Scotsnet does not represent Scotland

[kamalasshaman]

At a time when polls are showing unprecedented support for independence and even John Curtice agrees the polls are clear, why is Scotsnet such a bastion of unionist opinions? Is it just due to the demographic of Mumsnet? Why has this site become such a right wing enclave?

Ah I see so you're going to be pedantic about the precise definition of the end point rather than address the real issue, which is that the SNP's blueprint for an Indy Scotland means austerity for decades.

Given that report was from the party that wants to persuade us to vote for Indy and produced pre covid god knows how bad it would actually be now?!?!?

From the SNP's economic adviser. Oil was not a bonus it was baked into their numbers.

www.google.co.uk/amp/s/www.thecourier.co.uk/fp/news/politics/scottish-politics/381886/oil-revenues-were-not-a-bonus-during-indyref-admits-snp-economic-adviser/amp/

@Graffitiqueen

Ah I see so you're going to be pedantic about the precise definition of the end point rather than address the real issue, which is that the SNP's blueprint for an Indy Scotland means austerity for decades.

Given that report was from the party that wants to persuade us to vote for Indy and produced pre covid god knows how bad it would actually be now?!?!?

You realise we're living under austerity now, yes? With no end date in sight?

I still don't agree with the 'decades ' point and feel like I'm hitting my head off a brick wall with this convo.

Can we agree to disagree?

https://www.reuters.com/article/uk-health-coronavirus-britain-economy/sunak-no-return-to-austerity-in-new-spending-plan-idUKKBN28209P?edition-redirect=ca

https://www.google.co.uk/amp/s/www.bbc.com/news/amp/uk-53207700

How can we return to austerity if we're under it now?

We can agree to disagree, but I can post you link after link after link of pro and anti Indy analysis saying that the SNP's blueprint for an Indy Scotland means austerity.

Why would I vote for that?! Why would I vote for my job to be moved out of Scotland?!

We've been in austerity for a decade in the UK and I have missed the memo to say we'd come out the other side . There has been nothing but cuts. One poorly worded headline doesn't negate an economica fact. Austerity also will continue no matter how Rishi Sunak dresses it up. As it will for near enough every country post coronavirus.

I'd rather deal with that in an independent Scotland where we could elect a government who actually gives a fuck rather than with a never ending Tory government who don't. Abs no I wouldn't vote SNP in an independent Scotland.

I've only got a paltry A level in economics so shouldn't comment but the idea that 'austerity' is fixed effect (or 'instability') and not something that can increase because of the need for more cuts due to independence just doesn't add up.

I don't understand the people who think that having exactly their choice govt (because Indy Scotland is always left leaning obviously in this imagining) in charge of a much smaller pie is a good idea.

Ireland has massively boosted its economy by slashing corporation tax (12.5 percent) and relying more on personal taxation - hardly the socialist dream to get even less out of big companies is it? But hell at least they don't rely on the UK.

So you would vote for it because it'd be "oor austerity"? At least we're clear then you'd vote for our country to be poorer. Nationalism is a poison.

Jesus @Graffitiqueen no I would vote for a government that would have different priorities. Austerity doesn't always mean that people need to be poorer. Cuts can be made in other places. Poison? That's a laugh.

And I'm not conceding to the suggestion that there would be significant austerity as a result of independence. I'm talking about the normal period of austerity we are already in that will be exacerbated by covid.

Not to forget Brexit.

Who would you vote for once Scotland is independent, though? If there are good politicians in Scotland, ready to take over from the SNP and make a success of things in what would be incredibly challenging circumstances, they're keeping a very low profile. There is absolutely no guarantee that Scotland would get a good government, just because it's not under the control of Westminster.

It would get a government that it actually voted for. I would probably vote Green or Labour if they actually attempted to get their acts together.
I think there are a few talented Scottish politicians actually. If independence was achieved I think there would be a not insignificant reshuffling of allegiances as well.

And surely you've got to wonder, why hasn't the SNP launched its nordic nirvana income taxes for nordic style services already? Why are we waiting for independence when our income falls as a nation to do that?

I hope you're right kurt as mumsnet aside most people do think it'll be ok. Let's hope the groupthink knows better than the economists and think you're right that at some point we've all made our minds up.

Well, as you say in your post, kurt, Green and Labour have not yet atttempted to get their acts together. Scottish politics is a shitshow. And yet you somehow think that talent will emerge, create a viable party, and tackle separation from the UK and the continuation of Brexit and whatever other crap there is to deal with, all competently?

Although I don't want independence, I think it would be interesting to see what kind of government an independent Scotland would vote for (but not interested enough to vote for independence to find out!) - I often think we might be a bit shocked to see a more (small c) conservative govt than many would expect - indeed a not inconsiderate number of people in Scotland voted Conservative in the last election.

One of my major criteria would be that the party knows what a woman is, so that rules out SNP/Greens/Lib Dems. I'm waiting to see which way Labour jump.

As far as a govt I actually voted for, well, I haven't got that either in Scotland or the UK.

I've just said I think there are plenty of competent politicians.

I think it's the perfect situation for young political talent to emerge.

There were economists who were for an independent Scotland in 2014.

When the current economic case is laid bare for the next referendum I'll look at what a range of experts think then as well.

Until that point and using my own common sense, what little intelligence I've managed to scrape together, and case studies of several similar countries I'm going to say that Scotland does have the economic viability to go it alone. I can't see why it wouldn't.

@reprehensibleme I think you're absolutely right. I think that some of our Tories are more talented politicians than many at Westminster. Ruth Davidson for example had the potential to be an excellent politician until she sold out. There was a point where she was almost going to stand up to Boris and I almost had a bit of respect for her.

Certainly some economists, but not most. The situation is worse than 2014 - we'll see.

@Graffitiqueen

So you would vote for it because it'd be "oor austerity"? At least we're clear then you'd vote for our country to be poorer. Nationalism is a poison.

You do realise that the UK Government are deeply nationalistic ? Hugely in fact. You did have your eyes and ears open during the last 6 years, yeah? Hostile environment, disgusting refugee policies, removal of Erasmus because it doesn't sit with their 'stopping all links to the EU' focus.

[quote kurtrussellsbeard]@reprehensibleme I think you're absolutely right. I think that some of our Tories are more talented politicians than many at Westminster. Ruth Davidson for example had the potential to be an excellent politician until she sold out. There was a point where she was almost going to stand up to Boris and I almost had a bit of respect for her. [/quote]
Yeah, this is what's wrong Scottish politics - there's too many opposition politicians who aren't working for Scotland as they want to please their boss enough that they'll be given a seat in The House of Lords.

I didn't vote for the current government and I didn't votefor Brexit. Sorry to disappoint you, my position on both is entirely consistent.

The current government can be voted out. Scexit is irreversible.

Tbh I often wonder if the SNP are really 'working for Scotland' - so many daft policies, independence at all costs.

Oh, so the UK's going back into the EU if Labour get in. ? Must have missed that.

I wonder too reprehensible. Pushing for a referendum in the middle of a global pandemic is absolute insanity.

Where did I mention brexit being reversible?🙄