The vitriol for SAHPs on this site is insane

[JustSoFrustrated]

So many insisting it “isn’t work” and that we’re lazy, calling us “leeches” on our spouses, saying that “housework doesn’t take that long” and assuming we’re either “faffing about” or filling our time with made-up work or leisure activities…

Honestly, I wish they could all take a turn doing what I do each day and see if they still think it isn’t work or that it only takes “two hours max” daily to keep the house running—Someone told me that it only takes 20 minutes to hoover the entire house! I was like, I could do maybe one room in 20 minutes. Are they not picking things up off the floor first or moving furniture?? It also makes me imagine that their homes are TINY, and that they don’t have much of a garden, or at least not one that’s their responsibility to maintain. They also all have older, more independent children and seem to have forgotten how much supervision and assistance young children need, and how much of a mess they make constantly.

Someone else was like, “It takes five minutes per meal to do the dishes,” and I thought, what the hell are they feeding their kids? Maybe if you microwave cans of soup, or pop a tray of chicken nuggets in the oven on a single sheet pan, or boil pasta in one pot and then dump a jar of sauce over it… And that’s fine to do every once in a while, but not for every meal. If you’re actually cooking cooking— you know, chopping fruits and veggies, working with meat, cooking different components to a meal in the way they taste best, serving them on real dishes, with real cutlery to eat with… Dishes are gonna take you more than 5 minutes per meal, even with a dishwasher (Unless they’re just popping their dishes and cookware in without rinsing them off at all?? In which case I’m assuming their dishwashers are rank inside!)

And when you explain to them, this is how much work I have to do, and how much time it takes me, they either start concluding you’re “plodding around”/doing it inefficiently/incorrectly, or they’ll start suggesting that you downsize your life so that you’re less busy… presumably so you can get “a real job.” But that’s totally not the point; why would I make it so my family has a less enjoyable or less luxurious life, and see my DC less, just so I can go to work to make money that we don’t really need?

I’m tempted to just start insisting to WOHP that their houses must be disgustingly dirty and that they’re obviously cleaning wrong if it takes them so little time… or that they’re “faffing around” at work all day, because obviously if families with SAHP can live comfortably on one income, then their work must be really inefficient…

But that wouldn’t be reasonable, would it?

In my day .. l didn't know anyone who had kids and went to work. We were all SAHM's .. that's how it was.
We did the cooking/ cleaning.. walking.. yes actually walking our children to school.. half hour each way while pushing the baby in the pram .
We would do most of the childcare/ activities... enjoy weekends as a family.
I bloody loved it.
I loved school holidays to spend more time with my children.
I absolutely hated working.

From the title I came on to support you but your post was really obnoxious.

Yes, but in your (clearly rather limited) personal experience. Most women with children throughout history have always worked.

You're not getting it.

Why is she even suggesting that there is anything to feel guilty about in the first place? Are men expected to feel guilty about providing for their families? What exactly are people presumed to feel guilty about?

Guilt is only a thing because people like @arcticpandas are invested in telling women that they should feel guilty for working, guilty for using childcare, guilty for wanting to maintain their financial independence, guilty for wanting an identity beyond the home etc.

It was precisely this kind of guilt that persuaded my mum to remain as a SAHP when we were growing up, despite the fact that it wrecked her mental health. She felt that a good mother ought to want to be with her kids 24/7, because that's what society told her was the ideal. Nobody ever expected my dad to be with us 24/7. Nobody expected that he would be happy to sacrifice all of his other dreams and ambitions on the altar of parenthood. Why should it be any different for women?

If women want to SAH with their kids and can afford to do so, all power to them. If they have found a lifestyle that works for them and their families, I am genuinely happy for them. But please don't try to suggest that those of us who have made different choices have anything to feel guilty about. We don't. We are all just doing our best to be the best parents we can be, however we might choose to approach it.

It’s definitely her. She uses the word ‘un-clean’ in both threads 😂

She has a weekly housekeeper! 😮

Good catch!😄

no, she was provocative, goady and criticising WOHP because she wanted this reaction

I agree.

I have my husband, but no family or friend support and I’ve been back full time since DD was 9 months old, she’s 11 now. It’s not even close to impossible to do, fair enough if you don’t want or need to do it, but don’t paint it as an impossible option.

Exactly it's almost impossible to find a full-time job that fits around the kids or even a nursery that's open all day. But that wont get in the way of them feeling smug and superior that theyre better than all " gold diggers and benefits scroungers" 🙄

It's not impossible at all. I have worked full time since DS was 10 months. We have very little family help yet we've managed it.

I don't think I'm better than those who choose to stay at home. I've just made a different choice.

And?

I love working and love my job.
We're all different.

Personally I don’t think marriage is much protection either. Spousal maintenance isn’t a thing anymore, neither is spousal pensions so much.

unless his salary covers equal pension contributions for you, significant investments in your sole name, enough assets and a great life insurance, unemployment and critical illness policy, if you do lose his income for whatever reason you’re stuffed. On divorce yes you may get 50% of the assets, but will that enable you to buy a house and provide enough income for the next 40 or 50 years into old age?

i grew up with a sahm. I would rather they shared the parenting and I saw more of my dad tbh. He was a great dad but always at work. He dropped dead when I was 9 so I never really got to know him. Then I saw first hand how being a sahp could leave you in the shit and I swore I wouldn’t have children unless I had my own home, and a secure career so if the kids father upped and died on me, or walked out, it would make no difference financially.

Only when one side or the other say their life is much better /their dc will turn out better etc..

some claim sahm is absolutely the only way since dc will turn out better for all the time spent with them / "why did you have kids to leave them to be raised by others" etc.

You do you. Make your choice. Don't claim your dc are fed better or that the skirting boards are cleaner. Poverty and engagement (eg conversation with small dc and having books at home /reading to dc) dictate outcomes..not sahm vs wohm.

At broader level housework and dc should not be only female domain. So many ops on here saying they cannot trust their dh to take care of their joint dc. Why??

Personally as well I don’t think we look enough at both parents sharing the parenting at home. Both going part time, still a parent at home, child gets a better relationship with both parents.

then dad also knows how to parent and there’s less leaving it to mum because she knows their routines, what they eat and how to settle them. Mum doesn’t make herself so vulnerable if she’s still working, and the family have financial resilience so if one job goes, the other can hold the fort until the situation can be resolved. That was massive when Dh’s firm went bankrupt, my income meant fewer worries while he found a new job.

Are the vitriolic SAHM's projecting their own guilt too? The ones who always talk about nurseries raising children, why bother having kids if you are going to work etc.

Yanbu

Can you link to an example of this vitriol? Been on here 8 years and never seen it.

I wonder what ‘real cutlery’ involves?

I work so…we all just eat frozen foods with our fingers or drink beans straight out of the tin.

I don’t have time for working with meat, sadly.

😆

This feels like you might have a slight chip on your shoulder. I’ve not seen anything of the sort about SAHPs, personally. Not that I’m saying it doesn’t happen, but I’ve not seen it. You, however, seem very wound up at the thought of families where both parties work. Also, just as an FYI, cleaners exist.

Personally I don’t think marriage is much protection either. Spousal maintenance isn’t a thing anymore, neither is spousal pensions so much.

Spousal maintenance doesn't need to be a thing - women can work and maintain themselves.

Pensions being split is totally a thing

but let's assume that what the post said is true: that means that women should ensure they have their own access to funds and their own pension. How they get that? up to them to either earn their own, or negotiate that their partner pays into it and gives them access to money.

I was also curious about the cutlery comment...bizarre.

I don't work with meat either, but that has more to do with me having been vegetarian for the last 35 years than it does with me having a job!😂

@Picklepower ha, ha- yep we eat out polystyrene trays every night and plastic crockery !! NOT! I get the impression OP is a Kirsty Allsopp type who hand makes all her Xmas decs courtesy of good housekeeping !! Now I have no issue with that if it makes her happy and she can afford to do so - but please don’t imply all working mums live off KFC takeaways and live in unvaccumed hovels - plenty of parents these days don’t have the choice either if they don’t have family money and want a roof over their heads and maybe a holiday and a car etc -

Oh, I missed the cutlery comment. Obviously us working mums only use paper plates and plastic cutlery. That's how we keep washing up time under 5 minutes.

Why would you assume that WOHPs feel guilty or that they would need to justify working to support their families? What do you think they should feel guilty about, exactly? @MrsBennetsPoorNerves

I don't ! I said those who make hateful statements about sahp probably feel guilty and feel a need to justify their choices by degrading others. This doesn't apply to those not vitrioling against sahps.

That was my point- women are expected to maintain themselves post divorce. If their partner isn’t contributing to their pensions and future it’s a risk giving up work that is underestimated.

i know pension split is a thing, i meant the older style pensions where they would support a widow for life, regardless of contribution.