline problems and chaotic lessons and awful GCSE results. And we do not live in a deprived area, it's just poor management from what I can see. So im-limited-e it is perfectly possible to be organised about uniform and still leave absolutely everything else in a mess. In fact, I would say that around here, you can gauge the standards of a school by the laxity of the uniform: the smarter they are, the more trouble there is.

Madsometimes · 29/09/2010 11:49

Two of the schools I am looking at have a very lax uniform. The first one we have seen and already discounted. We see the next one tonight.

I have to say that I am influenced by the uniform. I have a dd, and I do not want her to go to school in tight leggings, a belt skirt and purple DM's with a school polo slung on the top. I know that I am probably BU, but I cannot help it! I think I would prefer no uniform at all.

deaddei · 29/09/2010 13:21

DD (yr 9)was told the other day to roll down her skirt- it wasn't rolled up at all, just she has 33 inch inside leg and the school skirts do not come in different lengths!
I rolled my skirt up way back in the early 70s and I consider myself to have been a "good" girl. It's what we all did.

Shodan · 29/09/2010 13:41

Ds1's (state) school has quite strict uniform rules and enforces them, giving out 'uniform detentions' if the rules aren't adhered to. Their philosophy is that a child that looks like a scruff, behaves like a scruff. Or something like that anyway.

However, 'tis nothing compared to the rules concerning uniform at my old school - things like all skirt hems had to touch the floor when kneeling for Prayers, no over-the-knee socks allowed (remember those?) and if the games mistress spotted them when you were in Assembly (quite obviously peeking up cross-legged girls' skirts) you had to stand up and roll them down to below knee level. No jewellery or make up ever, no eating in the street in uniform- the list was quite extensive!

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