Is Scotland becoming anti Semitic?

[boompah]

Jewish friends thinking of leaving Glasgow for London. Feeling there has been a political shift where they are feeling isolated.

I find it so sad and not something I've been aware of but don't want to diminish their experiences.

Anyone hearing similar comments?

Excuse my ignorance on this, but isn't Israel the original home of the Jews until they were driven out? I thought that was the whole point of resettling there. It's where they are from as a tribe?

@StarryEyeSurprise and therein lies the tragedy; British Jews moving to Israel to be surrounded by despotic countries who want them destroyed. But it’s the only Jewish state and while Israel thrives, there cannot be another Holocaust.

@dementedma

Glasgow is rife with bigotry. Sectarian, anti-English...unpleasant place. And yes, I do know it well and still have some friends who live there, although others have moved away for the reasons above

Quite.

My parents are from Glasgow. My granny used to go orange marching FFS. The estate where my dad grew up had the fences painted red, white and blue in a political statement. Even now my parents are still quite openly anti-catholic (read that as Irish)

@boompah

Excuse my ignorance on this, but isn't Israel the original home of the Jews until they were driven out? I thought that was the whole point of resettling there. It's where they are from as a tribe?

Yes, Israel is the ancestral homeland of the Jewish people. Palestinians were kicked out of neighbouring Arab countries but we don’t see the hate directed at Jordan. It’s double standards and ignorance.

Thank you @Duke4 That's what I thought.

What a nasty thread OP. Look forward to seeing some actual evidence for your claims?

As for Glasgow being a terrible bigoted place - half my family go back generations here including Irish folk. They wouldn't touch an orange walk with a barge pole and in fact my mother once had the walk banned in our hometown near the city.

So some of us are actually decent and not scum like so many on this thread seem to think.

And supporting Palestine is not anti semitic

Are you saying that because Glasgow supports Palestine and abhors Israel's behaviour, this makes our city anti Semitic? What utter crap.

I was talking in reference to what a family I know have said. It's not my experience.

One comment at work included "you're so nice, you wouldn't know you're Jewish". Another was from a neighbour over misdirected post, said with a laugh and wagging finger "you people, always trying to take what's not yours"

Maybe people are feeling bolder in saying what they think. A bit like Brexit making racists more comfortable.

It's sad.

Are you saying that because Glasgow supports Palestine and abhors Israel's behaviour

The whole of Glasgow - everyone?????
I think you've caught the 'The People of Scotland' bug from Nicola

Oh, and the Scottish people love immmigrants and aren't racist according to the SNP and want people to move here (hence the riots when the home office tried to arrest the 2 Hindu men)
So they'd better rephrase their welcome to their non-racist country and specificy which immigrants they want - obviously Hindus are ok.

They were Sikhs I think, but the presumption was that they were Muslim hence all the shite about it being Eid. Cos if you are brown then you must be Muslim right? Not racist my arse.

It's not all of Scotland though, probably not even all of Glasgow.

So much gaslighting on this subject. It’s pointless arguing for Palestine now on this forum. You aren’t allowed to criticise Israel, the frothing at the mouth hysteria begins at the very hint of being anti Israel Government actions.
Oh and believe it or not people who do support the Palestinians who are living in an apartheid system and having their homes and land stolen from them, are capable of supporting other oppressed people around the world too. I and many others I know speak out about all sorts of situations around the world.
You do have to wonder though about people who justify what is happening to the Palestinian people by saying “yeah well lots of other Countries treat people like shit so don’t criticise Israel” what kind of logic is that??!
The threat of (and repercussions of) being called anti Semitic is a serious one, everyone knows that. It can be an effective way of silencing people and shutting down discussion.
This thread is another example.

@MissyB1

The thread is asking if others have noticed a rise in anti Semitism in Scotland. Not sure how that is gaslighting?

Jews make up a tiny proportion of the Scottish population and a very tiny proportion of the world. 2.9 billion Christians, 1.8 billion Muslims, 15 million Jews. Hardly weighted in their favour on any level anywhere.

They are a very vulnerable group as history repeatedly has shown. When they voice concern I think we should listen.

They are a very vulnerable group as history repeatedly has shown. When they voice concern I think we should listen.

Absolutely.

[quote boompah]@MissyB1

The thread is asking if others have noticed a rise in anti Semitism in Scotland. Not sure how that is gaslighting?

Jews make up a tiny proportion of the Scottish population and a very tiny proportion of the world. 2.9 billion Christians, 1.8 billion Muslims, 15 million Jews. Hardly weighted in their favour on any level anywhere.

They are a very vulnerable group as history repeatedly has shown. When they voice concern I think we should listen. [/quote]
Plenty of posters gaslighting on the thread.

I don’t deny there will be anti semetics in Scotland or anywhere else, same as there will be racists anti Catholics blah blah dickheads exist everywhere unfortunately. Doesn’t mean we all need to panic. I haven’t seen anyone provide evidence that there is a credible serious increase.

I don’t know why the number of Jews in the world makes anyone supporting the Palestinians anti semetic though?

I agree that it could be hard to make a case that anti semitism was on the rise only in glasgow, but there's plenty of evidence it's on the rise everywhere - the papers have only recently had stories of awful anti Jewish abuse being shouted at marches, alongside what happened in the Labour Party.

@MissyB1

So much gaslighting on this subject. It’s pointless arguing for Palestine now on this forum. You aren’t allowed to criticise Israel, the frothing at the mouth hysteria begins at the very hint of being anti Israel Government actions. Oh and believe it or not people who do support the Palestinians who are living in an apartheid system and having their homes and land stolen from them, are capable of supporting other oppressed people around the world too. I and many others I know speak out about all sorts of situations around the world. You do have to wonder though about people who justify what is happening to the Palestinian people by saying “yeah well lots of other Countries treat people like shit so don’t criticise Israel” what kind of logic is that??! The threat of (and repercussions of) being called anti Semitic is a serious one, everyone knows that. It can be an effective way of silencing people and shutting down discussion. This thread is another example.

So much ignorance here, where to start. Probably best you look up the internationally accepted definition of antisemitism. You absolutely can criticise Israel- I do - but don’t do it antisemitically. And try not to lie.

@MissyB1

“ Doesn’t mean we all need to panic. I haven’t seen anyone provide evidence that there is a credible serious increase. ”

500% increase not enough to for you? (CST figures)

@MissyB1

Btw it’s “antisemites”, not “anti semitics”. There is no apartheid in Israel therefore your ignorance is there for all to see in more ways than one. Go well.

According to Human rights watch;

On the basis of its research, Human Rights Watch concludes that the Israeli government has demonstrated an intent to maintain the domination of Jewish Israelis over Palestinians across Israel and the OPT. In the OPT, including East Jerusalem, that intent has been coupled with systematic oppression of Palestinians and inhumane acts committed against them. When these three elements occur together, they amount to the crime of apartheid.

Can read the report in detail here

B’Tselem and Israeli human rights group has also called Israel an apartheid regime here

[quote Duke4]@MissyB1

Btw it’s “antisemites”, not “anti semitics”. There is no apartheid in Israel therefore your ignorance is there for all to see in more ways than one. Go well.[/quote]
No one is saying there's apartheid in Israel itself ( occupation yes - East Jerusalem and some of The West Bank).

The Israeli Government has apartheid policies in regards to people living in Gaza.

For example, the Human Sciences Research Council (HSRC) of South Africa reported on Israel's practices in the occupied Palestinian territories under international law. The report noted that one of the most 'notorious' aspects of the Apartheid policy was the 'racial enclave policy' manifested in the Black Homelands called bantustans, and added: "As the apartheid regime in South Africa, Israel justifies these measures under the pretext of 'security'.

You must surely condone the Israeli Government 's strategy in Gaza?

Also in regards to your earlier comment of Israel being a 'Jewish state'. The problem with this terminology is that a fifth of the population of Israel are not Jews. Also, parts of Jerusalem are as important for Muslims as they are for Jews. See The Mount of Olives.

[quote Duke4]@MissyB1

Btw it’s “antisemites”, not “anti semitics”. There is no apartheid in Israel therefore your ignorance is there for all to see in more ways than one. Go well.[/quote]
So what if it’s “anti semites” exactly what what deep meaningful point are you trying (and spectacularly failing) to make with that little gem?

Oh and the Israeli Government has apartheid policies which impact on Palestinian lives. Deny it till you’re blue in the face, that won’t change the truth.

Go well yourself.

@StarryEyeSurprise
So herein lies the problem: surely I must condemn (assume you meant this, rather than condone, as you wrote?) the Israeli government re Gaza? Absolutely. But why should British Jews be browbeaten to condemn a country they cannot even vote in? A country they have a deep connection with, as Jews, a country which is persistently demonised. The creepy obsession with Israel is troubling when other states with worse human rights abuses are ignored, revered even. Have you read the Hamas charter? This is not whataboutery , this is at the heart of contemporary antisemitism.