Results Day 2018

[Groovee]

Hi everyone

Thought that as the 7th is fast approaching, it would be worth doing a thread to for the day and the build up.

Dd needs a B in anything to get into Uni and ds is getting his Nat5 results. Will be a tense morning.

I agree totally. I've had big arguments with ds about his perception of St Andrews as full of "Tory snobs" (Although i couldn't disagree with him
about his perception of it being isolated, intense and a bit like Hogwarts a giant boarding school ). I've told him that if he had applied and been accepted, then he'd have made loads of friends for life from all sorts of backgrounds - and would've been very happy

I was asked about my experience. In my experience there were certain residences which attracted more of a particular English public school type. Other residences had a more mixed demographic. There will be lovely people in both (I had friends in most residences). There will also be snobs in both. As well as inverted snobs who specifically (and wrongly) dislike(d) people purely because they'd gone to public schools . Just as others (wrongly) look(ed) down on Scots with broad accents who'd been to state schools.
The residence I was in - if I dreg up the memories (because it wasn't something that really registered because it wasn't something that was important in the grand scheme of things) - had a higher proportion of state school educated students than would have been expected given the profile of students at that time.
Whether that was because it was one of the smaller ones, or because it was Unisex, when the majority of "older" residences were single sex (which was why I chose it), I don't know.

I was actually poking fun at myself for my initial lack of knowledge of Scottish accents, when I'd assumed that any accent I didn't recognise was English Oops They all sounded "posh" to me Given that very few Glaswegians (even posh ones like me - which is why my assumptions were so ) went to St Andrews back then - and especially not from 5th Year - I was very much an oddity and very somewhat naive

I think young people of today are more aware of different backgrounds - and there are more international/EU students now (although even back then, there were loads of US students, some just on year long insets) at Unis across the country so that's another way that their experience will be broadened

Slept badly last night (worrying) but all was well as DS got 4 As and a B. Went out for tea to celebrate - ate too much, dropped off easily but now wide awake. Well done to all who have done well and hugs to those who didn't. I'm English and think Scotland has a wonderful system as the 6th form provides a second go at getting what you need to enter Higher education. In England if you blow out at the end of 6th form you have run out of time at school.

@CreamCol0uredP0nies - I didn't mention it on this thread, but the fact that there are so many St Andrews students coming from England does have an impact I think on the volume of students who skip first year. (a) they've all done A levels where not all Scottish kids have done Adv Hs and (b) they are paying for their course so an extra year is a substantial cost.

I think prettybird and i have both been on a previous thread where the focus has been on the "social" side of uni/impact of skipping a year; and since St Andrews has pretty much every new student in halls, again the proportion of English students will impact on those in your halls who are in first/second year.

DD has now looked again at her course options and while she's not keen on exploring going straight into 2nd yr, she is looking at skipping some of the first yr elements so that she can fit in more "extras" like a language or ethics.

Sturmund, students from England only pay 3 years of fees for Scottish courses though I think it is spread across 4 years if they opt to do the 4, so it doesn't cost more.

really? didn't know that! and a few of the families near us mentioned cost in that kind of discussion although maybe they did just mean living costs.

Does anyone have experience of Scottish students going to English unis and how they are funded?

I get that the tuition fees are a loan —graduate tax— but what about maintenance, is that more/less than if they stayed in Scotland?

Sturm - that sounds like a brilliant and sensible approach and makes the most of the Scottish broad system of university education.

I ended up doing a different degree to the one I applied for thanks to studying something else as one of my options in 2nd year (did Economics as my 1st year option in 2nd year and ended up repeating a year so I could take it to Honours, joint with the French I was already doing)

Waxon - I don't think every Scottish Uni has that approach of not charging for the 4th year: I seem to remember being told that on another thread. Can't remember which Uni it was in regard to.

Plus even without the fees, there is the added cost of a 4th year of living costs

Seven - as far as I can make out from SAAS, you'd get a loan to cover the fees for a course in England and you'd get the same loan/bursary as you would for a course in Scotland to cover your living costs.

The main difference would be the interest rate charged: c1.5% in Scotland versus c6.5% in England I think the threshold to start paying it back is lower for Scots though.

http://www.saas.gov.uk/fulltime/ug/young/fundingavailable.htm

At st Andrews English students have to pay all four years fees, I think the three years fees offer is made by some unis that want to attract more English students but certainly not all. It's also worth knowing that direct entry to second year is only available in the science faculty at St Andrews not arts ( I assume because science curriculum content is more universal), I'm not sure but I think this is true for other unis, I've only heard of students going straight to second year if they're doing Maths or Biology etc.

Although most Scottish unis charge English/rUK students £9k per year, most have capped the cost at £27k, effectively the equivalent of 3 years study.

I posted during exam time about how my dd thought she had done really badly in her exams, hadn't finished etc. She slso thought she'd messed up course work.

She got As in all 5 highers!

My severely dyslexic / dyscalculic dd managed 2 As (English & History) 2 bs (Geography & Environmental Science) and a c for biology. Maths was a fail but totally expected. Our council only allows them to sit 6 Nat 5s. We are extremely pleased with her although she as usual is measuring herself against her high achieving friends so is not so happy.

Re maths - there is a nat 5 qualification in applications of mathematics which would be great for those like my dd that could benefit from having a nat 5 maths pass to get into some higher ed courses - but have zero chance at "normal" nat 5 maths - but I don't think many schools actually teach for it. When I was looking at uni entry qualifications for non science / maths type courses, some looked for a nat 5 pass in maths but would accept a pass in applications / lifeskills maths so seems a lost opportunity to me.

Maths teacher here. The Nat 5 Applications can be much harder than the straight Nat 5 Maths. We decided not to do it after looking at how low the pass rates across Scotland were. While it misses out the the algebra/quadratics a lot of pupils find difficult, the content replacing it is not always the easier option. For a Dyslexic pupil I think the wording of the financial questions could be very challenging as less likely to have a useful diagram.
We are going to re look at it this year to see if the up-dated course has improved things.

Congratulations everyone. Been following along to keep my lot going. (They are v grateful to the boys in Stirling and the one in Shawlands for keeping their DM from being overinvested in them).
Mine both did great but DD1 is in hospital with a mystery virus so I just want her better - fair gives a bit of perspective. Limmy has a fab twitter feed extolling the virtues of failing your exams and as I am someone with qualies coming out my ears who retired after having DC I can see his point.

Seven I have looked at funding for English Unis. My reading was that you borrow Scottish amounts for maint (this means parental contribution is considerably higher than English rules) and that the whole lot maint and fees is paid back at Scottish income cut offs and rate of interest - it is v opaque so worth double checking - I think there is an online query function on the SAAS site.

I see your point Cadsuane - was thinking that the questions are always of a very similar type so would be much easier to coach her for it than it would be for the normal nat 5 maths!

I coached DS1 through Applications of Maths this year, he struggled at school and left with only 2 Nat5s four years ago.
Not having a maths qualification is really limiting so he decided to do a distance learning one. I felt I could understand Applications but would not be able to help with NAT 5 Maths, too rusty. I was a bit wary, having heard anecdotally about a friend's daughter with dyslexia dropping it but we had nothing to lose ( well except it did cost over £400 to do!)
Comparing past papers, the new exam is a bit easier and apparently the pass rate is up 11% this year.
We found that we had to choose study aids carefully, the large textbook required by the course provider was quickly ditched, far too text heavy, poorly laid out and overcomplicated, DS can not cope with too much info at once! We found the simpler " how to pass" type books are much better, simpler, clearer, better use of graphics. I also recommend Carol Vordermans " Help your child with Maths" it uses graphics really well and is a brilliant maths reference book to refer to.
I effectively had to teach the concepts over and over again ( using a whiteboard) until they stuck and we went over past papers loads of times.
It was a real grit your teeth effort but worth it, he got his first ever A aged 20 having only just passed NAT 4 Maths at school.
As a bonus I now understand basic statistics and am a whizz at working out APR.
I actually think it a very useful qualification and underated.
Hope you find this helpful.

Thanks Wiggly, that's useful. dd is actually quite good at algebra and some quadratics - and does struggle with the arithmetic side but I reckon there is less variance with it (and the basic formulae are all given so no huge memory task there). I think with loads & loads of repetition I could probably get her through it - but will wait until after 5th year I think! I am hoping she won't need maths at all but I do think it is possibly a more useful qualification for most non-mathematicians and should be more available.

howabout - glad to be of assistance

Hope they get to the bottom of what is wrong with your dd1 and that she recovers and thrives . With a mum like you, she's off to a good start

See while everyone is here and playing nicely, can I ask where people stand on a D rating in the exams?

Friends DC got a bit of a mixed bag of Nat 5 results. 1 outright fail, a couple of As, a B, a Cs and 2 Ds. 1 of the Ds is Maths and the other is a subject they want to do at higher and potentially needed for their planned career.

Their DC insists that the Ds are passes and friend, without telling me particular circumstances, asked me whether I considered a D a pass. I said I didn't and say for e.g. if DS2s maths resit, had been a D, I'd have said he needed to sit it again. Her DC doesn't want to do maths again which is what I think is behind the "D is a pass" story. On the other hand it does appear on the certificate and isn't noted as a Fail. So it's a bit confusing.

They can call a D a pass if they want but unfortunately courses that require Nat 5 maths tend to want a minimum of a C - a D indicates that they passed the unit assessments and achieved between 40-49% in the exam (not allowing for and grade boundary changes). Everyone I know whose DC achieved a D has resat. In some cases university offers were conditional on a C at Nat 5.

Ds are shown in the cert as they do count towards tariffs and SCQF points.

Yep that's what I was saying celtie I'm sure I've seen written both in Uni websites and apprenticeship/jobs that they want a minimum of a C at Nat 5. Friend says she's checked the courses the DC is interested in and it just says a pass at Nat5 and DC insists a D is a pass. The DC also saying that the D in the subject they want to take at Higher is also fine as school only specify a pass at Nat 5 and again they consider the D to be a pass not sure what the school will say (not my DCs school). Friend is now saying that DC passed all their exams, rewarded them etc.

I'm just afraid that there will be a shock coming down the line :(

My DS had similar, though slightly worse, marks last year and we thought it was a disaster.

Oh howabout just read your post, hope your DD gets better soon.

Brillo how is DD now?

Wax one of my DC was awarded a D in a subject and we had a similar conversation! I would be surprised if any school allowed someone to continue to higher after being awarded a D, again one of my DC had to change their higher programme after failing to receive required grades.

My understanding is that schools would normally require a B before allowing progression to higher.

A shock is definitely coming unless there are other circumstances that need to be taken into consideration.

No "circumstances" that I am aware off, we are good friends and her DC is a really good kid and was expected to perform far higher in everything except Maths and the failure in the prelim for that was a bolt out of the blue. All other prelims were giving predictions of A/B and Maths was C. They did study and have always been very academic. I think to be honest they were gutted about the result and found a way of it seeming better by declaring passes. My DS progressed to higher in a subject he got a C in and improved that to a B at higher and also crashed 2 subjects, one of which he dropped so I don't think it's impossible to do well from a C, but a D? My DS also didn't progress the subjects he failed at or had a D in. He resat his Maths though.

Friend feels caught between a rock and hard place I think. DC is determined to follow a science path but that is where the D's are and they've done much better in Arts & Languages so she is gently saying that maybe Languages, Music and Business (also did okay in) might be a better option.