Update: Partner accepted overseas posting without consulting me. We finally talked.

[YourShyPlayer]

I posted here last week about my partner of 2 years accepting a year-long overseas posting without talking to me first. Got nearly 300 replies. Some were brutal but most were fair. Thank you.

A lot has changed since then.

We didn't speak for 4 days. She called Monday night close to midnight. We talked for 2 hours. It was the most honest conversation we have ever had.

I told her how I felt. The pattern of deciding alone. The fact she never once said "come with me" or "how do we do this together." She listened.

Then she told me things I was not ready for.

She said she doesn't believe my plans for our future will ever have real dates. She said when I told my family about her I acted like I had crossed a finish line and stopped moving. She said she has been waiting for me to take the next step and I haven't. She cried and said working abroad is her dream and she is scared the window will close once we have kids. She doesn't want to be 40 and full of regret.

She also admitted saying yes on the spot is a habit from her first job. Her old boss taught her to always say yes and figure it out later. She said she assumed I would say no so she just didn't ask me. She took away my chance to be on her side and she knows that was wrong.

I told her saying yes to her boss and talking to me first are not opposites. She agreed. She promised to include me next time.

She also said the posting probably won't happen because of the conflict situation. But she was clear that when something else comes up she will want to say yes. That is who she is.

Several of you said the secrecy from my family hurt her more than I realised. You were right. I pushed back on that last week. I was wrong.

Several of you said I was being controlling. I have sat with that honestly. I think some of you had a point.

But here is where I am stuck.

She wants a partner who supports her saying yes to opportunities. I want a partner who includes me in the decision. She says she will from now on. But she also told me that even if she did consult me her answer would probably still be yes. So consultation without it changing anything feels like a formality not a partnership.

We didn't break up. We didn't fix it. We are going on a trip we had planned before all this happened. Maybe we figure it out there. Maybe we figure out that we can't.

For those who followed the original thread, thank you. You helped me see things I couldn't see on my own. The ones who were hard on me were often the ones I needed to hear most.

What would you do if your partner said "I will talk to you first but my answer will probably always be yes"? Is that enough?

I would be OK with that if there were no kids involved because 20s is when you should both be maximising your career. You should be supporting each other to do that. If you can't do that because you want her to slot in with your own plans for your life, you should let her go and find someone with whose plans are more compatible with yours.

You aren't married. You aren't on the path of getting married. She's right to not put her life on hold for you.

If you both want different things it may be time to end this amicably. Some relationships just run their course and that's ok. You're both still young in the grand scheme of things.

In all honesty, It is all over bar the crying.

What does she see as the next step that you haven't taken?
Is she right?
And if so, why haven't you taken it?

But, bottom line, you want a partner who includes you in decision making. She has told you, basically, that she won't. I don't think that's enough for you (tbf, I don't think it would be for most people).

Time to move on OP.

I didn’t see your first thread but you seem to have fallen into the trap of seeing her pattern whilst being blind to your own.

You seem to have a pattern of Later, Not Now and No.
Just taking the family introductions: why did you treat her as if you were ashamed of her? Really really closely examine that dynamic. You are establishing a pattern where everything has to be dragged out of you, presumably so you can retain the right to say “I didn’t really want this” all the way down the line.

Only you can tell us if it is deliberate but you are trying to sabotage her life plans. Why on earth won’t you do the decent thing and realise you want different things, you’re a bad match for her and then let her go?

It sounds like you either want different things, or the same things but in a different time scale. That usually suggests it’s time to give each other a break and see how it feels without disappointing each other.

She said she has been waiting for me to take the next step and I haven't.

By this, does she mean that you haven’t ever said I Love You to her?

Her behaviour is a response to your behaviour.

If you dont change nothing much will change.
What she has been doing is
A. A reaction to you being controlling. (Fear)
B. A reaction to your treatment of her vis a vis your family/ the future. (Also fear based)

I note you acknowledge how youve wronged her then totally skirt over how you will change this going forward.
wheres the "next step"?
What are you doing differently???

But she also told me that even if she did consult me her answer would probably still be yes.
Most people take onboard feedback but ultimately decide their own life path (totally reasonable from her) Working abroad is a lifelong dream so her answer will probably still be yes. Nothing weird from her end here.

I want a partner who includes me in the decision.
What you are describing is not a partnership its "if I cant change her mind / she doesnt do what I want we arent a team."
You want power of veto (ie ultimate control). If you didnt her telling you in advance, discussing it and her deciding would be fine.

A partnership is hearing your partner has a life long goal / dream and supporting them in attainment of that even if sometimes you have to suck it up a bit.
You are both young and mortgage / childfree... Honestly why wouldnt you go abroad for a year or 2? Its not an disastrous or unreasonable ask

What would you do if your partner said "I will talk to you first but my answer will probably always be yes"? Is that enough?

Well she’s not going to turn down opportunities because you say no. But she’ll speak to you first to ensure she’s considered all options and your feelings before finalising any decisions. If you’re unhappy with this, I suspect it comes from a controlling position. But more importantly, what are you doing to address what she’s said about certainty? Because if you’re making empty promises about a future, and she’s getting offers of certainty from other places (work), of course she’s going to prioritise it. It sounds like she’s made it very clear what next steps look like if this is to go the distance, what are you doing about that?

You want to be with her, but won’t provide the commitment and certainty she desires. But you do want the ultimate say on what she does.

Btw I’m not having a go, it sounds like you’ve had a good moment to reflect, but what are you going to change now you know where she stands?

My partner was like you and spoiler alert he went for 1 year, hated it, and now we have kids together and I can’t leave. I’ve lost my dream of travelling with work. I’m cheering for your partner who isn’t letting anyone get in the way of her dream. With respect, I hope she leaves you, as if you’re not going to go, you’re simply not the right partner for her at this time. Why aren’t you letting her go if you’re not compatible on this issue? Yes I massively resent my partner for lying and saying he’d travel with me and reneging on it just after we’d had a kid, and I’m mad with myself.

I wouldn’t like a partner who wasn’t going to consult me in decisions, as that doesn’t feel like a joint partnership through life, it feels too much like individual paths for me. But I’m thinking of husband and kids status. If I was just thinking of someone that I was seeing for a couple of years in my 20s then that’s more reasonable as currently you are on individual paths. Yea you’re a couple but you’re not committed to each other. So I think she’s doing the right thing. She could hang about for you, miss dream opportunities just for you to change your mind about the relationship! Then she would kick herself.

I think she needs to go and experience her dreams and then maybe you two will get back together afterwards. However overall you don’t sound right for each other, and the relationship sounds a bit doomed…

She sounds like someone who is highly driven, ambitious, outgoing, impulsive, confident, and you sound more steady, maybe more of a homebody, less thirsty for opportunities/change/fast pace.
I love what pp said about your pattern being “not now, later or no”, that sounds spot on.
And ‘yes’ people can’t stand that. So you would always clash.
I think let her go, and find someone with similar hopes,dreams and approach to life as you

I did notread your last thread, but from this one it doesnt sound like you are compatible.

She said she doesn't believe my plans for our future will ever have real dates. She said when I told my family about her I acted like I had crossed a finish line and stopped moving. She said she has been waiting for me to take the next step and I haven't
Why has there been no further movement in your relationship? Are you wasting her time? And if you did have children together, what are your plans for childcare?

Do you want her to turn down opportunities? Of course she should say yes. I’d be so deeply saddened if my daughter turned down opportunities because of a guy.

“LouiseMadetheBestBroccoliPasta · Today 04:19
I would be OK with that if there were no kids involved because 20s is when you should both be maximising your career. You should be supporting each other to do that. If you can't do that because you want her to slot in with your own plans for your life, you should let her go and find someone with whose plans are more compatible with yours.”

Thanks for updating, OP. This with bells on. I posted on your previous thread (several times, i got very invested!) about the importance of being able to take job opportunities at this age and life stage, for both of you. She particularly feels this as a young woman who will likely be most restricted if and when children come along. She clearly has a job that potentially involves foreign postings or for which foreign postings can really help with her career. That advice - say yes now and work out details later - sounds very sensible. You shouldn’t want to prevent her from doing this but you clearly want veto rights over her career decisions.

Many of us were making the same point. I never once saw you expressly acknowledge that point (maybe i missed it) and you still haven’t expressly acknowledged it now. She could have 60-70 years (perhaps more) still ahead of her. She is absolutely right to want to prioritise her career at this stage - as would you be. These opportunities won’t keep
coming round. Like a PP said, i would be so disappointed if either of my young adult children turned down exciting career opportunities for a partner (my elder DD is currently overseas; her BF has remained in the UK; they’re making it work for now).

You are both far too young to be letting a partner clip your career wings.

Before kids, we agreed from very early on that we would support each other's dreams whatever that looked like. We were lucky to be able to work that out but it is possible to have a presumed yes and a discussion. That meant more time apart/ long distance than some would be comfortable with. But I felt happy to be enabling his dreams and ambitions and he likewise.

“What would you do if your partner said "I will talk to you first but my answer will probably always be yes"? Is that enough?”

Yes, that’s enough for me. That was exactly the arrangement I had with DH for about ten years as he accepted multiple different jobs and moves to new cities. He always consulted me because he valued my opinions and knowledge. Sometimes I raised points that led him to decide that job was not a good idea. Sometimes I raised issues and he still decided to go. Sometimes I moved with him, sometimes we were long distance.

Ultimately it was his industry, his career, I knew that he was very ambitious and trusted him to make choices that would work for us in the long term. The default was always that he would seize opportunities as that’s who he is and that matched his life goals.

It worked out for us, he’s now successful in his field, we have a very comfortable lifestyle and we had lots of adventures along the way.

So I hope that experience helps you analyse and understand what she’s said.

Honestly though I think there are bigger issues and it sounds like you would benefit from exploring your patterns with a therapist for some more insight.

Agree with other posters that she should prioritise living abroad while she’s childfree/ at this stage in her life and career, I would do the same.

“You are establishing a pattern where everything has to be dragged out of you, presumably so you can retain the right to say “I didn’t really want this” all the way down the line.”

I found this really interesting because this is a patten in my relationship with my husband, which I have found very frustrating over the years. We were in a committed relationship very quickly (so no delay in saying I love you/ introducing to family) but I pushed for us to get married/ I pushed for us to have children/ I drove us moving house and it was like he always retained this veto right that I had to negotiate/ steamroller over rather than actually being the active party himself. It’s driven us both mad at times because I feel like I have to drive everything and he feels like he’s having to go along with what I want. It only works because (funnily/ very annoyingly) he’s always happy with the outcome afterwards and hasn’t so far said he didn’t want these things in the end but this push/ pull is the worst thing about our relationship and it sounds like you have the same issue OP.

You need to be actively driving this relationship forward OP if you want it because it sounds like your partner isn’t like me and will cut and run if you continue to be passive/ she has to drag every forward movement out of you.

She is not the one, best to move on.

I guess broader question: what do YOU want from the relationship? How do you see the next few years and what are you going to do to make that happen?

I yes it’s ok, because you could raise insight that she may value that influences her decision

She has placed her career ahead of love for you. That may or may not come back to bite her, but either way she is not right for you and it's best to let her go. I think even if you had taken 'the next step' then she would still want to go, regardless. As for her not including you in major decisions, or indeed just informing you but doing what she wants regardless, that's not really acceptable and not a mature way to deal with these things in a relationship. She will have problems again in the future if she keeps that attitude.

As for you, you've learned a lot from this whole experience, use it to improve how you deal with your next relationship, and hopefully you'll find someone who suits you better.

I think and this stage it’s fine to go and come with work. You should be sipppering that. You can go with her or stay where you are the relationship can continue. Secondments are not insurmountable. I don’t get why you are acting like they are?

or course you can have chat but if she’s stated the she wants to take all work away opportunities that is the discussion. You’ve already had it. You know the deal and you should decide if you can stay in a relationship like that.

I remember you.

It sounds like she is a go-getter and you are not. You are not compatible and the cracks are getting bigger. It's time to let her fly and find find someone who is as adventurous as she is because, quite frankly, she's not ready to settle down.

There’s a difference to me between ‘I’ve said yes, what do you think, it’ll be this timeframe’ etc and ‘I’ve said yes’- end of conversation. I would be fine with the first but some people wouldn’t even agree with that and I think if you want an option (as) a ‘I’ve been asked, what do you think?’ she isn’t that person