Scottish Borders or Dumfries and Galloway for move from England?

[KievLoverTwo]

Hi all,

I am picking the brain of my almost Glasgow resident friend for opinions, but I thought I'd better ask more folks.

The OH and I would like to move to Scotland. We had kind of settled on the Borders as location (after seeing it on the telly - how very original of us) - firstly, because my OH has always been absolutely infatuated with Scotland, and secondly because we don't really have anything tying us to England anymore. We've been looking at houses for 14 months as well, the English prices are just still far too high for our needs (400-450k for something half decent - due to disability we need around 1200+ sq ft and at least three bedrooms, two of which have to be large doubles).

So, I just wanted to get some opinions on some pros and cons of either location, really, please.

We don't need schools, nor public transport. We don't need a massive town for shopping near us, I'd actually prefer somewhere with a decent butcher, fishmonger, grocer etc, or access to a really decent farm shop within an hour. As long as we can have freezers in a garage they don't even really need to be all that close to us. I think I'd prefer not to be desperately isolated and remote at this point. We've spent 2.5 years being remote in rentals and I do miss people a little bit. His office is in Manchester but he's not all that fussed about what sort of faff it takes him to go in, because it's so infrequent (he tells me Lockerbie has a direct train to Manchester though).

It would be nice to have a little garden but nothing vast.

We're trying to keep costs down because a) we're old and this is our first house, we need to seriously work on our pensions - ages 48 and 42). I don't and can't work, so whilst he earns high, there's one income for retirement planning. We will move with a small amount of savings above 10% deposit*. He's going to get whacked hard for extra tax in moving to Scotland (which I've no problem with, I'm just trying to be pragmatic about the future).

*not moving is not an option; the pair of us are borderline going postal in our current rental and he absolutely will not rent again

We found a house we like in Peebles, I've seen a house I quite like in Coldstream, and one that would just about do for a few years in Kelso (which would have a v low mortgage, but also zero garden and the ground floor is maybe a bit too snug). Then we happened upon D&G whilst looking at where my mate lives, and I can't believe how much cheaper it is than Borders.

So I guess I'm really looking at views of why one location might be better or worse than another and opinions on locations please, really.

I'd happily go further North (and we might end up in the highlands in 10 years' time), but I'm trying to be realistic: there are vast weather differences (we're in NW England), and we should probably ease ourselves into the cold gently! Plus he can always say to work 'well I can get to work quicker from X than I can from our rental' if they object to him moving to Scotland. Which sort of has to be a semi consideration for now, because his industry lost 300k people last year, and are due to lose 150k this year.

Thanks for any and all thoughts.

(I suppose I would be most comfortable with a max budget of 300k due to the tax differences)

Oh, and I loathe new builds with a passion, if that's of any relevance at all :)

(not very good at being brief, am I? Sorry! Thanks again)

I know people in Innerleithen in the SB and it seems a nice friendly little place, and set in beautiful countryside. It's near Peebles and handy for Edinburgh.
Not on the railway line though.

I definitely prefer the Borders to D&G. Everything in D&G feels very far apart and there's just not enough happening there for my liking. There's a bit more going on in the Borders and better train links.

I suppose the golden rule to remember is that places are cheaper for a reason - fewer amenities, job opportunities access to cities, etc and therefore less demand for housing. For some people that's absolutely fine and suits them, but for me it wouldn't suit at all. The parts of Scotland that are cheap are not the parts that appeal to me, but they may suit you.

Out of those definitely Kelso or east coast.

Gala is not very nice, nor Hawick. I don't know Coldstream. Selkirk is ok.
How about Jedburgh? Not as nice as Kelso but cheaper.

That's the first thumbs down for Galashiels. Would you mind saying what you don't like about it, please?

Can't remember what put me off about Jedburgh. Might've been something about politics. But then if I'm a staunch leftie moving to a mostly Tory county, I guess I'm just gonna have to get used to that. It's not as though there's a huge difference between Conservative and Labour these days anyway, is it?

Shrug

Have you thought about Perth shire- much better connected and still rural.Prob get to Manchester just as quick by public transport.

The other half says it is too far North - at least for this move, anyway.

See I would disagree - near Central belt is way more connected for everything.

An example - small village, short drive to station, 20 mins to hospital, amazing country on doorsteps, close to Glasgow and Edinburgh and shopping in Stirling.

Link failed! This one

I used to live in Jedburgh - I don’t remember it being a politically right wing place!! There is less cultural stuff going on than Kelso etc. I wouldn’t discount Gala as it’s better connected with the railway - tweedbank or outlying villages nicer than the centre. Also Lauder/stow as nearer to Edinburgh.

I agree with Perthshire. It's rural and so very affordable in pockets, but so, so much closer to everything I consider good in Scotland (aka civilisation). Sorry non-central-belters 😀

Cocoa Black is in Peebles and that's reason enough to move there for me. Have relatives in Dumfries and yes the town centre is awful.

Peebles is so lovely, you might also like Biggar.

Personally I love D and G but I don’t live in Dumfries itself which as many have said is quite run down. But if you travel further west along the Solway coast there are some lovely areas. If you’re looking for peace and quiet then this is the place for you. Kirkudbright mentioned above is a really great small town with loads of activities to suit everyone and thriving community admittedly pensioner top heavy but everyone is very friendly regardless of your age. Castle Douglas is another small town, it’s well resourced with 3 butchers, visiting fishmonger, supermarkets, cafes, the all important farm shop, hardware shop, hairdressers, gift shops, craft shops, clothes shops, pet shop, post office etc. I’m not sure I’d live in it but there are some lovely villages around it including some on the sea; Kippford is lovely but mainly Abnbs, ditto Rockcliffs, Auchencairn is by the sea and has a great village shop, other villages in land Gelston Bridge Of Dee and Lauriston are worth looking at further afield New Galloway has a shop art centre and an active community so does Monieve, Gate House of Fleet also has shops etc. Public transport is an issue Lockerbie is the best station for Glasgow and Edinburgh and from Kirkudbright realistically you’re looking at an hour by the time you’ve parked etc.
Dumfries and Galloway is very rural with a large farming community, good employment opportunities i.e. those paying at the very least a reasonable salary are quite limited this is reflected in property prices. In parts, perhaps surprisingly, it has the lowest population density of the whole of Scotland, and is significantly less popular with tourists than many other areas in Scotland. Many people who move here from England love the peace and quiet, our beaches are are totally unspoilt; on a busy day warm day during the school holiday my most popular local beach might have 50 people on it, you can walk for miles, and not see another person, we have amazing wildlife here and stunning views. A lot of people move here from England and find a warm welcome most say nothing would persuade them to move to to the noise and hustle and bustle of England.

Should just add many bang on about paying more tax in Scotland but according to the website listen to tax man I pay £10 a month more tax in Scotland than I would in England for the same salary.

I’m not a fan of Galashiels for a big move either. It’s still very deprived and a bit disjointed. Moffat is somewhere that’s very much “are you from these parts?”

Yup, that's Moffat! Nothing there either. People visit as a stopover when they are on the way to the Highlands. I think that's about right, one night is enough.

I just checked the stamp duty calculator and it appears to be double if buying a place in Scotland vs England 😲

Friend moved from Kelso to Berwick upon Tweed nine years ago at 63.
It was all about better transport links and infra structure for him.

Hospital currently being expanded in Berwick. His life is filled with train journeys, beach walks and golf. Berwick town centre a bit bleak but the out of town shopping area has a new M&S and Lidl under construction. Has everything but a Sainsbury's.

I'll try to keep an open mind about Berwick upon Tweed.

Really, it's his absolute dream to be in England and not Scotland, but I sometimes have to remind him that we need to be pragmatic because the increase in tax is MASSIVE (he's a high earner), we're old, and only just buying our first house.

I'd been keeping my eye on Carlisle as a two step journey to getting to Scotland for a while (say, Carlisle for 5 years to pay off a bunch of equity then Scotland when the tax increase matters less), but the housing stock isn't really doing it for me.

Saying that, there isn't really very much that's nice coming to the market at all, anywhere, right now!

(I am fussy, yes)

I'll try not to.

I am now suffering from 'too many options' syndrome! It's really hard to move house when you don't have your heart completely set on one specific place.

Future proofing and keeping it 'fun' is also important.
I remember looking at one of these in this development with my friend which also had a lift.
views with lift
To rein your search back, look at transport connections.
I'd be tempted to get the LNER & LUMO route map out and look at all the stations and work back from there.
It's so good to be able to get a train to the airport. My friend can go on holiday solo from either Edinburgh or Newcastle airport.
Definitely go LNER / LUMO routes rather than Avanti!

That's absolutely gorgeous!

Future proofing is somewhat important, but I still think we'll go somewhere initially that has SOME stuff with a view to probably moving further away from civilisation once things have stabilised in his industry, and he's more able to dictate absolutely not coming into the office, or working for himself. At that point, we'll go more rural, but look for a really good village community.

I've found my dream home now. Now, how to crowdfund 500k to fund the rest of it...? https://www.rightmove.co.uk/properties/140504354#/?channel=RES_BUY

Lovely, but gas & electricity would be startling! You'd need to crowd fund that, too.

I said:

Really, it's his absolute dream to be in England and not Scotland,

I meant:

it's his absolute dream to be in Scotland and not England

The other thing to bear in mind is that the Scottish house buying process is FAR less tedious than England. Just browsing Berwick and the first house I like, the agent wants a 10% non refundable deposit.

My Scotland dwelling friend moved into his house just under 8 weeks after registering interest. Here, it can easily take 5 months, and gazumping and gazundering or the seller changing their mind and pulling out is absolutely rife.

I wouldn't care about being warm when surrounded by that much beauty!