Anyone been cheated on and just actually, fully healed?

[AnneHongKong]

Hi, a bit of background:
I have 2 kids 4 and 2 yo. Been married for 10 years, living abroad away from family (not that close to my family back home anyway).

When my first child was 2 months old I found out my husband cheated. Won't go into details but I found messages on his phone. He still hasn't fully admitted to it.
This was almost 5 years ago and we've had another baby since.

He moved out the house for a month, but eventually, with a new baby (and no family support) I let him move back in. To be honest it was 90% because of our baby and I knew I couldnt do it alone.
Long story short, there was a lot of apologies on his part,a lot of promises and I was just so exhausted and emotional I just gave in and let him come back.

He went to one counselling session and he pushed for couples counseling, which we actually never found time for. Now we have 2 small kids and both working full time, its never going to happen.

All in all he's an excellent father. I can't deny that.
He pretty much pays for everything (mortgage, bills, etc) and my salary is for kids fun activities. Although I would be able to get by as a single parent, I have no issue downsizing and can totally manage, this is not about me wanting to keep some glamorous lifestyle (I wish haha). We have a good life together overall and we do get along well...we just NEVER talk about what happened...except for when we argue. I can't help but bring up the fact that he did the worst thing he could have done to me at the most vulnerable time of my life. I just still cant
get over it. I will have a few months where I don't think about it a lot, but when he p*sses me off, it just all comes back.
I know the ideal solution is something like loads of individual counselling then couples counseling, but in reality, we are both working, have small kids, with no family around. Even if we did find time I'm just so exhausted for all that. Not the best solution..but it is what it is.

So my question really is, will I ever be able to move on? Is been almost 5 years already. Has anyone been through this and eventually been pretty okay? I just don't ever see it happening and it crushes me.
Everyone I read about or talk to ends up separating eventually.is it inevitable?

No but cheating is a unique harm that you can only inflict upon your romantic partner. It is an intentional act of intimate harm.
I actually don’t intentionally harm or betray anyone I love, familial love, or romantic love, or platonic love. Do you?
Cheating is an entirely avoidable form of harm, it’s not something you do accidentally. So no, I maintain that you cannot genuinely love someone and cheat on them. I also don’t think you can ‘love’ someone and just not respect them. You can respect someone and not love them but you can’t love someone and not respect them, and cheating is the ultimate sign of disrespect.

@cloudtreecarpet I have to agree with you and it is not the betrayal of the act of sex even - it is the mental anguish that many men pile on their partners in this process in validating all to themself to assuage their bad behaviour. It is the mental abuse they inflict often before the discovery either intentionally or not. That is what stays with you in your subconscious and it is why I have no contact with my ex husband now. He abused me mentally for years and that is beyond forgiveness.

I’m not sure I do understand the concept of ‘genuine’ romantic love that protects from everything. I have unconditional love for my child and would always put their needs above my own but I’ve never felt like that about anyone else. Is that what people mean by ‘genuine’ romantic love? I’m interested in how it is defined. I don’t think I’m capable of it.

Following this thread. Have been going through this since August. H had a brief emotional affair and sexting with work colleague. We decided to try to reconcile but its just not the same anymore its heartbreaking . Im really, really trying, i really have and am, but there is irreparable damage and things havent been great 💔 i also get intrusive thoughts all the time, what if/when/what they talked about etc, some days are better than others. Its the worst emotional pain ive ever been through 😞

7 years on from finding out about an affair and I can say that I am happy, healed and over it.

The first year was horrendous. I was very very low. I didn’t feel like myself for 2 years at least. And then slowly but surely I started thinking about it less, feeling it less, until after 4 or 5 years I felt nothing about it. I never think of it now and I genuinely don’t have any negative feeling about it. But he has proved himself to be a good husband, father and friend.

And I have also questioned how realistic it is that people in very long term relationships are completely monogamous for the duration of that relationship… I think affairs are commonplace and we hate dealing with that reality. People cheat for all kinds of reasons. Sometimes it’s abusive and sometimes it isn’t.

@MeganM3
It sounds as though you are happy, healed and over it because you no longer see marriage as a monogamous institution. I don't think that is a viewpoint a lot of people are willing to take on board I don't think many people are ready to accept affairs as a normal part of their marriage. I certainly couldn't .

Your formulation assumes that a person who has once made a mistake will continue to make such mistakes in future. This is different to “I am glad it happened, and I would rather take what we have now rather than living in a timeline in which it had not happened.”

I am telling you that the latter is true for me.

Are you saying that people who think kintsugi is even more beautiful than the original are simply lying to themselves?

If not, why do you believe this can be true in one domain but not in the other?

If so, the analogy is apt, since you also think you know better about the inner state of such people than they do about themselves.

When you first make your wedding vows, you are a sweet summer child. Expecting someone to be tied their whole life to what they felt in their twenties is madness.

If you think the vows are finite and not life long then why make them in the first place?

And if someone takes the vows and then decides they didn't really mean them then they should do the honest thing and end the marriage . Not go down the route of cheating and lying and deceit.

I did. He had an affair about 7 years ago- I also had just had a baby, so reasonably similar circumstances, also kicked him out for a while.

It helped enormously that he didn’t try to hide anything. He knows I’m like a dog with a bone and I’d get to the bottom of it anyway, so I got full disclosure and saw all the messages etc. It was very unpleasant, but as I said to him, I can’t forgive you if I don’t know what I’m forgiving.

I also think it helped that I didn’t make any kind of decision right away. After he moved back in because I was finding it exhausting with the baby, it was on a housemate basis for about a year. I made it clear that any pressure to decide about being a couple or any crying or moping and that would make the decision for me. He’d unilaterally decided to cause chaos in our relationship, no way was I going to be the outlet for his distress. So, I had time to really, properly process it all without muddying the waters with still sleeping with him/being ‘coupley.’ This was difficult, as my initial instinct was to want intimacy and closeness for reassurance, but actually I think that was probably the last thing I needed if I wanted to approach the situation with a clear head. I was aware that he was hoping that I would choose to stay in the marriage but to his credit, he never pushed me at all and spent the time doing his best to be a supportive co-parent and making sure I had the time and space to heal.

I spent that time focusing on building a support network, nurturing old and new friendships, improving my health (as well as of course enjoying my new baby) because I wanted to make sure I had everything I needed to cope on my own if I decided the marriage wasn’t for me. That was a big source of strength, because I knew that even if the worst happened and he fucked up again, I had everything I needed to thrive.

I also took the opportunity to reset boundaries around housework, support for my career, and other things that I felt were unbalanced even before I found out about the affair. Once we decided to get back together, we did a long-distance move as I was unhappy where we were anyway and wanted a fresh start far away from affair partner and people connected to her. It was just too awkward worrying about bumping into people. My take on it was ‘you’ve spent the last however long doing what you wanted to my complete detriment, I think it’s time we prioritise my happiness and comfort for a bit.’

This probably sounds cold but I saw it as an opportunity to change my life for the better- sort of, this cataclysmic thing has happened, but this might be a chance to rebalance things and build something new instead of plodding along tolerating things I wasn’t really happy with.

I honestly think it’s partly down to personality too. I’m just a massive pragmatist and kind of looked at is as, this is shit, but these things do happen, and it’s no reflection on me. I just wanted the best outcome for me and my child and wasn’t going to make any decisions in a hurry.

My decision and feelings about it would probably be different depending on how he handled it. I’ll never excuse what he did, but it helped that he never tried to rewrite history (for example, he didn’t try to claim that he’d been unhappy in the marriage etc) and he immediately cut off all contact with the OW and everyone connected to her. He then made permanent changes to ensure I felt supported and never put any pressure on me to have him back. Those changes have endured ever since, and if he hadn’t done all those things then we wouldn’t be together. You can never say never but I don’t worry about it happening again, it seems to be genuine change as it’s lasted for years. He was a pretty shit husband pre-affair tbh so it’s been a pretty drastic turnaround. His commitment to changing without any guarantee of getting back together did help me regain some respect for him.

I genuinely don’t feel upset about it at all any more. We talk about it openly without anyone getting upset or defensive if it comes up, which it does sometimes when we’re reminiscing about the early days of parenthood.

I’m really sorry you’re going through this OP. If I could give you any advice, it’s that he must be honest and really understand the impact it’s had on you, and you need to fully process it and take the time to decide what you really want. He’s changed the landscape of your relationship with his actions. It won’t ever go back to how it was before- it can be forged into something new, but only with huge amounts of work. In my opinion, with him expending the most effort, as none of this is your fault.

If you think the vows are finite and not life long then why make them in the first place?

Because you’re a sweet summer child.

And if someone takes the vows and then decides they didn't really mean them then they should do the honest thing and end the marriage . Not go down the route of cheating and lying and deceit.

Sure, everyone should be a perfect rational actor. Meanwhile, back in the real world, this doesn’t always happen and people find themselves in imperfect situations.

I’m glad it happened and would rather be in the position I’m in now than the position I was in before he had the affair. Our situation is probably reasonably unusual and the affair was a horrible time in my life, but if the choice was between marriage as it was before he cheated, or marriage now after the affair, then there’s no way I’d go back in time and change it. The affair caused a crisis that was a catalyst for massive, much-needed changes that forced him to reassess what it meant to be a husband and a father.

Without it, I think we would have plodded along with me getting more and more miserable until I left him. And as I can’t live both realities to know whether that would have ultimately worked out better, I’m comfortable that the affair was, in a weird way, a terrible thing that he did that turned out to have surprising and positive consequences.

Of course, I’m not suggesting cheating is in general a good thing. If I’d had a crystal ball and been able to know that he would cheat on me before we got married, I would have chosen differently. But I didn’t, and so here I am.

I am genuinely surprised anyone could rationalise something horrible and be able to say at the end of the day it's good that it happened. Truth be told, I did not expect that. But it's like saying, hey, I am glad I had to go through the excruciating pain of a shark ripping off both my legs and an arm, because now I don't have to go to work and can get benefits for life. So, something horrific like that needed to happen to shake things and turn it better? To make the spouse be a more attentive, dedicated partner - What a trade, that is. An attentive, respectful partner could work with you to make things better without a forced change stemming from guilt and fear of having messed up the relationship for good.

No matter how we look at it, those who have been cheated on all have to go through immense pain and suffering, and if I look at the examples of those who stayed together, vast majority has lost something that will never be the same. Not my words.

To expect someone to be "tied down" to their vows made in their twenties is madness? We are not talking about deciding to try a different pizza topping. The point is that we all evolve, but a good relationship means you evolve together, and you don't make such damaging decisions like opening up your relationship without the other one knowing on your own. That's where respect and maturity comes into picture, that you don't just prioritise a tingle in your pants over everything else you have built.

Look, we get it, you’re the perfect rational actor. Welcome to Earth.

Personally I think some of you are kidding yourselves that it's "all fine now" and "hey, who doesn't cheat?' but that's your choice and if it works for you then that's great.

In the end we all have to make our own decisions and live with them. No judgement.

And again - a personal jab without reflection on any of the points. If this is Earh, I'd rather go back to my planet to be with other sensible grownups.
Argument won, congratulations.

@ShinyNewName1988 That sounds like the textbook response to, "How should I deal with my partner having an affair?" I can only think you must always have had that strength within you.

Yes one of them. I'm part of many online groups helping men and women navigate this very difficult path. It's a "club" no one wants to join but I know are incredibly grateful to have others who understand and sit with them in the pain.

There are many success stories which I know is difficult for some to get their head around. There is a podcast called helping couples heal (also another online community and in real life too but set in America)with many interviews of success stories.

I think it may be something that unless you've gone through it it's difficult to understand. No one I talk to that feels they have fully healed and come out the other side is "putting up with anything" or "trying to forget it happened" they are genuinely pleased not that the betrayal happened but it was the catalyst for change. They now enjoy relationships they feel they never would of found before. They have been through hell and come out bulletproof. I see a great empowerment on both sides actually. Every element of the relationship gets thrown up for disecting and debate. They design their relationship completely a new with some rock solid foundations. I see a true equality. Again im aware it's really difficult to comprehend that all that could possibly be born out of betrayal. But I guess it isn't on its own. Its the heard work consistency and commitment.

Many describe themselves as asleep before coasting through life and now they are awake and in the driving seat of their life cultivating and collaborating together.

I've thought a lot about you, @Hogglehedge. I'm in a similar position since discovery last year and doubt I will ever trust him again. I don't see how this is survivable long term, even though he is currently doing everything "right" to repair our relationship. I am hoping to get to the point where I either feel I can stay without living with constant anxiety, or leave without second-guessing my choice. I'm not there yet.

@exhaustDAD I can’t honestly say it improved our relationship as we had a good relationship in my opinion ( and he says his)before his mid life crisis. It was more about the ego boost. However the one and only good thing out of it was he came right off his pedestal and I started to put myself first for the first time I think in a very very long time. If o now don’t agree with him, I say so, if I want to do something or go somewhere that doesn’t involve him, I tell him , not ask him and I stopped going along with sex I didn’t want.

Denial is an extremely powerful force. I have no doubt people manage to convince themselves that things are ‘better’. They have found new ways of keeping the structure standing, the cheater has hidden things better and made the right noises. And for a time it might feel genuine because the ‘big’ secret has finally been revealed and it may feel like you’re on the same team. But there are always things you don’t know and this will always be someone who intentionally harmed you. There is no real coming back from that at a fundamental level. It has to be plastered over.

That genuine love for someone where they don’t do something intentionally knowing it could destroy them, is still missing. So I don’t believe it’s real at its core. People have all sorts of reasons for staying and I have no doubt to many people that looks and feels like ‘love’, but there is no form of love that exists in my world that would mean you could do that to someone.

some people orient their lives around truth and some people manage it and maintain a narrative. That’s the difference.

I find your cynicism so depressing.

I don't have a very high opinion of people and tend to lead quite a solitary life because of this. But the people I chose to interact with on a personal basis are those who I assume to have similar values to myself. So I would expect my partner to be honest with me and tell me if he no longer wanted to be in a monogamous relationship with me.
I can't envisage an "imperfect situation" which would excuse him having so little respect for me that he lied and cheated on me.

Yes, we are 4 years down the line and I’m happier than we were before.

BUT

my situation was very different. My partner, admitted it straight away (drunken one night stand, long standing issues with binge drinking) and we faced it head on at the time. Multiple lots of individual therapy, boundaries put in place that would help me to rebuild trust and him to face the issues which got us in the situation in the first place.

If you want to your marriage to continue, you cannot sit on these feelings without dealing with them.

it is possible to be happy after infidelity- but only if there is complete transparency, and both of you are willing to put in the work to get there.

wishing you all the best xx

Oh, come now. Whenever I reply to any points you make (which are often straw men, and sometimes actual false quotations) you just come back with some variant of "yes but you can't actually believe that".

I think we're at the point now, you and I, where we can just gently rib each other since neither of us is ever going to convince the other.

Truth be told, that is actually pretty funny, @moderate
Cheers to you!