DH career change

[SEhitherhere22]

DH and I are both mid 30s, with 1 DC (1) and planning to try for another one soon.

We are in very similar professional jobs, both work FT (very long hours) and objectively earn decently well (we are both paid about the same). However, as we live in the SE / London for our jobs, our childcare and other costs are large. We used to save a good amount but that has significantly decreased since having a child, so we save a bit but not that much now.

DH has recently been saying he doesn’t want to do his job anymore; he feels stuck in it, doesn’t want to keep doing it, and wants to pursue a different career altogether. It’s one that he thought about doing way back when he left uni (long before I met him) but didn’t have the confidence to try and so just went this professional route instead. He’s occasionally mentioned this alternative career in the time I’ve known him, but always as in a very vague “that would’ve be interesting” way / never any suggestion he would change now. Suddenly in the past few months, he’s decided it’s now or never and he is going to change career.

He is clear he wants to do it. It is clear to me that if I were “unsupportive” (but also if he were unsuccessful at it tbh) it would have a very detrimental impact on our relationship. He very much has his identity tied to his work.

The career change (I’m being vague so not outing) would be one that sounds quite “prestigious” / “cool” to outsiders, but objectively, would mean a huge pay cut. It would be a 60-70% pay cut for him in the first year, maybe 50% in the second, unclear after that. The new career is self employed, so additional loss of benefits, employer pension, bonuses, etc. This also makes it difficult to project earnings.

He is insisting that he’ll make up the shortfall in the early years with his savings. He is also insisting in the long run, he should earn better because he is passionate about this career path and because, being self employed, ultimately he can earn “better”.

It is also clear that, if he were to take the new career path with the pay cut, he would not be able to pick up any childcare, house stuff, etc, as he would need to work extremely hard to establish himself and try to make the better earnings he’s projecting.

I calculated how much our current outgoings are against our new projected household income. We would be losing money every month, for at least the next two years, if he switched. The obvious thing to cut back would be childcare - but we can’t do this as his new career wouldn’t enable that basically, plus we’re at the stage of wanting a second kid (and realistically have a limited window). We also had been talking about moving to a bigger house (we are in a very small place that would not fit more than 3).

I have thought about whether I can get an even higher paid job, but realistically the only options I can see would require working absolutely ridiculous hours and having a partner who does a much bigger home load. (Trying to be vague again but this is very much the case.) My job is already hugely stressful and now I feel I will have no flexibility at all because I’ll be the guaranteed breadwinner.

So realistically we’ll need to fund this out of savings. Which means - no bigger house, tbc on a second child, unclear what we do for first child’s childcare or school (part of the reason to move was to get in a good school area) etc.

DH is basically refusing to do any actual projections or calculations and just saying we’ll cope and it’ll be fine. This is becoming a huge wedge between us, as every time I say that I need him to explain against all our costs how this works, because it’s causing me to feel huge financial pressure, he gets angry that I’m not supporting him. He brought it up again this morning and it led to a huge fight and he stormed out.

I basically know I need to get on board but I am so upset - I’ve been killing myself in my job, I did a short mat leave so I wouldn’t lose my income or make us just rely on him, work full time etc etc to provide the best possible life on my side for us and our child. I don’t love my job but I do it for the family. And now he just wants to toss that all up in the air. I want to be supportive as I understand how hard our jobs are, and I don’t want him to be miserable for the next 30 years, but I am just so upset that he doesn’t seem to understand or care about the impact and uncertainty he’ll put on us. What’s also stressful is he’ll go days without mentioning this and indicating he’s actually fine with his current job, then suddenly he’ll swap and we’re back to this again.

I didn’t post this in aibu as I know I have to get on board, but I really want some guidance on how to navigate this so I can support him in changing jobs while not cracking myself under the stress / resentment of his attitude / feeling totally trapped, or finding ourselves messed up financially. Would love advice from anyone who’s been in a similar situation :(

And I guess if it gives some context - think our current jobs would be similar to being doctors, and his new job would be similar to say like a running a tech start up which also involves lots of travel (hard to describe not flexible is my point..).

To be clear - it’s not the career change I object to. It’s the utter refusal to practically work through the impacts.

If he's refusing to sit down and discuss the nitty gritty details of how him taking such a drastic pay cut by changing careers will affect your financial and family goals, that means he knows it's not doable but he wants to live his dream. The problem is his dream will become your nightmare.

I'm sorry, but you'll end up divorced or wishing you were. You're going to resent him for having you be the main breadwinner and give up your dream of having another kid and you'll be stuck in the starter house with a man who won't be contributing financially because it all has to go back in the business or in the household ways like doing school pickup and child care because all he will do is grind and rest.

You don't have to go along. I really don't see how this will work out any way but badly for you.

Does he have a business plan set up and has he run it by any professionals in his desired area?

This is my worry. He’s always been so head in the sand about money. I manage all our family finances. He earns well now but never wants to look at outgoings etc. The thought of the pay cut, plus being self employed, is stressing me - I mentioned he’d need an accountant and he snapped that was ridiculous - I have no idea. I suggested running this by a financial adviser for projections and again he snapped at me. He hasn’t spoken to anyone in the same industry about their actual take home pay - he just has an idea from online forums etc.

It’s not actually running a start up but that’s the closest analogy I can think of - extremely time intensive, low pay at the start, possible much higher pay in a few years if you do well but obviously that requires a lot of investment. It’s not quite as risky as a start up though I guess. Maybe more like trying to become a successful international news journalist..?

I do feel he doesn’t want to acknowledge the nitty gritty and just wants me to manage that for him / suck it up for a few years so he can get on with this new career. I don’t want to be blamed for “trapping” him in his current one (I don’t think that’ll lead to a good outcome either) and I can completely see the logic they he’ll do better in something he’s interested in and will probably be good at. But the expectation that we just all deal with it until he’s successful is upsetting me. If this were me I would’ve done all the sums and showed why it all makes sense and been clear how I’ll support the load - he just refuses to do that..

The fact that he has all these dreams and ideas but won't take any responsibility for the impact it will have on his family, is a massive problem.
Look, you can't stop him from doing what he wants to do.
If I were you, I'd start by setting some extremely clear boundaries. Not about what he needs to be doing, because he's obviously not a team player and he prefers to live like he's got no one counting on him, but boundaries about what you will and will not be doing to make up for his decisions.

You expect him to come up with his fair share of the household bills. If he doesn't, you will not be compensating for whatever he's short.
You expect him to make a thought-through financial plan. If he doesn't, you will not be chasing after him begging him to sit down with you.
If he's short on money, he needs to reach out to his network, parents, friends, family members, or even get a loan from the bank. You will not make up for it.
If he's short on cash more than twice in the first year, you will have to come to the conclusion that he can't be trusted to make good financial decisions and the smartest thing would be for you both to live separately so your finances aren't negatively impacted.

Right now he has the freedom to act like a child, yet face none of the consequences. Time for that is over now.

Agree with all of this but I think you also need to make it clear that he will not be able to duck out of family life to make this work. Has he found the transition to being a father tough? Do you think that actually part of this is a failure to adjust to his responsibilities as a family man? You need to spell out that the switch isn't a handy way to get out of this.

Together you need to sit down and work out what it means for both of you and what you can change in life to make it possible. But yes, I would want him to do it.

Life is too short to be miserable doing what you’re doing. You’re only mid 30s. You have a lot of working years left and it’s very likely that you too will hit a similar wall and crisis point at some point. I absolutely loved my career. Until I didn’t in my early/mid 40s. You should both have the flexibility to make some changes and be supported, within reason, of course.

We had a 2 month old baby (our first) and Dh wanted to leave his awful job and go self-employed. We worked out the numbers and considered long term what life would look like and we leapt. Dh went from a marketing role to self-employed in a creative field. It’s been 12 years now. He earns about 6x what he did in his miserable old job.

I’m in the process of doing the same and retraining, leaving quite a prestigious high earning role to go self employed. I can’t tell you the relief and what a difference it’s made to my mental health.

Yes, you can’t be stupid, but don’t hold onto the status quo at the risk of him completely burning out. If he’s already at this point in his 30s, he’s going to crash and burn eventually, so it’s time to figure out a solution now. I’d say yes, let’s work out what changes we need to make to make it happen. That puts the ball in his court to work out the details. Don’t jump before it’s all figured out, but do consider some business coaching or personal development coaching or something to help him formulate his plans, plus some business courses if he doesn’t already have a business background. It’s an investment that will pay off if he wants this to be successful.

I’ll also add that there’s no reason he can’t do all of this and still be an engaged parent. Dh did all his business planning, accounts, web design, etc will baby dd strapped to him in a sling. We used to take her to sales events with us (and then ds when he came along). He does half the school runs. He does a lot of the school holiday childcare because he just drags the kids around while he deals with staff issues and shipping problems and emails and payroll on his phone. Going self employed when our dc were little didn’t stop him from being fully involved as a dad. If anything, he has more flexibility and more availability because he can control his working pattern.

My ex husband left a steady and reasonably paid job to pursue his dream career. Like you it was something of a surprise dream given he'd only mentioned it in passing. He had no business experience just an idea, a good idea to be fair to him.

I did not want him to do it. I knew if it failed his mental health would be impacted. I knew the burden of all expenses would fall on me.

But ultimately it wasnt for me to "allow" and I said if he wanted to go for it he should.

Stupid decision i wholly regret. He started it with loans but quickly it became a black hole. 50k of my savings into shoring it up at various times to cover stage wages and vat bills all of which would be "paid back" but of course never was. He even took the kids savings and they've never been seen since.

We are divorced because of his 50 affairs so I was clearly a mug in many different ways but his business cost me so money then he got half my assets in the divorce because he had none.

My point I think is.. is there a real credible business plan? Is it funded by him and only him and does he understand that the family wont shore up his dream to the financial detriment of the family.

Because once you're "in it" you cant set these boundaries.

People say to me well why did you let him use your money to cover wages.. well there was no other option and the business would have shut shop immediately then it was ALL lost. It wasnt 50k in one go it was a couple grand here and there.

I'm sure lots of people successfully follow their dreams in their 30s but when you have a family you need to put them first in my (obviously jaded by experience) view!

I do think fatherhood has prompted this. We’re at a mid level in our careers ; the initial buzz / energy of getting into the profession has all worn off, it is hard work and more progression becomes very hard work. Adding in a baby has made it even harder. I think maybe he craves that feeling of doing something new and exciting again, maybe it’s boredom with our generic grinding professional + baby lives, maybe it’s ego, not sure.

He does say that in the long run it’ll provide better for our family, which I mean, maybe, but that’s in no way guaranteed. And he doesn’t seem remotely fussed about the short/medium term impacts. So I do think this is more about him and some sort of reaction to everything now.

I also to be honest just don’t feel convinced he’ll stick at it. Part of the reason he doesn’t like his current job is the politics / feeling a bit stuck in a mid level / etc. But how is that going to improve in this new one? Surely one the initial excitement has worn off, the new money stresses, plus the same old politics BS, same old feelings of inadequacy (especially as an older person restarting) etc are all going to come back again and I’ll be hearing about how he shouldn’t have left his current job etc.

The more I think about it the more I agree that I think he wants an escape from current stresses.

Our finances are mostly separate so I’m ok in that respect. It’s more our joint quality of life will suffer, our kid will have fewer opportunities, and I’ll be working so hard just to keep us afloat - instead of really profiting from our hard work as I thought we’d start to in our mid late 30s.

So I have a bit of experience in this in that DH changed careers, albeit he had planned his exit for a long time and had enough saved to be out of work a long time. Does he definitely fully understand the new career? Dh used a career guidance councillor (they exist for adults too) and he found that really useful. It might also be beneficial for him to find a mentor in his new chosen field who can offer perspective and guidance.

I don’t have a problem in principle with him restarting. But he’s completely refused to engage with the figures / any professional discussions or coaching etc. in the way you described :(. That is what’s making it so stressful. I just don’t know how to communicate the message.

im glad to hear it’s worked well for your family. I do think having a kid puts your priorities in sharp focus and so I know this is clearly what he wants to do.

Then I think you need to tell him that you will listen to his proposals for a career change when he has some proposals to put on the table and give him a list of what you are wanting to see. Then shut down every conversation with a "have you got the proposals for us to go through yet? No? then rather than talk in the abstract, let's wait until you do."

It’s a no from me. He’s not properly thought it through if he can’t answer questions on how he is going to make it happen. You see it in here all the time: man starts his own business or starts doing a passion type job. Before you know it he’s not pulling his weight financially, not doing his share of household stuff and wife / partner is pressured to make up all of the shortfall. While he wastes time and money on god knows what

I’m thinking about a change of direction in my career. Difference is l am going to dip my toe in during my spare time and keep up my day job. So there is little impact on my husband, children or finances. This isn’t the phase of life to be making big risky decisions

This is good advice.

It may well be that it can go ahead. Or, he may have to wait a couple of years whilst he builds up savings. Or, it’s a non-starter.

But you can’t give an opinion without the facts!

To be clear - it’s not the career change I object to. It’s the utter refusal to practically work through the impacts.

That's what you need to say to him.

If he hasn't talked to other professionals on the field and is getting his ideas from online and doesn't even have a viable business plan and thinks he doesn't need an accountant, he's being childish and frankly, fucking dumb about this. How's his capital to fund this? How long can it be expected to last? When does he expect to be seeing a profit? Are you supposed to be also financially supporting this? He's very likely to crash and burn.

I also to be honest just don’t feel convinced he’ll stick at it.

Owning and running your own business is a grind. If he doesn't have a lot of grit and knuckle down and go for it when he doesn't feel like it (and that really sounds like he doesn't if he's wanting to escape the realities of family life and career), he's not going to succeed.

What if you become ill or need surgery?

Get your ducks in order.

That must be really frustrating OP. You do sound very much supportive but also very realistic and he doesn’t want to hear it.

it would make sense for you to ur DH to hold off on his new profession for a few years until your DC and any future DC are at school and when the loss to income wouldn’t be as impactful.

Could him working part time on current job and new business work as a compromise at all?

I understand this so much. My husband did something similar when our kids were small, he was convinced his "dream job" would be nothing but wonderful for us all. I knew that I could oppose it, but he would always resent me. I never considered how much I would resent him if things went wrong.

I loved him and though I had plenty of doubts, I supported him the best I could. It was ok for a couple of years, until it wasn't. The market changed. He made some bad decisions, didn't think things through. We lost everything - our house, our savings, all our security and wound up living in a horrible, cramped, damp flat in a terrible area because we couldn't afford to rent anything else. We've only just got back on the housing ladder and it has taken 15 years. I feel so much guilt about the kids childhood being nowhere near as good as it could have been.

Honestly using his savings to live on while building up the business is ringing such alarm bells for me. Maybe his business will be very successful, but as you already have doubts about him being able to stick at it, I would try to put some boundaries in place. Could he work part time somewhere while starting it up so he doesn't have to use the savings?

I also would try to get a house now if at all possible while you both are earning well and would possibly be approved for a mortgage. If his business never takes off and the savings are depleted, it could take a very long time to get back to where you are now.

I would rather have a partner that is happy in their career than not. I understand the financial logistics, and I feel for you with all the stress of this… but if he doesn’t do it, you risk him burning out where he is, or just jacking it all in suddenly.. if he and you plan so he has time to ease into this, gets things rolling and organised, it will hopefully help?
My partner worked somewhere which he disliked, and it all suddenly came to a head and he walked out and refused to go back… it was awful, and I saw both sides but the sudden loss of an income in that way was horrendous. If he had planned to switch jobs/careers it would’ve been far less stressful.
I would happily forego a bigger house or a couple of holidays, monthly luxuries etc for my partners happiness, because life is short and we need to do what makes us happy, money doesn’t fill that gap for me. Understand a second child in the pipeline is a difficult one, but if I’m being a cow, it might not happen even if you plan for it, people have big families in small houses and manage fine… there’s always a different way to think about things and you both need to see each others viewpoint and come to a decision together that will hopefully compromise somewhere in the middle.

I was just going to suggest what @Wethers121has said. Can he either start this alongside his current job or go part time and run the 2 together?

I am with you OP, you are a family and need to support each other however he just seems to want to act like a single person who has no responsibilities.

You DON'T have to get on board. Not without a convincing business plan. At the moment what he has is not a plan, but a plantasy.

Who's steering this ship?! Who made him captain?

At the very least, put ttc plans on hold.

Not to be alarmist, but being a single parent of one would be better than being a single parent of two.

I changed career completely in my late 30s. I had a cash flow, volunteered then worked casually in the field, started with a one year contract then found an employer to pay for the qualification I needed. I still wouldn't have done it if DH hadn't been supportive, because it relied on this support and still does due to some antisocial hours aspects.

I mean this kindly, but if I told my DH I was unhappy and he replied that we needed to do some financial projections, I’d be pretty upset. I’m sure it’s more complex, but you do sound as though money is the only thing he is bringing to the relationship. It’s hard when you are used to a particular income, but there are other things in life.
I think in your shoes, I’d try to really hear what is going on, and try to work out how you can support him.
I am older than you, on the other side of this, and our lives are much better than they were, although we have less money.

The thing is, when I’ve said I’m unhappy with my job and semi joked about going part time or taking a huge pay cut (there were some interesting opps that once came up with a similar cut), he’s always said absolutely not as it’s too much pressure on him. And I was fine with that as I understood I would hate to be the primary breadwinner too! Splitting the load as it were has made things easier.

Also, when I’ve thought about dropping my hours or income, it’s always been with the aim of spending more time with our kid (and that would also of course cover childcare costs to an extent - yes I know that sounds blunt too but this is clearly like a reason why many women do go part time)

But I do completely get that he wants something different. I just honestly can’t take the pie in the sky way he’s going about it, and the pressure it’s putting on me. I know it sounds cold to talk about cash and I wouldn’t if it were just me (as I have my own income), but it will have a wider impact on our family and he either doesn’t care or just simply thinks me/his savings are going to buffer us through.

Ii would be asking why he did not do all this before you had a child ?

Secondly, if he becomes self employed
There will be no
Sick pay
Holiday pay
Pension
Redundancy pay
Pay rise
Unless he puts money aside for these

Plus tax, National Insurance

Working a "normal job" is perhaps boring, but much easier to live

I read the OP as it being about time as much as money.

Time to take a second maternity leave.

Time to do a decent job at her own job (which would be even more important if she's the main earner).

Family time.

At the very least starting the new idea alongside the current job (possibly after reducing days?) would reduce the risk.

Doing a proper business plan would probably reveal aspects neither of them has thought of. It's only sensible.