DH just not interested in being a family

[turtle23]

I am very sad. DH and I tried for ages to have DS (now 14 months) and DH was very keen on becoming a parent. He would go on and on about how he came from a big family and children were so important...blahblahblah. He has shown so little interest in DS it is sad.
We have just been on our first holiday as a family and he spent the entire week shouting that he wasn't getting enough sleep, that it was boring playing with DS, what was he meant to do all day as there was just lovely beach and pool etc and not much else. He refused to help when DS was tiny and I was on the verge of PND from lack of sleep. He will not feed him. He will not change him. He goes out alll the time to AVOID playing families. I feel as though I am living with all the shitty bits of single parenting and the shitty bits of marriage and none of the benefits. Like an idiot, I am now 17 weeks pregnant with number two and it has got me thinking whether my kids and I would be better off without him. Sadly, my major concern would be that he would farm the kids out if faced with weekend visits. Anybody feel like chewing this over with me?

Hi Turtle. Sorry that your holiday wasn't the relaxing one you needed.

I think that it is possible that he sees you coping TOO well. I might be way off the mark here, and correct me if I'm wrong, but it seems that at the moment he doesn't need to get more involved because, despite being exhausted/having horrendous morning sickness/basically doing everything for P with no help, you are still getting on with things and being an amazing mum to P.

If I were you I wouldn't let him get away with just taking him to playgroup (Good grief, we go to toddler group so I can turn Ff loose let her play with other babies and have a cuppa and a chat). I would insist that he spend proper, actual time with P, not just to give you a break, but because he is his father.

And if that doesn't work then it might be time for ultimatums, but while you are pregnant it is stress that you don't need.

FWIW, Bloke has his moments, and in the past has treated time spent with Ff as a favour to me, but I think we are past that now.

turtle...

I've been thinking about this. I agree and disagree with Ff

I do think it's probably because you appear to be coping so well. I know there are a handful of times I've obviously appeared ready to drop / kill someone and DH is first there doing whtever he can and telling me to go back to bed..

But, I don't think you should force your Dh and DS to have any particular sort of relationship...

I think, right now, you need to focus on what you need a little bit... For me, I wouldn't get upset where or how your DH and DS go together... I'd never expect DH to take DS to a group where (i) it was mostly women or (ii) he was expected to sing.

It's not fair on him... I enjoy that stuff, he doesn't. As long as I can say: Please look after / play with DS for a hour so I can do X,Y or Z, and know DS will be OK, then that's fine with me. Yes, they need to spend time together, but what they do and how they do it should be soemthing they work out together.

I also think that, if your DH is overlooking your needs to a degree, then you should consider doing the same... what I mean is: Take DS out, whatever is fun - the swings, a playdate or a pottery painting place, and if the house doesn't get cleaned.... oh well... If you are missing out on fun things with DS in order to do things you don't like (such as cleaning) and then not getting any respect for that, then you are going to feel resentful..

Can I ask: Did you work before your DS was born? Are you now a SAHM? That has happened to me, and it's taken something of a re-adjustment for both of us (In fact, something I'm only beginning to feel better about now I've been accepted on to teacher training and can see a light at the end of the tunnel!!)

HM

You are all being too understanding about a man who is frankly failing in his role as a father.

Tell him you are going out,or even better, going away for a night. Don't ask, tell.

He will survive. Your ds will survive. It will be a much needed bit of independence for everyone.

You are 'soldering on' and doing everything. You are being a mug and a doormat.

He's not disabled, or abroad, he's there in your house, doing bugger all. Start making time for yourself and he will just have to fit in.

And so what if he farmed the children onto someone else when it's his turn? at least if they were all round his parents for example, the ds would get to spend quality time with someone who's intereted in him.

And it makes me mad when Mums ask for 'help' from their dh's. Dh is DAD not the help.

mrsmaidamess- If his parents were physically able to care for DS it'd be no problem. Their house is the kind of house you see on How Clean Is Your House and they are elderly and arthritic. If DH dumps DS on them DS will not be safe.
I'm being a mug and a doormat. Well, yes, in some senses I am. But I am still hoping that my husband will find some way of connecting with his son and at least I will know that I have tried. I do not want to take his father away unless I know that I have done all I can.

But why is it down to you? Your dh clearly has enormous issues with fatherhood.

I'm sorry if I sound harsh but I feel it's you making all the compromises and trying to bridge the gap, while he sits there like a petulant child saying what he will and won't do.

A friend of mine has a very similar relationship with her dh. He does NOTHING for the children, never has done. )We call him Victorian Dad)

Consequently she runs around, keeping them apart almost, so he is not bothered by them, and the children aren't disappointed.

But there will come a point when the children will notice that dad doesn't take them out or play with them, or cook for them or anything that being a Dad involves.

Have you pointed this out to your dh? About how his behaviour towards the son that he wanted is storing up resentment and ill feeling for later years?

mrsmaidamess - I agree with you totally. That is all.

Sorry, mrsmaidamess, if he's working and supporting his family, then he's not neglecting his family completely.

Yes, there are obviously some issues which need to be addressed but there are lots of ways to achieve that.

I don't think it's fair to say the OP's DH has issues around fatherhood. Lots of guys have the idea that they work and the SAHM cleans etc., It's often how they were brought up.

That's why I asked if the OP had given up work coinciding with the birth of the baby.

FWIW, my father had a very distant role in my childhood (worked abroad) and that hasn't stopped us being close now.

My DH is certainly the lesser care giver to my son, but (largely) I don't find that a problem. He has two daughters who he only really sees EOW and it hasn't stopped him being a great father to them.

I'm not saying 'ooh, everything is fine' as clearly it's not, but that doesn't mean her DH is a bad father or husband... Well, I don't think so anyway.

WHY should you lower your expectations to the extent that this behaviour is acceptable.

In my life, this behaviour would make my DH a bad father and husband.

It is not ime normal by any means.

God what's the point of beng with a man who obviously does not want to be in the situation? iE being married to you and having dc??

He isn't meeting any of your needs or that of your little ds is he?

What exactly does he do for you? From your posts i can't see anything worthwhile going on in the marriage

Why the hell should you have to hang around for years in the vague hope he may eventually want to be a daddy to your dc and a great partner to you? And more to the point why would you want to?

Haribo I think he is being both a bad husband and a bad father.

But I really feel everytime the OP steps in and does everything for fer he will not, he either feels excluded or 'oh good, she's doing it so I don't have to'

I think turtle should take a step back, to see if he's got what it takes to step up.

She should be making demands on him (rather than 'asking'), not the other way round..all the time you accept this kind of behaviour it makes it acceptable.

And Haribo, why don't you expect your dh to accompany you on trips out with you and the children? I just find that very strange. It's so old fashioned, like children shouldn't bother their busy Fathers.

hi mrsmaidamess - I'm currently feeding DS (and MNing, obviously!) while DH watches the news headlines!! hahaha! I guess that does sound old fashioned!!!

BUT... When DS is finished making a mess eating, DH will bath him and give him a bottle when he's ready for one.

My point was, we don't both have to do everything, we just have to work together to make sure everything gets done...

I prefer taking DS to groups and walking, DH doesn't... Why would I MAKE him do that? He wouldn't make me do something I didn't enjoy...

That was what I meant. I didn't mean to belittle any problems the OP has.

Oh, I have to admit this... When DH worked away, I would dress DS for DH coming home on a Friday...

Now, I will agree that, in this day and age, that is very sad, but I did enjoy doing it and I do feel it helped them bond (DS being in a happy, clean state for his dad)

I'm sorry, I didn't mean to kill the thread

Oh turtle, I am so sad to see this.

I agree that you shouldn't adjust your expectations - they are low enough IMO! You deserve better than how he is at the moment and they was he is treating you and P.

If I were you, I would be leaving and giving him some time to think about what he wants. He either wants you, P, new baby and changes his behaviour accordingly or he wants to be single. He can't have both. Could you go and stay with your parents for a month or so?

[BIG HUG]

Turtle -
most men are not crap with babies. Many men are lazy with childcare when there is a woman around who'll do it, but that is not what your H is being. My DH is in love with his son. I'm not saying this to make you feel crap but to point out that there's something very wrong with your H. My DH adores spending time with him, finds him delightful and so much fun, as I do. He's lazy with housework but does some, but I'd rather a man who is fab with his son and loves him, than a man who is on top of the housework! But your H dos neither. You don't expect too much, not enough if anything, and it sounds like you'd be better off alone . Sad for your poor kids that their dad is such a waste of oxygen.

Turtle you husband is lazy and being a brat. You need to drag him to counselling; he will assume that you will be told how unreasonable you are and he will be told how forbearing and patient he is. Allow him to think this.

Insist that you go; tell him that he has a choice: counselling or divorce. This will work. (And truly, if it doesn't you will be better off with divorce.)

"When I have had a very bad night [for example]with DS(he's a rotten teether) and then get up and vomit from morning sickness I think DH should at least ask if I'm ok. He just asks me to shut DS up as he's trying to get some sleep. I know that I need to change my expectations, but ffs...
Having said that, I must still care or it wouldn't be making me so sad. "

hmmm. that was me pregnant with number 3 i had evening "morning"sickness; looking after Ds1 and DD, after being at work, and coming home to relive nanny; i would callhim at office ask him to come home and help - but he would not (he didnt have to stay in office he was just bad at time management).

and "shut him up i am trying to sleep" - hello?? how about - "your turn tonight, I will do tomorrow nght?" and actually do it?

(i should say, that in my case the "shut them up" comments became more prominent when my ex had severe mental health issues/became agressive and violent, so it kind of made me go uh oh - maybe reading more into it than i should? but you know whether this is one off or more frequent...)

i dont think you are sad about him you are sad because this isnt what you envisaged when you had kids with him. you are sad because you know this relationship can not continue in this vein...

i think you are beyond caring about him because he does not appear to care about you or your child. but you care about the family you thought you had created together...

try relate/counselling.

if he wont go - go yourself.

Ewe- My family live 6000 miles away. Not the easiest to do when trying to fit in AN appts and I couldn't face the flight right now. Thanks for the hug, though.
I think unless you have a husband like mine (and it seems some do) you can't imagine how pointless "just make him do it" comments are. I COULD make him do it and I have. All that happens is he gets very resentful and backs away more. As for him seeing me do it so well...HA! He watches me cry with exhaustion and says"You wanted a baby, you knew they were hard wor." I do, obviously, point out that he did too...he says it's my job.
I should say that it isn't like I'm struggling badly day to day...I just wouldn't mind an evening to myself, a lie-in once a year, being able to cook without my lovely limpet tring to help...etc.

"He watches me cry with exhaustion and says"You wanted a baby, you knew they were hard wor." I do, obviously, point out that he did too..."

good god I have just read this thread thinking I am sure he can change as some men do tend to swtich off during babyhood (I am not saying it's acceptable just some do) but thats not just not liking babies thats just being nasty. The only thing he should be doing if you are crying with exhaustion is giving you a huge hug or telling you to have a nap for 30minutes whilst he looks after his DS, because thats how people who love each other act.

Turtle honestly,he shouldn't have to go for counselling or be told that he has to help should he? Any decent human being should just want to help you

If i saw you struggle then i would offer to help and i don't even know you FFS.

I can't see what the point of trying to force him to be a dad tbh. Doesn't sound like he has any feelings for you or your son.

He is behaving like this because you are doing all the coping and he doesn't have to.

I would just announce that you are going out for the day and GO. Leave him to get on with it-instead of being your extra chid.

If you love him I would sit down and have the discussion that ClaudiaS suggested-if you don't, you would be much better on your own.

Oh, turtle, I'm sorry.

I hope you didn't think I was making light of your siuation.

My DH is rather like your in ways - we are off to baby gym tomorrow (DH is not at work) but DH won't come. Dads don't do things like that!!!!! (apparently!)

BUT! DH has this morning taken DS downstairs so I can have my tea in peace (I'll get up now to feed DS as DH doesn't like the mess) but then DH will look after DS while I pop out for some freecycle bits errands.

And, no, DH would never let me sit in tears without offering some sort ofhelp. for you.

I think next time he says something like 'you knew it would be hard' you have every right you DID NOT KNOW it would be so hard because YOU DID NOT KNOW you would be doing it all yourself!!!

Hope you are OK.

HM xx

6000 miles sounds about right but you're right, the flight would be hideous and you have scans etc that you need to go to.

I think the counselling suggestion is a good one, if you can make him go? Does he talk at home?

Could you try writing a letter? I find DP takes things on board more if I write them down and leave him to read and absorb. If I try to talk about things (not the same issue as you, but same principle) we normally end up arguing because it is discussed when I am angry/upset/pissed off.

Haven't had time to read all threads but just wanted to say that many people (both men and women)find looking after young children boring. I have to say my own idea of fun isn't sitting on the floor brumming cars up and down with a toddler. But hey, I did it and with the best grace in the world.

Your DH sounds very selfish. Have no advice really, but I have to agree that you might well be better off as a single parent. If you are looking after your children on your own anyway then doing so may well be easier without you having to put up with your DH's long face and spoilt brat tantrums about lack of sleep.

I would go for counselling. Does he not realise that his behaviour is making you seriously consider leaving him???!

The more I've read your posts turtle the more I think that his behaviour is TOTALLY unacceptable. Telling you see to your cyring ds whilst throwing up? Watching you cry with exhaustion. Its DISCUSTING behaviour. Was he this bad before dc's?

Initally I thought ok yeah blokes can be crap with babies/ might be depressed.

I'd go with the ultimatum, relate or divorce. Problem is you're pg, god what an awful situation