A mess. Advice needed: next steps

[Changes26]

I split up with my partner before Christmas after an incident where he came home drunk and was verbally abusive to me, woke our daughter up and she witnessed some of it too. I posted about it (https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/relationships/5461730-handhold-needed-unhealthy-relationship-ended-a-week-before-christmas?utm_campaign=thread&utm_medium=share)

After the incident he went down to London to stay at his mum’s. He booked a therapy session. He returned 4 days later having been diagnosed with ADHD and had started taking medication.

At first he was very apologetic and said he took responsibility and that the medication had changed him. He said he would work hard to change and didn’t want the relationship to end. I kept saying that wouldn’t be possible but he was on best behaviour. He continued to sleep downstairs and we had a ‘normal’ Christmas.

He has said he admits he has been verbally abusive and toxic in our relationship and these were because of his anger meltdowns because of his ADHD. He says he never meant to control me or hurt me, he had no control over it. I told him at the weekend there’s no chance we would get back together and we need to concentrate on making sure our daughter is ok and being the best co-parents we can be. He’s now started to slip back again and has now said he can’t accept my decision is the right one until I accept he didn’t do it on purpose and he wasn’t being controlling.

He has also sprung on me that he plans to move down to London with his mum until possibly May when the new renters agreement comes into place and that he’ll come up here (midlands city) Sunday - Wednesday to have our daughter at my house. He says the places to rent here are too expensive. He takes home £2100 a week and has about 40/50k in savings. He has said I can’t expect him to use his savings and it’s unfair. I own my house outright in my name but earn half what he does. I regrettably got so angry when he told me his plan (which wasn’t the agreed day/time we’d set aside to talk through the separation plan) and accused him of abandoning our daughter and it would upset her even more if not only does he move out but to another city. I said he just needs to budget and get by as that’s what I’ll be doing. He suggested that we do 50/50 so he doesn’t have to pay anything to me.

He keeps trying to tell me what his therapist says or why he’s been upstairs crying and I’ve told him no I don’t need to know anymore. I feel like he’s trying to get me to change my mind. Looking back on it, I can see he’s been highly manipulative at times but he won’t accept it. He says he’s worried I’m going to make co-parenting difficult.

He fainted last night and took himself to a&e, they’ve said they don’t think it was the ADHD medication but stress. He said that when he came to I had a look of contempt at him and I hate him and don’t care. To be honest, I thought he had just fallen and was being a bit over dramatic. It was in the bathroom whilst our daughter was in the bath so I was also trying to keep calm so she wouldn’t freak out. I was the one who suggested he call 111! Now he’s saying that this behaviour is abusive on my part.

My head is spinning and I’m stuck in this tiny house with him. I’ve told friends now and they’re being supportive but I don’t know if I’m just not seeing things properly.

Any advice - do I need to seek legal advice? Should we get a mediator for the parenting plan? Do I just agree to him going down to London for a while?

He really does make it up as he goes along doesn't he?? Psychiatric nurses don't diagnose either. Even if they provide therapy. I'm trained in both and spent 15 years as a psychiatric nurse in acute and CAMHS.

I'll co-sign @swinglow776 's certificate if needed!

Seriously though OP, good on you. Better times ahead! You'll be free soon!

⬆️ all of this. As a fellow mental health nurse and therapist

Also happy to assist with the certificate

Well he's been reading up on the subject hasn't he? It's good to see someone educate themselves but he's still a bloody liar, it's all excuses, excuses, excuses

OP, your instincts are right. An ADHD diagnosis, stress or therapy does not excuse abuse. Crying, fainting and telling you what his therapist says are not accountability, they are pressure.

What he is doing now is classic. Shifting blame to ADHD, rewriting history, springing plans on you, accusing you of abuse and threatening weekend only contact. That is control behaviour, not recovery.

It is your house. You are not responsible for housing a grown man who earns well and has savings. Setting a move out date is not punishment, it is protecting your daughter’s home.

You do not need to accept his narrative or discuss his feelings anymore. Keep it to: We are separated. You need to move out by X date. Communication is about DD only.

Please get quiet legal advice, keep a log and stop all emotional discussion. Boundaries are not abuse, they are safety.

He’s left. It’s still a real mess.

It’s been a rollercoaster the last few weeks with him saying he’ll go to London and see our daughter every other weekend in London. He then changed his tune and said he would stay and get a flat. Went to see two and applied.

I have been trying to get him to sit down and have a conversation about the parenting arrangement and how/when we tell our daughter. He wanted to discuss everything that had happened and explain everything as he still didn’t think I understood why he did what he did.

It’s been exhausting with him even asking if there’s any chance we’ll reconcile. I’ve said no and shut down any of those conversations.

Anyway, he went away for work this week and returned yesterday. I suggested we have the plan conversation yesterday evening as he should be moving out soon and he said “I can’t discuss this now.”

So today I suggested our daughter go to my parents whilst we had a chat and he said to me “we can but we’re not talking about that, I have something else to talk about” and then proceeded to tell me he’s refusing to talk to me about any parenting plan as he’s had advice from his therapist and someone else that we don’t talk about anything until he’s sought advice because I’ve made serious allegations against him and he needs to protect himself going forward.

Little did he know, I’d been talking to my brother and my brother begged me to get him to leave and said he would come and ask him to leave and take the keys. So I let my brother know the latest and he said that’s it he needs to leave. My ExP was messaging me whilst I hid in the bathroom saying he doesn’t want to take our daughter away. He thinks I can make a plan and he can review it. He has got advice from his therapist and someone else to not talk to me because I’ve made serious allegations against him.

So I took our daughter to my parents and my brother told him that he would have to leave as I’d had enough. He’s got a flat sorted so he can either go to London or get a hotel here. He agreed but my brother said he was trying to talk his way out of it.

I said he could come and say by to our daughter and we all said it was a work trip like last week to do with a potential new job.

So he comes to say bye and I hide upstairs. ExP got arsey with my brother and kept asking what I’d said and that he was the one who had been trying to have a conversation about parental agreement and that I’m a liar.

I really didn’t want it to come to this but I can’t live in the same house as him when he’s saying he can’t talk to me about anything. I feel like he’s continually manipulating things and everything is about him. So it’s going to be a fight now. All I want is the best for our daughter but my brother pointed out that nothing he has done has been in the interest of her so far.

I’m sure many of you could have predicted all of that. I could have but I was hoping it wouldn’t. But I guess I’ve second guessed myself for too long. Not anymore. I’m getting legal advice tomorrow. I tried calling women’s aid last week but couldn’t get through.

Keep going Op, you're making some progress now. If he still won't talk about contact then leave him to it for a while, he wants you to run after him, when you don't he may see reason if he wants to see his DC

OP well done.

Well done for telling your brother. For being prepared.

This has got very nasty and things could have easily escalated further.

So much love from a random woman in the UK on the bus cheering you on.

You have got this.

Also, we couldn't have predicted this. We're not psychic. He could have taken some responsibility and respected your wishes, but he didn't. He has doubled down instead.

Lots of cups of tea and deep breaths today x

Wounded animals are always at their most dangerous when cornered.

This is him lashing out verbally in every direction because you know what - he's got nothing.

He's got NOTHING else.

Observe his writhing and hissing, but pay no attention to WHAT he says. It's all bile and bollocks. It's just noise. You don't have to engage with it, react to it or take it seriously.

Your brother is right - nothing he is doing is for your daughter's benefit.

Courage, ma brave - another random woman cheering you on.

@Daleksatemyshed @swinglow776 @ClawedButler Thank you for your kind words.

He’s now been sending my brother lots of ‘evidence’ to try and prove I’m lying and he’s not to blame. I don’t understand what he’s trying to achieve.

He’s not even asked how our daughter is. She’s asked a few times when he’s back but then when I suggested she FaceTime him she said no.

I got some legal advice today and I’ll be suggesting a mediator to make arrangements for DD.

I think what he trying to achieve is simple @Changes26 , he doesn't want to be to blame for your relationship breaking down. If he's to blame that's like admitting he was abusive

As it’s a permanent split, the sharing of your house isn’t going to work. Just tell him it was a spare of the moment idea but not practical long term.

Suggest he moves to his mum’s and use the time to work-out how he can accommodate seeing his child regularly and from a fixed placed if he’d like to have her overnight. In the meantime, local B&Bs or travel lodge will have to do for him, and he can just take her for days out.

Once he moves out, change the locks. It’s your house and you never have to have him inside your home again.

Ya bollocks did he go away for a few days and come back diagnosed and fully medicated.

He’s playing you like a fiddle. A psychiatric nurse (these days they’re called Mental Health nurses) CANNOT diagnose ADHD.

I’m relieved to hear that he has cleared off. Your new life starts today. Your dd is better off without this lying, manipulative sack of shit under the same roof as you both. x

Changes26

re "I said after we first split we could use the house as a nesting place but I was thinking it would be a month. He has now said I’m going back on what I said."

Personally, I think 'nesting' is a very specific idea which is only for couples who separate on good terms and totally trust each other. I also always worry that it stops either parent fully moving on and making their own home/life aside from the child/ren. That's not based on any personal experience just my thoughts.

Also you can change your mind at any time on what works for you in your own home.

"I can stay at my parents but they don’t even know we’ve split yet and my dad is ill with terminal cancer so I know I could stay and help care for him and my mum (which I’m having to do more of now anyway) but then I lose my house 3 nights a week."

I am so sorry about your dad. That must be so hard.

You are dealing with the break up of your relationship and your dad's terminal illness. You need a safe place to relax and unwind and a place where your daughter feels safe.

Your ex doesn't sound like he is coping at all accepting the break up. He is manipulating and controlling.

Well done on getting him to leave.

Stay strong.

Sorry you are going through this, OP. These interactions sound similar to my exH. It sounds like he just wants to rewrite history. I organised mediation with the view to sorting finances and co-parenting. It was thee most useful thing for our kids and for the divorce. It was the only time he actually listened and was sort of forced into cooperating towards making plans for action. It took someone neutral to drum it into him!
I am rooting you for with your mediation. You'll be on the other side soon, where there is peace, calm and safety. And no-one whining on trying to convince you your version of events aren't true!

Sorry you had to go through similar. I hope life is peaceful for you now. That’s promising about mediation. I’m worried he will use it as a way to ‘prove’ his version but hopefully he’ll see mediation is just a way to make arrangements that help our daughter.

I’ve sent him an email saying he’s welcome to speak to and see DD if he wants. I’ve said going forward we need to make arrangements for her care through a mediator and sent a list of mediators. I have yet to hear back.

From what he’s been telling and sending my brother; He’d made a self-referral to a local DV project for abusers but someone told him he shouldn’t do it because of legal implications; I think this someone is the therapist. Apparently his therapist has said that he did that night when he was drunk was a mental health episode because of his ADHD, depression and anxiety. So I guess that lets thousands (millions?) of people (mostly men) off the hook for their behaviour then?!

I think he’s beyond help at this moment in time but that’s not my problem.

I would not do mediation with him because it will be a complete waste of time. You cannot mediate with an abuser . Even if he did bother going he will merely use those to manipulate the mediator and in addition use these to further bash you about the head with.

And he’s still sending your brother a lot of crap. Do not further engage.

And I would formalise any contact arrangements with the courts rather than informally. If he is that bothered about his child (which he is not) he should not have treated you like you have been in the first place.

I think @Daleksatemyshed has got it spot on. What he wants to achieve is control of the narrative.

He will tell everyone and anyone how unreasonable you are, how badly you treated him (him, a poor victim of serious mental health conditions too!), how you are keeping him from his daughter yadda yadda yadda.

Let him. Don't engage. Grey rock him, and calmly explain to your nearest and dearest that he's going to be saying a lot of things in the near future that they should regard with deep suspicion.

Trying to control the narrative yourself will drive you insane. Let HIM drive himself mad trying to 'prove' how terrible you are. No-one who really knows you will believe a word that comes out of his self-serving stupid nasty mouth.

And in addition to what @ClawedButler says, do you really believe he was going to refer himself to a DV course Op? I think the man is a very inventive liar and each lie serves to make him look better.

He sent a screenshot of the email to my brother but anyone can enquire can’t they? It’s actually so crazy it’s funny.

What strikes me most about your Exs replies @Changes26 is the choice of words, he's using a lot of wording that's more usual to people who use sites like MN, his use of "safe space" isn't something I'd expect from a lot of men. I'm not suggesting he's stalking you on here but I wonder if he's picking this up from his therapist?