Married to someone with Asperger’s/ASD/ ND: support thread 18

[Bluebellforest1]

This thread is for those of us seeking to explore the dynamics of long term relationships with our ND partners. Some of us are ND ourselves, some have ND children. It is a support thread and a safe space, it does get emotional at times. Avoid sweeping generalisations and try to keep it specific to you and your partner.

these threads have been going about 10 years now and have been a lifeline of support for many of us.

Previous thread
www.mumsnet.com/talk/relationships/5447569-married-to-someone-with-aspergersasdnd-support-thread-17?latest=1

Well yes. Bit of a case of "ill hide the truth now and reveal it later in the hope that you're in so deep that you just have to take it", isn't it?

AI…..”Autism mirroring is the conscious or unconscious imitation of other people's speech patterns, body language, facial expressions, or social behaviors. Autistic individuals use it as a tool to learn social cues, build connections, or navigate complex social environments safely”. I think this happens often even amongst NT people but more so within ND.

It’s how people build connections….Narcs do this to attract supply, ND people are just trying to fit in, both survival behaviours. Relationships fail all the time because people aren’t who they claimed to be, it’s just a natural course of some relationships. Some people simply grow apart. He may not have a clue he has done anything wrong. He saw someone he liked, he mirrored to attract the person and then couldn’t sustain it. Before I knew I was ND I did “pretend” to like things that actually hurt me because I wanted the connections so desperately. It strained my relationship to my ex and it’s annoyed him and it upset and overwhelmed me. Neither of us was happy. It’s ok to not be happy and to want to leave.

I think it’s a common theme amongst many Nd people to not have a strong sense of self and a shifting identity, sometimes picking up bits of others along the way. We so badly want connection and to feel connected but don’t often know how. It’s a lot of work trying to shake off all of this to find the real self. Some people might not have a clue who they are.

Agreed it can be a survival behaviour, but it is not one that can be a basis for any sort of honest and genuine relationship.

No it isn’t and that’s why the relationships fail. You can’t base a relationship on this. I had to take some accountability for my ex relationship. Although I got involved with a narcissistic man (absolutely sure of this) I wasn’t being me. I was trying to be someone he would like and so he’d stop abusing. I am much more neurodivergent than I was living. My partner now although he isn’t perfect he gets the real version of me.

Relationships are naturally meant to fail when they aren’t healthy. An unhealthy flower will die eventually. We are trying desperately to keep a dead relationship alive. If you are ND you have to take accountability for yourself and be honest about who you are and what you need. But this is incredibly hard for ND people who’ve had to survive life. We often fall in love with the mask, but the mask is often a reflection of yourself because that’s who they think you want.

The partner of the OP in this scenario may desperately want to enjoy holidays like his partner. He is just overwhelmed by the event and he isn’t in control of the overwhelm…it’s incredibly frustrating to be taken over by your mind and body. Personally I wanted to be like my ex, outgoing, chat to anyone, able to work and be socially like a butterfly, I did try so hard….unfortunately I’m an anxious awkward twat in social situations. I guess another person would have tried to bring him down out of jealousy to feel as bad as I did. Instead I burnt out. It is shit being ND at times, it’s really hard to look at others and want the same but can’t. But that’s not the partners fault!

. If you are ND you have to take accountability for yourself and be honest about who you are and what you need. But this is incredibly hard for ND people who’ve had to survive life

Yes.

I just have to swallow it and accept that he's had life harder than me? When im actual fact, he hasnt in terms of circumstances.

@MyPlumHelper I think what I'd say first is that it really isn't a competition and it doesnt matter how hard or easy he's had life, if this relationship isn't working for you, it's not working for you.

No. You have to do what makes you happy.

My ex had a hard life, harder than me really. I grew up undiagnosed and permanently confused and insecure. He grew up taking a beating from his drunk dad trying to protect his mum from his dad. As horrible as that is, it’s not my cross to bare. I could support him through therapy, I could support him whilst he broke his back trying to undo damage he never asked for to be a better person. But I would not stand by and let him hurt me because he was hurting himself. Boundaries need to be in place.

To meet a kind and caring person is an absolute blessing when you carry trauma and someone to work damn hard for to protect them from it. This man of yours is lazy and taking his hurt out on you as so many do. It’s not acceptable. A decent Neurodiverse person would not behave like this and it’s wrong to use this label. Being ND does not make you behave abusive. Abusive people behave abusive because they can’t/wont do the work the need to do, it’s easy to blame you.

I agree with everything you say @Marshmallowkiss

Plum - what do you want? He's not going to change back. This is who he is. And you're unhappy, aren't you?

What people who fall 'in love' don't seem to understand is that for the first 6 months, even I'd say the first year, you see the filtered, best behaviour version of the person you meet. It's the very best they will ever be at the start because they want you and they want to be loved by you so they put the best version forward. It's human to want to build connection and feel like you belong somewhere so we adapt and try to flex a bit to make that connection grow.

But often people get caught up in the initial feeling of love and acceptance in that early 'best behaviour' version which isn't really the real person.

Then they keep hoping that best version is still available. It's not. It was never real. It was a filtered, sanitised version to try to form a connection but it's not who they really are. That comes further down the line in year 2 or more... You need to be pragmatic, not emotional and weight up probabilities I would say.. hard though that is.

I'm not sure we have an answer here where there's a happy outcome.

You stay, you're unhappy. You leave, you're unhappy.

The only thing is if you leave, you will eventually get over him and be free to start a new relationship with someone who actually could make you happy long term, if you choose wisely. Staying doesn't look like it will ever be that but good luck with trying... if that's the path you choose.

No, he's never actually apologised.And when I called him out on the holiday thing, he just looked at me and said, is that a breach of terms and conditions, then. He didn't seem to see anything wrong with lying.Which is quite incredible.

This is sad. But I think the right person won’t see it as limiting their life for you. This is how we are human. I have issues which limit me and others have issues that limit them and in an ideal world we would just love each other. Real love knows no boundaries, no limiting. But I think the difference is we have to see that someone is trying, that they are doing their side of the relationship and simply trying for the relationship. The depth of a relationship is in the effort that each person makes within the parameters that they can. Trying goes a long way.

It does.

But .... if he truly does not see that there's anything wrong in lying to get what he wants, he's a dangerous partner.

He also lied about the new job.He was applying for and kept it concealed from me.He convinced himself I'd have a problem with it

Now I do have a problem. I have a problem that he lied to me not so much about the job. He said hes right.I was alll along, you just don't want me to take the job. There's no arguing with it.

(fwiw I have a wonderful partner now who accepts me as I am, and I was absolutely honest and upfront about all my health issues. He's chosen to stay, and I know it's for real because I didn't conceal anything. I'm very fortunate).

"There's a great phrase has helped me in the past: it's ok to detach with love"

Perfect. Exactly what I'm doing.

I won't tolerate lies anymore.

"(fwiw I have a wonderful partner now who accepts me as I am, and I was absolutely honest and upfront about all my health issues. He's chosen to stay, and I know it's for real because I didn't conceal anything. I'm very fortunate)."

Perfect again.

So happy for your Ducks 😍

Yes lying is morally wrong and childish.

My 10 year old will lie a lot to avoid accountability and to avoid the feeling of rejection of getting caught. It’s a hard one to manage because it breaks the trust between us. I’m unsure whether she is even aware she is lying as she is often totally dumbstruck by the truth.

Hello may I join you? Have ASD in my family and the thought of holidaying with some of them soon is already making me anxious. They are adults but can’t make arrangements so I do it and then they won’t confirm anything I arrange (because that’s pressure?) so I wait politely and then things get missed out on for the group. They also get shirty if asked a direct question. They expect endless patience and flexibility which in reality isn’t possible. Not that I am happy to give that to an adult anyway.
My child has ASD so I do understand the difficulties to a degree. I’ve just lost patience, as a middle aged woman and time pressed it’s bloody infuriating.

I’m reading into autism and confabulation at the moment. She may not realise it’s isn’t true.

@Woodchipwalls welcome! I honestly would stop arranging anything for anyone else, or make arrangements beyond saying I am going to x at y time you are welcome to join me otherwise I will see you later. But anything that requires actual input just drop the rope, I assume most of them are functioning adults to some degree, yes requiring a response is a pressure but responding is also polite when someone has made an effort.
I’d stop making an effort and if they complain then explain that their continued refusal to engage has impacted your well being and you are no longer happy to continue in this manner. Honestly perhaps dodge future holidays if all it is for you is hard work. You don’t owe people your help if they don’t help themselves at least a little bit.

I get the impression that Neurodiverse relationships are just going to be much more complicated. It’s a lot like a see-saw but the balance is a lot more off and much more sensitive. One persons needs and need for safety can’t cause instability in the other persons life without consequences. Someone’s need for control or lack of emotional regulation can’t make the other persons life a misery. I think they are going to always be quite challenging and require massive teamwork and dedication on both sides to find a decent balance. I think that is what makes and breaks these relationships, masses of understanding on both sides. I think without this then there is zero chance they will survive. One person can’t make a relationship work and I think many of us are wasting time.

Thank you. I’m resolved that it’s my last time to do this. Nobody gets holiday time to waste and these people I’d prefer not to spend it with anyway, because they’re so self focused. Bur there’s some young DC in our families (mine too) who all really love it when we go on holiday.

I’m sad for them that these other family parents don’t otherwise get their shit together to take their kids away on holiday, but it’s driving me mad even before we’ve actually left, their parents being so useless. I don’t want a strained holiday atmosphere for their DC, my DC and definitely not for myself!