Christmas restrictions

[babygroups]

What's your predictions on what NS will allow for Christmas? Still no mixing households? Cap on number of people? Just interested in seeing what other people think the rules will be by then.

@OOAOML

John Major was mocked a lot at the time and there were quite a few Tory sleaze episodes - but it was a different era when politicians resigned a bit more. The news cycle felt slower (this may have been because we didn't have 24 hour news and social media).

My thoughts on the Tories in 1997 and Labour in 2010 was that they'd been in power too long. My personal theory is that parties need to be regularly out of power to go and refresh themselves. You can see it here with the SNP, I don't know enough about Wales and NI to say.

I do remember him being mocked, just not a figure of ridicule in the same way? Most of the ridicule I recall was him being boring/dull/grey man.

Agree re needing a regular refresh and you can absolutely see it with SNP just now.

@SDTGisAnEvilWolefGenius. I have my own views but appreciate that some people are more law abiding, have other issues at play or different circumstances from me.

I think a measured approach would be to firstly establish what their 1st choice would be. If that is them all coming home then a risk managed plan would be that they all come home for at least 7 days and they don't socialise outwith your group for 7 days, or they come for a lesser time but don't socialise outside their normal group for 7 days when they go home. Most people would show any symptoms within 7 days.

Obviously if anyone did show symptoms you'd need to move to whatever the rules were at that point.

Yes it was a long time ago and my view is probably skewed by the fact I was listening to an awful lot of radio comedy slagging him off. Seem to remember a lot about him being dull and unable to control his MPs. I was a student in 1992 and remember lots of surprise amongst friends that he won the election and by 1997 and it really felt like he was just limping towards inevitable defeat.

I've been more impressed with him as an 'elder statesman' than I was at the time.

@SDTGisAnEvilWolefGenius

This is pretty much top of my Things I’m Fretting About list.

Usually all three of my adult sons come to us for Christmas. The plan was the same this year, with ds1 bringing his fiancée - but under the current rules, none of them can come.

Ds1 and his fiancée live together, but can’t go to her parents this Christmas, because her brother and family will be there. Ds2 lives alone, but has a girlfriend, and ds3 is a student who lives with his girlfriend in a privately rented flat, not Halls of Residence.

If Nicola changes the rules to allow students to come home, that will apply to ds3 - but if students aren’t allowed home, will that be just students in Halls of Residence, or all students?

Ds2 is a teacher, so is probably the highest risk of all three of them for being in touch with someone Covid positive - so what does he do at Christmas? He has a standing invitation to go to his girlfriend’s family, and ewe would love to have him here - but in either case, he’d be breaking the rules as they stand at the moment (though maybe not at Christmas, if the rules change).

And I don’t know what would feel worst - having just one of the three of them at home for Christmas, and knowing that one is with someone else’s family, and the other is having Christmas with just his fiancée and their puppy, or having two of them here, and worrying that ds1 will feel left out (because it seems pretty clear already that it isn’t going to be possible for them to come - I don’t see the rules changing that much).

The whole thing is frying my brain.

Can you ask them what they'd prefer? You might find one of them doesn't mind staying at home with his girlfriend and having a cozy Xmas, the other might be happy to spend the day with the in-laws. What I'm trying to say is rather than get yourself in a knot, see what suits them first before trying to sort something out.

(and I say this as a mum if student boys who would be devastated not to see them on Xmas day, but trying to be an adult about it)

Agree with @OOAOML and @StatisticallyChallenged about politics needing a regular refresh. It seems that after being in power for a while any party gets in a rut and stops trying really, and the SNP are well past their sell by date. If the independence issue wasn't so prominent I think they'd have been out long ago.

I don't know if it's just me, but political discourse just feels a lot nastier now than a couple of decades ago. People always had differences of opinion, but now it just feels like anyone who goes even slightly 'off message' is hounded until they're forced out - there's so much less tolerance for opposing points of view and that can't be a good thing (thinking of all the crap JK Rowling has had to put up with for standing up for women's rights but there are many more examples).

Well that is also true but under the new hate Crime bill we risk being reported to the police for some of the posts on here (including myself in that) and JK will probably be serving time.

summit.news/2020/10/28/scottish-hate-crime-bill-would-criminalize-offensive-dinner-table-conversations/

That's actually quite scary. Whoever thought that was a good idea?

Humza Yousaf?

Jesus

@ssd

Jesus

Is that not Nicola? Surely he'd be one of the disciples and would Swinney be John the Baptist? Not that I know any bible well enough to assess if that's right :o

If he comes onto mn they'll lock most of us up and then WHO'LL MAKE THE DINNER???

Don't ask me about the bible, a bolt of lightning would strike me dead if I stepped into a church

That sort of thing is part of why I'm politically homeless I think - it just seems to be such an overreach. Actual discrimination which impacts on someone's earnings, opportunities, access to health, education, etc etc needs addressed. Real crime driven by hatred because of who someone is, yup. Off colour jokes and "outdated" opinions, no.

I rarely need to do that nowadays, most funerals are non religious but i did have to go to a catholic one a couple of years ago which I didn't realise involved a full service as well. Next time I'll be late and just do the graveside bit.

It will include any commentary on issues of sex and gender so I’m doomed.

I couldn’t vote for any of them last time because of this issue, and despise the Johnson regime so not Tory

@ssd - unfortunately twisting myself into knots is one of my greatest skills - but you and @WaxOnFeckOff have both made very sensible points.

I'm becoming more optimistic about the Labour party as something I could potentially vote for, especially as they've suspended Corbyn now. If they moved a back towards the centre they're a distinct possibility. The Lib Dems used to be my natural home, but they seem more interested in woke identity politics rather than real issues now. Don't like Boris' Tories, and the SNP are a non-starter for me.

Will they relax the rules to allow Santa to visit. Just think, some stranger visiting just about every house!

@ApolloandDaphne

I would like it to be a maximum of 6 with no limits on households. That way I could have DD1 and her partner, DD2 and my DM. Am I asking for too much??

You're asking for something that could reasonably happen, but which is very specific to your own personal situation.

What about people who normally have 7 for Christmas, and a rule of 6 would leave someone left out? Or even if they split into two groups, still spending the time apart. Or people may decide to bend the rules for 7, but then what about 8? 9? 10?

What they're going to have to do is to come up with sometime that doesn't make a mockery of what's going on (i.e. I think a complete lack of restrictions for the day would be stupid - it's either a dangerous virus that we have to get under control or it's not, it doesn't stop just because it's Christmas), while balancing people's need for family and celebration.

I suspect they will come up with something along the lines of the rule of 6, and anyone choosing to break the rule of 6 must be prepared and able to quarantine for two weeks afterwards. Easy for those working from home, not so easy for lots of others.