What's going wrong with Scottish education??

[TinfoilHattie]

www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-scotland-politics-39856284

Obviously very tempting to start another SNP bashing thread and I'm pretty clear that the blame for this lies at their door. It's shocking that performance is getting worst, not better and that less than half of S2s are performing well or very well in writing. It's all very well Swinney standing up and saying that it's not good enough but WHY is it not good enough and WHAT is he going to do about it?

Is it Curriculum for Excellence? Are the tests unrealistic? Funding? Changing expectations?

It's all very interesting for me as I have children in P4, P7 and S2 and those are the years which are tested. My kids are doing fine and I have no worries about them, but we're a family which values education and encourages reading. I do worry though about my daughter who spelled her new school as "Acadmay" and it wasn't corrected by the teacher.

So what's going wrong and how do we put it right?

Maybe if the parents put down their bottle of Buckfast. and started teaching there kids at home then standards would improve.

I'm sorry but when I was younger I was really bad at reading and writing.
Nowadays I would have been classed as dyslexic but what my parents done was read with me every night and over time I got better.

I hear stories of children starting at school almost unable to speak still wearing nappies so the poor teachers have all this to contend with as well.

All teachers want to do is teach but they need the help of the parents as well.

It's not just in the academic aspect it's the social one. you hear stories of kids running a mock in schools and the lack of discipline well sorry to tell you but this starts at home as well. Children will just copy there parents and if you behave badly you can only expect your children to copy you. Set a good example teach them their P's & Q's and always use them yourself then your children will copy you.

I'm not picking on Scotland it's the whole of the UK just they go for White Lightening Cider down south

You make a valid pointfuzzy but don't tar us all with the same brush! Ds gets support at home, is well mannered and disciplined. However he still has to cope with shitty standards of education at school. We are doing our bit at home, the school is not doing its bit!

alice Jordanhill catchment is not only by street but by specific house numbers and types within streets. They also accept a top up intake of gifted academic pupils for the senior years, as do all the Glasgow private schools. The competition to get in is such that there are no uninvolved parents. It is really not difficult to get superior results in those circumstances.

Danyella - Myself and another older teacher are used as the go-to people when they're not sure if their SPAG are correct.
Is that the correct usage of 'myself'? I didn't think it was but I hear myself/yourself used incorrectly so often now that I don't know anymore.

Another teacher and I, surely, but this is a message board so you can get away with it!
I'm happily retired now but my department wasn't popular with the headteacher as we tried to maintain some standards and expected effort in class and with homework.
Senior management weren't interested or too busy with other stuff so we were undermined. I bet we weren't the only ones to experience that.
It's much worse now. Such a shame for pupils and parents who care. All these initiatives are a waste of time when the basics aren't in place.

Sorry Fuzzy - I don't believe parenting has declined so much in such a short time that it would lead to such a fall in results.

Similarly howabout I am not convinced the involved parents at Jordanhill are wholly responsible for the kids success. I suspect there must be aspects of what the school do that contribute to the results. I would be interested to know what they are. Same for the he East Renfrewshire schools that have wider catchments

Jordanhill cannot be compared to your bog standard school. No way.

The school community (teachers, senior staff, parents) would not tolerate some of the behaviours which have gone through the roof due to inclusion and the drive to lower exclusion rates.

Jordanhill don't put pupils in for exams in the measured years that they aren't absolutely sure they will pass well.

So they have less pupils doing H maths and English in 5th year which the stats are based on. They'll put pupils in for those in S6 instead.

The involved parents is a huge factor though, as is the level of outside tuition paid for by them.

Of course what goes on in the four walls of a school has an impact.
I am a supportive parent (I like to believe!) and have had issues similar to dementedma.

There is particular subject department that stands out at my children's school.
Things that they do differently ime include:

Challenging homework from a book child could refer back to, followed WITH FEEDBACK that made sense.
Informing us and teenager at parents evening that homework was too slackly done.
More frequent exam practice sessions that were not cancelled.
A coherent set of notes.
A fascinating guest speaker for 5th and 6th years who had had a career in related field.
No posters or internet researching for homework.
(Would some of this get criticised as not in the spirit of CfE?)

The Sainsburys in East Renfrewshire has massive ads for tutoring services. If the schools are superior there should be no market for them - but there is.

that's all pretty appalling Euphemia...

But 20 years ago London state schools, especially secondary, were dire in lots of areas. Now a lot of them have improved massively. I don't think the demographics have changed that much - but I think there was a huge increase in spending. Will have a look to see if I can find anything on this.

JigsawJim - for future reference

"Myself and another older teacher are used as the go-to people when they're not sure if their SPAG are correct."

should be

"Another older teacher and I are used as the go-to people when they're not sure if their SPAG are although you could/should use "is" if you accept that SPAG is a "thing" rather than its three component parts correct"

"Myself" can occasionally be used for emphasis rather than "I" (but is very much over used and not usually appropriately) but if you choose to do so, it should be after the other subject(s).

I was similarly the "Go-to" person at my old job (and for the really tricky questions, would ring my mum who was an English teacher ). I had one colleague who used to litter his speech and letters/memos with "myself" because he thought it made him look more educated. It didn't. I did gradually get him out of the habit

SNP want to be judged by their education standards of "closing the attainment gap" so it appears instead of pulling the lower kids up to meet the top, they are stoping the top from reaching their potential.

It's a serious shame tha labour are in a mess, massive reluctance to vote Tory but had enough of SNP.

I think Nicola is going to come to regret saying that!

If you get a chance, watch the interview with Nicola Sturgeon on the Andrew Marr show this morning. The topic of Scottish education is discussed.

Euphemia we have a similar parent who believes their child can do no wrong

She wrote a big tirade in his home/school book about why he was punched in the face by another pupil for no reason whatsoever and what punishment had been taken etc etc. Thankfully the CCTV proved that her little darling threw the first punch.

We have so many pupils who have parents like this - it's really demoralising and wastes so much time.

The lack of debate of education in Holyrood over this is staggering. I'm deeply suspicious of the current government and their desire to continually consult/ change things without giving time for change and culture change to embed.

Plenty of schools from Mossbourne to Michaela are getting good results from "tough" student intakes. There is no excuse.

I'm saddened to note that Wales appears to be following Scotland into the dead-end of "woolly content-free curriculum based on soft skills."

twitter.com/hashtag/curriculumforwales?src=hash

Given the outrage of the nats on twitter I gather Sturgeon had a mare on the Marr show.

Joaanna Cherry has tweeted that she should have been asked about Tory policies .

Heaven forbid that she should be asked anything about the SNP's appalling track record in government.

Too bloody true trixy. Absolutely no accountability from the snp on this, or any other matter.

Well worth watching Nicola Sturgeon being roasted on Andrew Marr. He just fed her the facts and made her squirm.

Och, we are just not measuring it right, as in, we aren't measuring it in the way that makes them look good.

I felt Sturgeon looked nervous on the Marr show.

I just wish he was less gutless.