George's Mingin Medicine as theclassreader - why, exactly??

[SirChenjin]

Apart from the SNP'S obsession with all things Scoa'ish obviously . We don't speak like that, none of our friends or family do, I don't understand the majority of the words and have no idea how to pronounce them - so when I listen to him reading I haver no idea of what he's saying is correct and then have to sign his readi g record. They would have been better giving him a book written in Mandarin - far more relevant and about as understandable to 99% of his class.

Oxster is your underarm - how/why I know that I can't remember, but I've heard that word

It's cheese on toast, roll n sausage (unless it's a sausage roll of the Greggs variety of course) and stovies are made with stewing steak (in the slow cooker, and served with oatcakes and beetroot - delish)

I put onions in mine too

Stovies in my house are meat, potatoes and onions with stock.

Meat can be chopped up square sausage or corned beef or chopped up left over roast beef or lamb.

White stovies are as above with no meat.

Coming round to yours for stovies SirChenjin. That sounds yummy.

I'm firing up the slow cooker now how . My stovies are amazing, it has to be said.

I agree that the Roald Dahl translation is both forced and unnecessary. However, I think that it should be taken up with the teacher as inappropriate rather than knee-jerkingly blame the SNP. And having it as the "reader" seems particularly stupid.

I came across this briefing paper when checking to see if the Scots language was a compulsory part of the CfE. While I haven't checked all of the links in it (which give further background), it suggests that Scots could be introduced as the 2nd MFL in primary school (ie in the upper years, after the 1st MFL, which is started in P1), should teachers want to (no obligation to do so) and explains some of the ways it could enrich a child's learning experience. No hint of being forced to use the language.

I did find the briefing paper interesting in explaining why Scots should be considered a language - but there again, I'm a linguist

FWIW - I had to "learn" a form of Scots to read Sunset Song, back in 1977/78, for my Higher English - loooooong before the rise of the SNP to any form of power. This was in the same nice middle class area that Luna lives in, so there was no political motivation or local speakers other than the fact that it was good literature.

And someone else has said that The Cone Gatherers was in the Higher Curriculum (I know it's not written in Scots but it's part of the Scottish texts curriculum) back in 1989 - so again, not something that can be blamed on the SNP.

FWIW - I a posh Glaswegian brought up in Bearsden/Milngavie know what an oxter is

I'm from NI and I find most of the blurb pretty easy to understand. I'm all for keeping children in touch with their Ulster-Scots heritage, but I do think that stuff like this should be left for older kids so as to avoid confusing them.

Slightly off-topic but has anybody read the Ulster-Scots "translation" of the Bible? "Ah tould ye, Jesus!"

It's HILARIOUS.

I do blame the SNP in that this obsession (or what seems like an obsession to me, other pov are available) to narrow the focus of the curriculum to all things Scottish wherever possible is parochial and backward. As I said up thread, I have no problem with them learning about other languages and dialects - as long as it's at an appropriate level and as long as it is inspiring, accessible and proportionate.

I was taught Sunset Song as my Higher text way back in the 80s. We lived over the hills from the Mearns so our teacher was very keen for us to learn about our local history and culture. Only trouble was, this was at the height of the oil boom and most of us weren't local - and those who were didn't really identify. I passed my higher (A band) using a text I taught myself and which I enjoyed far more - nothing frustrates more than being given a book and being told 'this is your heritage and you will read it and you will learn from it' when it isn't.

But isn't it interesting that DH uses oxster and his Mum doesn't? Yes, it shows that language evolves and so forth. But he is not a teenager, it is a word he thinks he has always used.

This suggesting that a translation of a book into the Scots dialect mig need to be done multiple times, even within small families or areas because, like any dialect, it has regional variations.

Where I am, we largely ignore Scots as it is not the way pupils speak, write, think or anything, some are bilingual (Gaelic) but more are bilingual (French, German, one triligual including Russian). So, it would be about as relevant as Cornish.

Slightly off-topic but has anybody read the Ulster-Scots "translation" of the Bible? "Ah tould ye, Jesus!"

Sounds just like Ian Paisley!

I can still remember learning "When doukin in the River Nile, I met a muckle crocodile" 40 years ago. We also did a full enactment of Tam o Shanter in P7 following on from our successful production of Cinderella the year before.

My lot did precious little Scots at primary in comparison. They did do MacBeth the musical in P7, which is great. They are now doing a fair bit of Morgan and McCaig along with the Shakespeare in S3 and 4.

DD3 is in P1 and is already coming home counting and telling me her colours in French and Spanish, which I also think is great. I am pretty much a fan of the changes from CfE and its continuing development.

I quite agree Hamlet. I had another quick look through the book and there are references to several words for woman for example, all of which come from the various dialects. I can fully understand that there is an argument for exposing him to different words meaning the same thing in different dialects - but I really don't believe that the way to inspire a love of reading is to give a 9 year old boy a book of strange (to his ear) words, a dictionary and a copy of the original Dahl and effectively tell him to get translating.

"but I really don't believe that the way to inspire a love of reading is to give a 9 year old boy a book of strange (to his ear) words, a dictionary and a copy of the original Dahl and effectively tell him to get translating."

Then you're back to - have you spoken to his teacher about it, because that's who decides how it's taught.

Sunset Song was dramatised on the telly when I was doing my highers so I assume that is why so many schools seem to have used it.

A Clockwork Orange was also all the rage when I was that stage. It comes with its own dictionary.

At this moment in time I think that's how I'm going to approach it Francis. My thinking is that the teacher can obviously speak Scots and can understand it otherwise she wouldn't have chosen that book for them - so rather than us labouring over the words with a dictionary and mispronouncing them in a stilted fashion, I'll leave it to the expert who will (hopefully) bring the text to life.

Excellent suggestions Francis - we can follow up the book with a visit to the churchyard.

JK Rowling wrote HP all over, the Elephant House is just the place that shouts the loudest (Spoon is much nicer, ok it was Nicolsons when she wrote HP in it but hey, same space).

Neil Gunn is an engaging scottish writer. I've Sunset Song on my Kindle for years and not yet been able to face it but I do like a bit of Mr Gunn's herring fishing.

Am off to track down the Rebus I want which I think it hiding in a library I've never visited before - a proper Edinburgh adventure!