A question for TartyHighHeels...

[CoffeeCakeAndKink]

Have name changed.

Tartyhighheels - I saw a post you made on a previous thread about cross dressing, talking about the BDSM community and so on. I have a couple of questions about it, if you are about? Genuine advice needed. Will post Qs if you post back on here - don't want to post life story if you're not about to give me your views...

bumping because I've seen THH on active

Bump

Bump

Can I help? I have a fair bit of knowledge of the BDSM scene.

Hi SGB... all advice welcome, as am a bit lost. It's a bit long, and might seem similar to another thread on here (the one which WWC started about her mate doing something that turned her DH on even though she wasn't really into it..)

But my situation is different as I used to be into various BDSM play, but am now not turned on by it and it's causing problems with DH.

DH and I met 8 years ago and quite quickly got involved in experimentation which led to places I hadn't been to before... spanking, bondage, sub-dom roleplay, hogtied porn, threesomes, foursomes, orgies etc. We were regulars on the torture garden scene and had a lot of sex every day! He was away with his job a lot though, so we weren't together every night, so it built up during the week and then we saw each other and kind of exploded, IYSWIM.

As time goes on however, I feel like I am coming out of a "phase" and that although it has been fun, it's not actually part of my genetic make up, and more and more I am doing it for him instead of me (or us). I don't mind this as I still don't get to see him all day every day, so I make the effort when we are together.

Then he changes jobs and moves in with me permanently (we got married a couple of years prior along the journey) and I can't keep up sex every night, so it goes down to maybe 4 or 5 times a week. Then as work gets more stressy and we're now 6 or 7 years into our relationship, I don't feel the need to have sex all the time and I don't really want to go to Torture Garden any more, and don't want to watch the same (or any, TBH) kind of porn with him. By the time our DS is conceived, we're probably down to 2 or 3 times a week.

DS is born and obviously he is patient in letting me recover and get used to breast feeding etc, and totally supportive of me and every thing I do as a mum etc, but after a while (maybe when DS is 6 months?) he starts to say he wants to start thinking about going back to TG again and tie me up, and spank and dress up in rubber like I used to. I just don't want to any more. It's not me any more. I always say during these conversations "I'll make more of an effort; we'll go to TG in a couple of months when my figure is back etc", but I am always saying this to make him stop going on about it now... I actually hope that he will just forget about it and be happy with vanilla sex twice a week.

DS is now over a year old and DS#2 is due in August. DH is scared that we have completely lost our way, sexually, and that he has lost his sexy, kinky wife forever, and this saddens him.

DH is amazing, loving and the most amazing man. This thread is not to become a DH bashing thread. What I wanted to ask TTH (only because I saw her saying something about this kind of situation on another thread) is what do you think I should do now? Do you think I could get it back, since I did enjoy it once? Would therapy (either on my own, or as a couple) help? It doesn't seem fair that DH married the kinky girl and then got stuck with twice-a-week vanilla girl.

Should he just accept sex and relationships change? Should I start going to TG again and hope I start to feel "it" again?

I'm just worried that if I keep sweeping this under the carpet, something is going to blow (him or me). I have even comtemplated just sending him to a dominatrix once a month to sate him, but I don't think we could afford it! (nor would I be able to stomach it).

Surely it's not fair for him to just have to live with my decision to not want that kind of sex any more? What can I do?

OK what you mustn't do is sweep it under the carpet, that will make both of you miserable and it isn't fair on either of you.
It is true that relationships and people's sexual appetites can change after having children - and in your case the fact that you had several years of infrequent naughty sex but then moved in together is another big change. Maybe a part of you is feeling that it's a bit 'inappropriate' for a Nice Married Mother to be putting on a rubber dress and belting round DG half the night. There's also the fact that right now you have a baby and you are PG which is going to affect your libido and your emotions anyway.
Do bear in mind that once your second baby has arrived and you have recovered from the birth there might simply come a point where you are gagging to get the handcuffs out and remind yourself of the naughtysexychick you were pre-motherhood - at least, don't rule that possibility out. IN the mean time, how about reading some rude literature, which can feel a lot less 'in your face' than explicit porn DVDs and get your imagination working. (am happy to plug own -work-- provide recommendations).
Above all, keep talking to your DH, reassure him that you love him, explain that you are all hormonal at the moment (because you are) and think if maybe you could cope with a night out somewhere low-key like a munch, just to dip your toes back in the water and maybe catch up with your scene mates a little?

I'm really interested to hear your replies, and thanks for having the sense to ask the question

I used to be enthusiastic about sex toys, role-play, dressing up, porn and so on. But, as I became more comfortable with my natural & basic sexuality, I lost interest in the trimmings. Eventually I got very tired of it, feeling like a symbol of sexiness rather than my own, female self - if that makes sense?

I split with DH#1 when he became heavily involved with a sex-toy-loving, BDSM-inclined, OW. I never went down that road again. Not to say I wouldn't, but these days I'd really need to know it was a game - an add-on - and not a subsitute for my own self. I haven't explained that very well (first time I've tried!)
Anyway. I hope SGB, and other persons with a wider perspective on human sexuality, will reply

x-post

I think the most important thing to hold onto is that your feelings and sexual tastes are valid and important but so are his. Be careful of any therapist/adviser peddling the line that unadorned, natural sex is morally superior and more 'mature' ie that your H is wrong and must change along with you, this is nonsense and unfair. Always when there is some kind of libido match, the best result is often some kind of compromise - and if a compromise really can't be reached then the answer is either: allowing the relationship to be opened up to other people, or ending the couple relationsip.

Thanks SGB, and ItsGraceAgain. I know that communication is key, and we have always been really open about all of this, but now I feel pressured to be something that I don't think I am, and that makes me want do these things even less, IYSWIM.

And the problem is, I don't really think it's having a baby or being a mum that has changed my appetite for this kind of sex (it HAS changed my overall libido, but that's because I am knackered all the time!) but I'm pretty sure that once the DCs are older and I am not so attached to them (in a carer kind of way) that I STILL won't be BDSM inclined. This is what I worry about. I don't want to say "hold on for a while - it might come back!) as I don't really think it will. But then SGB maybe you are right, maybe I will feel differently once things are a little less hectic, who knows?

I defo think the literature could be a good thing. I remember reading Story of O and all those kinds of books when we first got into it and they did turn me on, so maybe I just need to reawaken stuff that I don't know is still there. But what if I do read it and it does nothing for me? I'm almost scared to try in case all feelings are reinforced and then I really will want to say to DH that I can't do it any more.

One thing though, which is still alive, is my fancying women. That still hasn't gone away. I have thought about perhaps incorporating this side into our sex life, as a compromise, so it's a bit kinky but not as in-yer-face fetish filled, you know? But then I doubt I would be able to pull the same caliber of girls that I used to when DH and I were younger and I had a pre-baby body!

That's scary SGB, that if I can't change or compromise, that the alternatives are for him to have other experiences with other people, or to end the marriage. So then I have to do things I don't want to do? It seems so hard... but I know it's not fair just to expect it to go the way I want it...

coffee, I am going to come at this from a purely personal point of view

I have no experience of all these "scenes" of which you speak, so you may think my POV invalid

but what I get from your post is a kind of desperation

I feel sorry for you that you are casting around for something, anything that will keep your man interested...

you mention swinging more towards the ladies..yes you like 'em but are you being true to yourself? Can you really say, hand on heart, you are not just considering it for his wants ?

I am going to phrase this so badly, but opening Pandora's Box really doesn't seem to bring much contentment and happiness in the long run

unless you are a free spirit, like sgb, as soon as you get into the kids situation and feeling true love for your man, it all goes horribly wrong

the problem is...that fucking lid just won't go back on the box

I feel you may have to let him go, unless you are happy to be a bit-player in your relationship for ever

< prepares to be told to fuck off out of it >

shit, that was hard to type

Have you changed? or have you never really been into it but got caught up in the excitement of doing it at the beginning (as part of a new and exciting relationship).

I think what's really important is to find out what turns you on, what genuinely turns you on.

People change too, so it's important to find out what turns you on now and be open to even that changing as you get older.

< sweats >

Jesus AF - that is quite something to write. I am reeling a bit! If I told DH tomorrow that we would never do any of those things ever again, because otherwise it would mean the end of our marriage, he would be understandably shocked and upset, but would choose me as his soul mate and his wife and the mother of his kids over a good spanking!

The point I was trying to make is that, is it FAIR to ask him to give up all those things for me, because he loves me? Or should I try to be more like the person I was when we married because I love him? It works both ways.

I am not lying awake thinking of this all the time - and so am not desperate at all - I didn't mean for a desperation to come over in my post - I think I'm tired and a bit hormonal from pregnancy. I am concerned that I haven't really addressed this in our relationship properly, since DS was born, and therefore it's good to try and work things out in my head at least, and perhaps come up with a compromise that everyone is happy with. Because life is about compromise and I don't think it's fair to just say "this is what I want and therefore you have to lump it"... from either side.

I am not going to let him go , and I am not particularly happy about the bit player comment either... but then maybe I am being uber defensive and need to step back a bit.

Laurie, I have always fancied women, so that hasn't changed before or since, but when we got together, I was uninhibited but hadn't ever met anyone who brought out anything other than the odd bit of tying up with a dressing gown cord. We went on this massive journey together, and it was definitely 50 50 as we explored and made decisions to delve into the fetish scene. I jumped in head first! I loved it - I did, I am an exhibitionist at heart and would love to be watched having sex by tens of people at TG and so on (I had a killer body back then )... so in answer to your question, I don't think it was just being caught up in the excitement, I think I genuinely did get turned on by it all and enjoyed the ride...

... but it's like a switch has been turned off. And I don't know whether I can turn it back on, or even if I want to, IYSWIM? I am content with sex 2 or 3 times a week (maybe back up to 4 or 5 when the DC are both sleeping through!) and I like the odd bit of sexy lingerie and ass play and doggy and slight asphyxiation (sp?) but at the end of the day, I don't feel like I want to get the paddle out...

'is it fair to ask him to give it up'

No, but if you are really close then he would equally be unhappy with you just going along with it.

To have good, fulfilling sex now at this new stage in your life you need to communicate together. If all he wants is it to go back to the way it was before could that be more to do with not recognising the new changes in your lives - wanting to go backwards?

We all seek comfort in replaying the past, watching old movies, revisiting familiar places - this isn't so different maybe.

I find more with men that they can be a bit "if it ain't broke don't try and fix it" - your dh found something which worked for him, of course he's going to want to stay with that.

It sounds like he equally loves you though so making it a project to find out what turns you on now at this new stage in your life could be fun.

x-posted.

Glad you enjoyed it - it sounds like you are still up for mutual fun, just not the same fun and not all the time.

Life does tend to get in the way a bit of real physical closeness and the lovely lying around naked time. When young there seems all the time in the world - days definitely seemed longer

If you are no longer that person, why would you feel you have to force yourself ?

I read between the lines...did I read too much ? I don't know you, or him.

I struggle to see how, once that particular box of tricks has been opened, how you could put it all away again. You talked about much more than a "good spanking", tbh. Am I underestimating your husband? Would any man give all that up easily, once it has been on the agenda ?

I am sorry to make you feel sick, truly. That was not my intention.

AF, you expressed an important and difficult point very well. Stop sweating (unless it turns you on, of course )

SGB, I know my therapee stuff is my primary characteristic on here but what I described happened DECADES before I decided to embark on any 'programme of change'. Quite simply: as soon as I started to love my own body & sexuality, I started to dislike the objectification. Nothing to do with deeper thoughts, and everything to do with the nature of our relationship. I haven't got a problem with objectifying myself as part of a game. But, when the game is all there is, I resent it. That's me on that bed/floor/whatever, not some fantasy made flesh. While I couldn't agree with you more about searching for compromise, what occurred there was simple incompatibility. In fact, he broke up with Ms Bondage a few years later, and married Ms Ordinary. I can only suppose he continued to get his kicks with paid help, as he always had done ...

Coffee: I don't feel even remotely qualified to comment on your query. I am not at all assuming you're like me - I semi-hijacked your thread, because I am so interested in it! Er - sorry.

"but if you are really close then he would equally be unhappy with you just going along with it"...

That's just it - it's making ME unhappy because at the moment, he is just going along with what I want and I want us both to be happy and fulfilled in our sex life: I currently am, he is not. If the tables were turned and we were doing fetish scenes, he would be happy and I wouldn't be.

I hadn't thought about it like you had phrased it in the last sentence, that it could be that new things turn me on now that didn't before and that it could be a fun project to find out what these new things are. He has accepted that it was never going to back to the way it was before (he's not stupid, he knows having kids will change things a lot), but he's worried that currently there is NO fetish play and that's what he really loves.

That was a really helpful post - I feel re-energised to look at this from a different point of view... not to just think "I don't like this any more so we'll just crack on with vanilla", and more to think "what else is out there that does get me going now I'm this different incarnation of my former glorious self!" Or something like that... (Defo think it will involve women - have absolutely missed that side of things)

(am getting horny now - who'd have thunk it?)

< am still sweating, and no, not in a good way >

I think I will get a pasting very soon, so won't post again here again unless directly addressed.I have put my POV across now and believe me, it was in support of the OP's right to change her mind and not be coerced into anything she no longer wants to do.

However, she says there is no coercion here, and I take her word for that.

oh bloody hell

steady on, cake