if someone upsets someone you know, should you fall out with them too?

[starbaby]

I've got a group of friends...5 of us. Let's called them a,b,c,d and me! (lol)

I'm much closer to a and b but still good friends with c and d.

C and D have had HUGE row with A and B and really upset them. C and D have upset me too but not as much.

We've decided to part ways and I said I didn't want to fall out with anyone but my loyalties are with A and B. However, I still occasionally send and receive polite texts/emails from C and D.

A and B are now putting a lot of pressure on me saying that me retaining any sort of friendship with C and D is disloyal and hurtful towards them.

I should say that C and D were really horrible but I've been friends with them for 20yrs, I can't cope with conflict, bad feeling in my life and it's easier for me to live with myself knowing that should I meet them in the street I can still say hello.

A and B are the kind of people who when they get hurt, they get mad, stay mad and never forgive. However, they are both wonderful friends to me and I'd be lost without them.

If anyone has stayed with this long enough to understand, what do you think?

If someone upset your friend, would you fall out with them too?

If it was my family i'd definately fall out with them, A and B say same rules apply if it's your close friends.

argh - whole thing is sooo stressful!

On the face of it A and B sound a little bit childish tbh. You are an adult and can make a decision about who to be in touch with based on your own moral judgement.

You are not rubbing the relationship with C and D in their faces so they should just let it go.

However, without knowing the severity of what C and D did, it's hard to say.

Blimey, I'd tell them all where to go...no one dictates to me who my friends are!

Can they not just grow up, see the big picture and be a little more magnanimous?

Starbaby, I do sympathise with you because you sound very nice and very sensitive, but I do think you need to toughen up a bit.

I'm really sorry to sound harsh but if you want honest opinions I think you're all behaving like a bunch of nine year olds!

No I wouldn't. I don't take sides, so I would only fall out with someone if I was not happy to continue a friendship for my own reasons. Forgive me for saying so, but it all sounds a bit, well, teenage.

Agree, it's hard to judge without knowing the severity of the situation.

But, I see my relationships with people as being what they are between us, not between them and my friends.

For example, a friend of mine has apparently been treated badly by her ex-h. That doesn't mean though that I'm going to start pulling faces at him when I see him at the school gates, I just say hello with a brief smile. He hasn't done anything to hurt me personally.

I was hurt recently by a woman with whom I have several mutual friends. I wouldn't expect them for one moment to fall out with her. The issue is between me and her, nobody else.

A&B are out of order

unless something truly appalling has happened that makes you doubt whether C&D are actually truly hateful morally corrupt people

Mmn it depends on what was done. If one friend really slagged me off or slept with my man then I'd fall out with any friends who kept in with her. Friends should be loyal, if they're wavering I don't see the point. But it would have to be bad.

Ah my two best friennds used to fall out constantly. And of course I could only be friends with one or the other.

The difference being we were about 13 years old.

A and B are being very childish imo.

Unless C and D had an orgy with A and B's better halves that is?

It really depends on what happened, it's impossible to say without knowing. But as a general rule, you have to be free to make your own mind up about friends.

Make an adult decision based on what you think is right and stick to it.

What bothers me here, is that they've made quite a good point. You would definitely have fallen out with them forever if it had been family members, but as they're just friends, you're not that bothered about what they did? Now that IS weird, to me. What they did was either okay, or not okay.

Are you feeling so frightened of conflict and bad feeling/bumping into them in the street awkwardness that you'd rather just stay friends? What sort of friendship is that?

Stick up for what's right, stop copping out by saying you're scared of conflict (what's that all about?), and make your own decision.

Its up to you who you are friends with.
My dp's friend has a new girlfriend who I get on really well with. I recently found out that a few years ago she seriously upset one of my best friends. I'm a bit wary of the girlfriend now that I know what happened, but she has always been nice to me so I treat her the same way. My best friend knows this and is fine with it as long as she doesn't have to see her and I don't discuss them with each other iyswim.
Its a difficult situation and you have to be grown up about it.
So tell A and B that you will not cut off contact with C and D. The fact that you have told C and D that your loyalties lie with A and B should be enough and if it isn't then tough banana!!

If C & D have upset you sufficiently for you to not want to talk to them on their own, it's one thing.

If only by upsetting A & B (and nothing technically to do with you) C& D have upset you by association, then always best to adopt the position of Switzerland.

if A & B start pressuring you to pick sides. Pick one. Your own and tell them ALL to grow up.

i had this on an expat forum last year. B fell out with D, B didn't want me talking to anyone that didn't back her. I said, nowt to do with me, get over yourself. Then D wanted to sabotage and pick over any weird stuff with B. In the end D hassled me soo much I couldn't be bothered and dropped her. In the end B turned out to be odd too, so I'm not in contact with either of them.

Being Switzerland is always the best policy

I think if what C&D have done is - to you- not bad enough to warrant cutting them dead, then stay in contact by all means.

One thing I would say though is that if you do maintain contact with all 4, you have to be quite careful not to be seen to be stirring...

for example I have 3 friends, lets say X, y and Z.

Z threw a hissy fit some years ago & hasnt spoken to me or X since. She was less pissed at Y, who 'made up' with her. X and I are still Y's friends.

After this, Y every so often threw up bits of conversation like when Z had a baby - 'oh, Z's pregnant, but she told me not to tell you, as you have never had anything good to say about her' or told us things Z had said about us.

In the end X & I had to say that this was pissing us off, we were happy NOT to be Z's friends, and didnt want to a) hear what she was doing or b) know what she thought of us.

OP, am sure you would have more sense than to behave like my friend in any event!

If your friends fall out and are not mature enough to sort it out intelligently, that's their business, and they should not try to make it yours. It makes it difficult for social occasions, etc, when you want to invite people out, but you'll work something out with time. It is absolutely unacceptable of any of your friends to insist that they dictate who you spend time with.

It's dependant entirely upon your personal moral compass and perception of loyalty.

Morally, it matters most whether you find C&D's behaviour so vile that you personally don't wish to associate with them or so vile towards A&B that you can no longer respect or trust C&D as friends.

I'm extremely loyal to my friends, if one or several of them behaved towards other friends in a way which I found morally reprehensible, I would stand by the side of those whose behaviour I judged as 'right'.

If, however it was over something which I felt was a minor 'wrong' I would not be highly unlikely to 'take sides' and be more likely to seek to help in any reparation of friendships.

I would never, ever bow to demands that I make or break friendships from anyone according to someone else's perception of events/moral compass/ downright neediness.

Furthermore, my loyalty is sincere and mine to give, a forced version would not be true and would not benefit the friendship, ultimately. In fact I would be more likely to find such demands morally reprehensible and that person would lose my respect!

*I would be highly unlikely to 'take sides'....

I don't think A and B have the right to decide who you should fall out with.

If A and B are good friends they should understand how you feel, I would just tell them you cannot make enemies, and you understand they've fallen out with C and D, but you would like to remain on civil terms.

Then just don't mention C and D.

"A and B are the kind of people who when they get hurt, they get mad, stay mad and never forgive. However, they are both wonderful friends to me and I'd be lost without them."

So, A&B are grudge-holders. IME such people will eventually hold a grudge against pretty much everyone. They have been wonderful friends but they are currently pressuring you into falling into line with what they want. Ooh, is that I grudge I see coming over the horizon, heading your way?

Honestly, I don't see A&B as future wonderful friends. Already, you've failed to fall into line at the first click of the fingers, that's something to be flung in your face when they decide to fall out with you.

If they truly were wonderful friends, they would respect your preference to remain neutral.

It's way too long and complicated a fall out to even begin to explain but thank you all for your input and opinions - they were very useful.

I cut contact with a friend who was very hurtful to my best friend. She was closer to bf than me but lost the plot and cut her out - so I felt I wanted to cut her out too. But that was my choice. A & B should not be asking you to cut them out, that's not fair.