Our 5th visit to the Stately Home

[Nabster]

Here we go again.

Interesting all 3 of us are I. In my workplace 90% odd are E.

Anyway, if you can work out what family members are it can help you learn how to communicate better with them...

If you want to

I wonder how much of the 'I' is from conditioning- I sometimes wonder if I would naturally have been more of an extrovert.

Hello - haven't been around for a while as have had henious gastric flu and been very busy, and it will take me a while to catch up.

But I'm an INFJ, so another I for you. But I think it's something integral, rather than conditioned. In my case I've been conditioned/ quite possibly trained myself to be quite outgoing, and most people would probably see me as an extrovert. The deciding question is what's your idea of hell - always being alone, or never being alone? If I can't get some time on my own, my brain starts to explode.

Have counselling session today, which I am really looking forward to, as have had such an up and down time and really need to make some sense of it (boss at work is triggering all sorts of family emotions for me and it is hard to deal with).

I was thinking about it last night and I agree, it must be something integral to a person's self.

I know I give conflicting signals to people. On good days I wil be quite open and share my thoughts, on bad days I put on a front and just say I'm fine and people are left a bit confused, but I am so accustomed to covering myy unhappy feelings it's a hard habit to break.

Hope you have a good session today. I have one tomorow.

re is it learned or innate, when I went through the questions I felt that a lot of my answers were influenced by my anxiety which comes from bad things that happened during childhood. The tendency to think about things deeply on my own is something I've always had though.

I agree that lots of people who feel introverted have learnt ways to act extrovertly in order to get along more easily in life. Some people seem to have a very different view of me to what is true which means my acting has 'fooled' them and other people can see through it.

I wonder if the fact that we are mostly I means that extroverts might cope with bad experiences better? Maybe if we expressed it all as soon as it happened and got the feelings out they wouldn't have stayed inside festering and intensifying and warping our thoughts for years?

Hi, haven't done that test yet but don't think i need to. Am sure i will also be an 'I'. I definately like and need my own space on a regular basis. But what you said AN strikes me as very interesting; that an extrovert child might internalise emotions less than an introvert child.

Looking at my DC's, DD is most definately an extrovert. If she is hurt/upset she makes sure I know about it and demands sympathy etc. DS on the other hand definately 'keeps it all inside' even at his age (2.10). Once had been playing in the garden and somehow gashed his knee quite badly without anybody seeing him do it. DH only saw the blood a little while later. The whole time DS had just carried on playing without making any sort of fuss. Even if i see him hurt himself he hates me making a fuss over him. Whereas DD will not let me get away without making a fuss.

I can see that DD will always 'let out' her emotions as long as she has somebody who is willing to listen. I think this is quite an important point. I think I learnt to keep my emotions to myself as i learnt very early on that my mother was not interested in hearing how i felt. I think even an introvert child still needs an outlet for his/her emotions. Even if DS does not need to cry/scream like his sister if he is hurt/upset, i think does need to know that there is somebody there who cares how he is feeling.

A bit more to add......I don't think introvert/extrovert adults cope with bad experiences better/worse, just differently. And i think there is big difference between introvert/extrovert children and adults. Healthy adults whether I or E have learnt how to cope with and process their emotions, whereas damaged adults have not.

Pinkyminky thank you for your response. I know i should just let things go with my sister but i can't. Don't know why. I guess inside i feel quite hurt and rejected by her. By the fact that she treats her SIL's more like sisters than me. After she had her baby i thought it might bring us a bit closer, i thought she might call me for advice about the baby etc. But she never did, not once. And i realise now she probably was calling her SILs (she has 3) for advice (her SILs have 8 children between them).

She definately prioritises her family in law over her biological family. I am sure that is as a result of our problems and she has admitted as much. Not to prioritising her family in law, but she did say she found it easier to be around her family in law than her biological family as there are none of the undercurrents/tensions that we have. I am sure there are tensions within her family in law as well but she is not a part of them as she did not grow up with them.

I just want things to be out in the open with her rather than just leaving it. eg. I am currently waiting on a reply from her to DS's birthday party invitation i sent her at the weekend. She said she would get back to me on monday and so far she still hasn't replied. I am not going to chase her up. But i do want to speak to her about it if she doesn't reply at all or very very late. She always says she is too busy to call me/text me, come over or it's too far etc etc. But i am sure she makes every effort needed to call her SILs and attend their children's birthday parties.

I suppose what is also upsetting me is that it is DS's birthday party i have invited her to. It's not for me, it's for DS and it'll be a chance for DD and DS to see their cousin who is nearly one and who they have hardly seen.

I can't just leave it as it is too upsetting for me. I don't feel i have much in common with my sister but i feel i should make an effort with her for the sake of the DC's. But i feel that as my sister's daughter already has 8 other cousins she is not particularly bothered about her daughter having a relationship with my DC's. I suppose i feel not only is she rejecting me but my DC's and that really hurts.

I keep dreaming that my mother is still alive, and that I am very matter-of-fact about it, just accepting that she was on the point of death but, somehow is back to normal now. In the dream I am in her house. My father is in her house, despite me wanting so much that he should piss off out of her life. The house is a mess and I want to clear it up.

The sad thing is that I do not want her to be still alive. When she died, I cleaned out her pit of a house and it was a relief to throw so much away.

I just wanted to give voice somewhere to that vile thought.

Threadworm, my mother had a heart op a while ago and i was secretly hoping she would die. She didn't.

Recently i have twice thought i have seen my mother walking around near to where i live. It definately wasn't her as she lives miles away and wouldn't just come to where i am and wander about. I know I am not 'seeing' her because i want to see her in RL. But i suppose i do want to feel she gives a damn that i have cut her off. I think she does, but only in so far as it means she is not seeing her grandchildren. I know she hasn't given any in depth thought as to how i am feeling and why i have cut her and my dad off.

I don't think your thoughts are vile. They are a normal reaction to the way your mum treated you as a child.

Thank you oneplusone. I'm sorry for your sad situation.

Sorry, too, to parachute into the thread. There is so much backstory for each of you, that I can catch up on without reading the long history of stately homes threads. So I feel I can't respond properly to any of you, except to give you all my very bset wishes.

can = can't.

Hello all

The INTJ thing, Myers Briggs wise I thought was interesting because perhaps more 'boisterous' kids may have shrugged some things off that their parents did.

With me I was always very introverted, loved reading by myself, loved loads of time on my own, made up lots of internal stories. Would probably be classed as 'sensitive' argh hate that word. I can't watch anything on the news re children or animals because it stays with me and upsets me for months. [no one mention Baby P, I have managed to avoid knowing any details since the whole thing went public].

I'm waffling, but I think that half of me was possibly born that way and half was probably made that way due to living under strict control by my parents.

My mum once went mad at me because she asked my grandad to look at my earring in my ear, it had gone infected, and apparently my ear was 'waxy' inside, tmi sorry. She said how would she cope with the shame etc, her dad must think she didn't look after us properly, why couldn't i have cleaned it etc etc it was like I'd gone for a poo on my grandad's carpet or something!! Weird how I remember such small events...

Anyway, my point is that I'm not sure I would have been half so 'introved' if I hadn't had the parents and childhood that I did have.

QUESTION - Please help with ideas / advice!!

I'm one of the ones whose parents aren't out and out baddies by any stretch of the imagination. Controlling and didn't help me when I was young (hence crappy childhood) but not really what you'd call abusive, certainly not physically or sexually.

I have recently stopped contact with my parents, as regular readers will know. However, this weekend is Mother's Day as I'm sure we are all aware.

There is a lunch at my parents. My brother and SIL and niece / nephew are going. We have also been invited but have declined for obvious reasons.

But... what do I do re Mother's Day? Part of me says sending a card at the moment would be totally hypocritical and the other half says if I don't I'm going to burn in hell, my family will never forgive me and my mom will be devastated.

Any ideas?

jumping in-sorry-just caught up again.

Yes Im an I too. No suprises there then .

I was just looking at the description for extrovert;

'...Extraverts tend to enjoy human interactions and to be enthusiastic, talkative, assertive, and gregarious. They take pleasure in activities that involve large social gatherings, such as parties, community activities, public demonstrations, and business or political groups....'

All these words, descriptors struck a chord with me, and I thought, how an earth could I have been or become an extravert with my background? How could any of us?

I had my confidence torn down constantly, was discouraged from trusting others or trusting anyone. Taught self doubt in place of self belief.

I learnt to anticipate fear and danger at every turn and in every circumstance.

My earliest lessons were; fear, anxiety and rejection.

I dont see how, growing up in this environment, I could have ever become anything other than introverted. It just wasn't conducive to becoming socially confident, outgoing.

I dont know how I would have turned out had I been brought up in a different environment.
I suspect I would still have been highly sensitive, but so fearful? Anxious?

I think all children probably lean one way or another, but I definately think the environment they grow up in, especially an extreme one can cause an 'extreme' leaning toward one or the other.

Hesdoneitagain - sorry cross posted with you.
Cant tell you what to do, but what would make life easier for you? What sits right?
You could get a very plain card and send it.
OR could send nothing at all.
How would that feel? For you I mean. What feelings does it bring up?
Discussing the options and the fear behind taking one or all of them may help.

I hate mother's day. I too send a card and present, but only to keep the peace. I absolutely don't mean it. It seems ridiculous in a way. She will phone and say thank you and be pleased she got something. This is all she cares about. Like everything is okay because I sent a card. I would love to have the strength to not send one.

I too have often wished my parents were dead. I actually think it is a common feeling towards toxic parents. I don't know how I would actually feel if they died, but I sometimes long for the release from the guilt and anxiety their living brings.

Smithfield - are you me in disguise ? Your post of 9.23 I could have written word for word.

Feel very sad for all of us. x

Thank you for your replies.

I'm thinking while I write so apologies if I don't make sense

Pros for Not sending one:

I don't feel I should at the moment - we're having a big 'row' (and break of contact) over their not keeping me in a happy environment when I was a child. Therefore, logically sending a card feels stupid and wrong.

All the snide and controlling comments I've had since growing up and recently don't make me feel inclined to send one at all.

If I don't they will know I'm serious and I will feel that weird 'power' thing again

Cons for not sending one

It would break my moms heart. A. I dont want to do that and B. I dont want the guilt of doing that weighing on me.

She has been a wonderful mom at times.

My entire family would kill me

So I'm going on side of plain card to keep the peace partially but what on earth do I write in it?

hesdoneitagain- all the pros were about your feelings but the cons were about theirs.

Well for one thing, Wiki says that 'Mothers Day was created for the whole family to honour their mothers.

After my mother dished out her venom and spat me out to bleed on the floor, she won't be getting any honour from me that's for sure.
If I was to send her a card I would write something like this...
'Dear Eileen. Happy Mothers Day. You are not worthy of that title. You don't deserve it. Hope your day is filled with all the poison that you dished out to me for all these years, and I hope that it brings you many years of joy.
Your last remaining child,
Carol.

PS Now fuck off, you miserable cow'

Of course I won't be sending a card, I won't bother wasting my time for another rejection. I couldn't stand another knock back. Went to supermarket earlier and saw all those lovely, glittery cards with 'mother' written on them.
One stated in pink bold letters 'WHAT IS A MOTHER'? Define the word mother. Some people could think it's just the person who gave birth to you, but others will think of warmth, comfort and love.

Another I here too. Am an INFP.

Bugger. Smithfield get out of my head!! Now I'm sure you're me

PurpleOne - I'm not at that stage (un)fortunately. I'm angry with my parents but dont hate them. They have both good and bad points and the hurt they caused me was not malicious really, just them being a bit emotionally thick.

Which is why Im ambivalent re the card.

In a way I wish I was where you are so I at least was comfortable with my decision (sorry not trying to be flippant I'm aware you must have had some horrible times to feel like that about your mother)