time to ditch denominational / non-denom schools?

[OtraCosaMariposa]

Massive stooshie rumbling in my area at the moment around placing requests and schools. We're in East Dunbartonshire and the pace of house building means that placing requests are regularly turned down, and the Council are trying to come up with a strategy for what they'll do in a scenario that all catchment children can't be accommodated.

The main issue appears to be with the local Catholic primary. It's next door to the non-denominational secondary. Most parents choose to opt out of Catholic schooling for secondary as the "catchment" Catholic school is miles away.

If the Council plans go through, children in Catholic primaries, even if the live in catchment for the non-denom secondary, will be bottom of the pecking list to be accommodated. Argument being that they have another catchment place, albeit miles away.

Lots of Catholic parents are up in arms and I can understand their upset. They have children in the non-denom secondary already, facing the prospect of having their subsequent children at different schools miles away. I would be upset too and very worried. But on the flip side, they have opted out of the non-denominational system by choosing to send their child to a Catholic secondary and why should they 7 years later be able to opt back in ahead of others?

Personally, I'd scrap all denomination schools. In 2019 it's a piece of nonsense that we're educating children separately. All schools should be non-denominational. If you want religion, do it on your own time.

I think I read something about it having to change it's entry requirements or be under threat of closing. It's a tiny school and requires membership of the church to gain a place and with church attendance dropping....

Also think that with a quite fluid population, people moving in don't really realise it exists and unless they attend the church probably don't really look into it. Both other primaries are decent so I suppose there isn't the incentive to pretend you are religious in order to try to get in there instead.

and sorry yes, definitely on the right lines pb, reading my post back it looked a bit more blunt than I meant it to be, it was just supposed to be agreeing and clarifying, not trying to prove you wrong.

Episcopal school in Perth too, so more than one

I see misinformation creeping in here about St Mary's Episcopal School in Dunblane. You don't need to be a church member to go to the school and there is no need for anyone to pretend that they are religious. For most families, the school is their only connection to the church.

The school is open to everyone in the Stirling Council area. It isn't a catchment school and that is the reason why everyone has to make a placing request. It states quite clearly on the Stirling Council website that 'placement is not prioritised on the basis of religious affiliation'.

Yes, the school has close links with the church. What that means in practice is that they share the church grounds and hall which is used for lunches, PE, assembly, concerts etc. The Rector (minister) of the church is involved in assemblies and helps the children prepare for the Harvest, Christmas, Easter and end of summer term services. All these occasions are marked in the non-denominational primary schools too with chaplains coming in to school or children going to church.

It is a pity that the school is overlooked by many families, possibly because they hear stories about it being a 'religious' school and imagine that it has strict entry criteria.

Because the school is small, all the staff know all the children, something they can't do in larger primaries. There have been many children who have flourished at St Mary's who would be, or have been, overwhelmed by the noise and scale of bigger schools, making it a valuable alternative to larger catchment schools and offering parents real choice.

That's useful information @SteamPudding. It still wouldn't necessarily appeal to all but from what I remember, the council website is not very welcoming of placing requests for some schools and there was some warning about special criteria for St Mary's. I was looking for secondary though so didn't click in any further. The council site also warned that placing requests to specific schools were as likely to be refused as accepted, this carried on even when the HM of Dunblane High was asking parents to spread the word that they needed more pupils.

The other two primaries are both very large so as you say it offers an alternative.

I grew up in and still live in a new town on the west coast of Scotland. The sectarianism here is horrendous.

People don't get interviews or jobs based on what school they went to; kids, and adults, are subject to verbal abuse and worse in the street; the Orange lodge knows where every Roman Catholic in here lives and, on their weekly marches on the summer, stops outside their houses to play/sing more loudly. Kids in prams are brought along on these marches decked out in Union flags. Toddlers are taught to say "FTP", Pape and Fenian are common parlance; there are prod and pape pubs, the same for kids football teams, clubs etc. although, it's the Protestant parents that keep that going, around here it is even sometimes assumes that if you go to scouts you must be RC because protestants go to the BB if they go to anything like that....It's all done in the name of a religion that 99% of them don't practice in any way.
We have recently had to ask someone not to come back to our CoS church because of his constant ranting hate speech. Because, funnily enough, those of us who practice our respective faiths embrace and celebrate our similarities instead of dwelling on our differences in the main.
Faith schools don't help, but they are a drop in the ocean of hate here. There are so many other issues that need to be addressed. The cycle will never be broken unless something drastic happens.