Scottish schools opening

[chocciechocface]

I was ready for schools opening, but this new research has given me pause for thought. I think this came out after Sturgeon's decision. What do you all think?

www.washingtonpost.com/health/2020/07/31/georgia-children-covid-outbreak/#click=t.co/Y9gSG9zENz

Quote from the article:

"A new report suggests that children of all ages are susceptible to coronavirus infection and may also spread it to others — a finding likely to intensify an already fraught discussion about the risks of sending children back to school this fall.

The analysis, released Friday by the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention, details an outbreak at a sleep-away camp in Georgia last month in which 260 children and staffers — more than three-quarters of the 344 tested — contracted the virus less than a week after spending time together in close quarters. The children had a median age of 12. The camp had required all 597 campers and staff members to provide documentation that they had tested negative for the virus before coming. Staff were required to wear masks, but children were not."

S1 intake is being split into two - all going in at the same time but half in the assembly hall, half in the canteen.

DS isn't fazed - he has older siblings at the school and thinks he knows it all. But i know some of his friends have been really worried about the whole transition thing. I trust the school to get it right as they can for everyone.

Senga - it would be temporary. We can't be "normal" in abnormal times. I don't know how long temporary is, but I personally think slow very controlled openings of schools, businesses etc would be more beneficial in the long run. What impact does it have on people and jobs to be thrown back into lockdown every few weeks? Why not recognise this is unprecedented and instead keep things 'ticking over' while science tries to get to grips with it.

would - I suspect the mother I mentioned yesterday about coughs is an UfT advocate. She was trying to whip parents up with a long list of things to demand. She's deeply worried about chemicals being used to disinfect the school. But as another parent said to me in a private contact, "she's worried about everything, but not at all worried that kids or their family members could die". I think it's ignoring/minimising/denying/sidelining that fact constantly that is making people really really angry.

@chocciechocface if it were for a couple of months then I’d be fine with it. I already think a phased return would be good anyway. The UfT movement gained traction when that fool Swinney said BL would go on a year. That is not acceptable commensurate to the risks of the virus.

I have 2, one going into s1 and one into s3.

Youngest goes back on Weds, s1 and s6 only in that day.

S4 and s5 go back on the Thursday

S2 and s3 on the Friday.

So the 2 days the youngest is in might make up for him missing his induction

The info from the school all seems quite good and sensible.

@SockYarn can I ask what your school's proposals are since you're delighted with them? I'm interested to see the different approaches regarding bubbles, class sizes, masks, social distancing, etc.

@WouldBeGood

It’s not gut instinct. I didn’t say children didn’t get Covid. I said they didn’t die of it.

I’m perfectly able to make balanced decisions based on experts and science, it just may be that I don’t agree with you.

But this is exactly the point. They may not die from it, but they'll bring it home and someone else will. Do those lives not matter?

And it's not even about 'dying' anymore. You can get COVID fairly mildly but it can still trigger other serious problems.

DH said to me yesterday he fears the potential trauma of our children knowing the disease is now on their doorstep, having to undergo tests etc. Or if one of their teachers gets ill. Absolute worst experience for them would be having to deal with a death of someone they know.

My 2 are in S3 and S6. S1 is in full time every day from Wednesday starting at 8.55. S2 and S3 are also in Wednesday but starting at 9.45am. S2 and S3 are then off Thursday and S4, S5, S6 are in Thursday instead starting at 9.45am. On Friday all year groups are in.
They have to wear no ties or blazers. Can take in bags/equipment but haven't to share anything.

[quote SengaStrawberry]@chocciechocface if it were for a couple of months then I’d be fine with it. I already think a phased return would be good anyway. The UfT movement gained traction when that fool Swinney said BL would go on a year. That is not acceptable commensurate to the risks of the virus.[/quote]

It would have to continue for as long as necessary. I don't think anyone can put a time limit on it. The pandemic will dictate terms irrespective of how people personally feel about it.

I have this sick feeling that Scotland is forging in a direction other countries have tried, and warned against, but we're doing it anyway. It doesn't make sense.

As an aside, I watched the van Tullekan documentary on COVID last night. I highly recommend it. Seeing experienced hospital consultants just keep saying, 'we just don't know' was sobering and heartbreaking.

Silly people, if only they knew about social media where everyone knows all the answers.

It doesn't make sense.
Yy it's the lack of consistency that I struggle with. If DCs don't need masks or to social distance in school then why do we/they need to do both if they are in a shopping centre or visiting a relative or playing with friends outside school? If there are limits to the number of households that can meet why does that become irrelevant when it's DCs in a school setting? Our numbers are good because we've been adhering to the rules. Once we stop adhering to the rules, the numbers are going to rise because the virus hasn't changed or gone away.
I notice the teacher's union is conducting a survey of its members but a number of people have pointed out that the pressure group got hold of the link and is trying to sabotage the results by getting non-teachers to fill it in saying they all want to go back to school with no masks or distancing

I have wondered if the government has arrived at a conclusion that it needs to do this for the public to realise exactly what we're dealing with. The level of denial is mind blowing. Maybe if we have a few school closures, a teacher or two or three dying, and maybe a few children orphaned, and others seriously ill, maybe minds will be refocused. We are incapable of learning from other countries; maybe it needs to happen, literally, at home.

I notice the teacher's union is conducting a survey of its members but a number of people have pointed out that the pressure group got hold of the link and is trying to sabotage the results by getting non-teachers to fill it in saying they all want to go back to school with no masks or distancing

... well, another reason for vitriol directed against them.

So not “temporary” then @chocciechocface

Children’s education is every bit as much an emergency as the health emergency IMO. It needs to be prioritised.

I think some people will be gutted if schools opening actually goes OK.

Why are people so convinced when 1 in 18000 have it people will die when there wasn’t teachers and kids dropping dead all over the place when 1 in 50/100 people had it, and given the suppression measures we have ongoing elsewhere now which weren’t then? Schools were open pretty much up until infection numbers peaked.

@chocciechocface

I have wondered if the government has arrived at a conclusion that it needs to do this for the public to realise exactly what we're dealing with. The level of denial is mind blowing. Maybe if we have a few school closures, a teacher or two or three dying, and maybe a few children orphaned, and others seriously ill, maybe minds will be refocused. We are incapable of learning from other countries; maybe it needs to happen, literally, at home.

Doubt it. Sturgeon is a populist. She knows she’ll lose votes if people die due to schools going back. She won’t want to risk that.

Children’s education is every bit as much an emergency as the health emergency IMO
Exactly that's why they should have been looking at the global examples of how best to re-open.

@AnneOfQueenSables

Children’s education is every bit as much an emergency as the health emergency IMO Exactly that's why they should have been looking at the global examples of how best to re-open.

We are going round in circles with this. The focus needs to be on getting them back full time. Some kids were only going to get 33% of time in school even in crucial exam years. That’s not schools being open or providing an education in any meaningful way.

Some kids were going to be getting even less than 33% of time in schools. Our local high school was proposing one day a week with an additional day once every four weeks for my kids, one of whom is going into S5.

Schools shut three weeks before the peak of deaths in Scotland. I would expect schools open to lead more to a peak of cases rather than deaths (among children anyway) but I don't remember it being easy to get a test then unless you were admitted to hospital.

I can’t help thinking we are still trying to force a one size fits all approach when clearly it doesn’t - so much better if we enabled home learning for vulnerable families with perhaps vulnerable teachers wfh to support that, and ft for those at lower risk from covid.

Some kids were only going to get 33% of time in school even in crucial exam years.

Some kids are likely to get about that time in school this year with their own quarantine, staff quarantine and local lockdowns. It’ll also all be completely unplanned so online provision will not be as good.

We also had a huge number of parents pull children out in the week before lockdown. We were running at 50% on the Monday and easily 25% attendance by the last Friday. Most of my teacher friends experienced the same.

I’d be very worried if I was in Aberdeen.

Mine were scheduled to be in one week out of three. S1, S4, S6. Home learning 66% of the time - with no support from teachers as they'd be in the classroom with the third of pupils who were in school. Totally unworkable.

It’s true the level of denial is massive. I know very few people that seem to think they need to be concerned at all. People carrying on as normal. Met a friend the other day at the park and she kept edging closer to me and not really sticking to 1m let alone 2m. This is a relatively easy rule to stick to it doesn’t hurt or cost anything to walk a couple of paces apart. No body is bothering. So much complacency in Aberdeen. Everyone seems to think it really isn’t an issue. But the whole world has changed borders closed hundreds of thousands dead. Why do people think it won’t happen here?

I am very worried about my DC going into S5. I would feel happier if the LA / school put plans for decent blended learning in place so that if/when it is necessary to rely on it there is something there to be rolled out.

It's not denial. It's more an acceptance that this virus might be around for a while and we can just add it to the long list of other risks which we live with every day. It's also a recognition that we simply can't all stay in our houses until a vaccine comes along.

That doesn't mean thinking it's all fake news or not doing things like washing your hands. That's all important stuff - but we all as a planet need to get on with things eventually and kids back to school is a key part of that.