DH career change

[SEhitherhere22]

DH and I are both mid 30s, with 1 DC (1) and planning to try for another one soon.

We are in very similar professional jobs, both work FT (very long hours) and objectively earn decently well (we are both paid about the same). However, as we live in the SE / London for our jobs, our childcare and other costs are large. We used to save a good amount but that has significantly decreased since having a child, so we save a bit but not that much now.

DH has recently been saying he doesn’t want to do his job anymore; he feels stuck in it, doesn’t want to keep doing it, and wants to pursue a different career altogether. It’s one that he thought about doing way back when he left uni (long before I met him) but didn’t have the confidence to try and so just went this professional route instead. He’s occasionally mentioned this alternative career in the time I’ve known him, but always as in a very vague “that would’ve be interesting” way / never any suggestion he would change now. Suddenly in the past few months, he’s decided it’s now or never and he is going to change career.

He is clear he wants to do it. It is clear to me that if I were “unsupportive” (but also if he were unsuccessful at it tbh) it would have a very detrimental impact on our relationship. He very much has his identity tied to his work.

The career change (I’m being vague so not outing) would be one that sounds quite “prestigious” / “cool” to outsiders, but objectively, would mean a huge pay cut. It would be a 60-70% pay cut for him in the first year, maybe 50% in the second, unclear after that. The new career is self employed, so additional loss of benefits, employer pension, bonuses, etc. This also makes it difficult to project earnings.

He is insisting that he’ll make up the shortfall in the early years with his savings. He is also insisting in the long run, he should earn better because he is passionate about this career path and because, being self employed, ultimately he can earn “better”.

It is also clear that, if he were to take the new career path with the pay cut, he would not be able to pick up any childcare, house stuff, etc, as he would need to work extremely hard to establish himself and try to make the better earnings he’s projecting.

I calculated how much our current outgoings are against our new projected household income. We would be losing money every month, for at least the next two years, if he switched. The obvious thing to cut back would be childcare - but we can’t do this as his new career wouldn’t enable that basically, plus we’re at the stage of wanting a second kid (and realistically have a limited window). We also had been talking about moving to a bigger house (we are in a very small place that would not fit more than 3).

I have thought about whether I can get an even higher paid job, but realistically the only options I can see would require working absolutely ridiculous hours and having a partner who does a much bigger home load. (Trying to be vague again but this is very much the case.) My job is already hugely stressful and now I feel I will have no flexibility at all because I’ll be the guaranteed breadwinner.

So realistically we’ll need to fund this out of savings. Which means - no bigger house, tbc on a second child, unclear what we do for first child’s childcare or school (part of the reason to move was to get in a good school area) etc.

DH is basically refusing to do any actual projections or calculations and just saying we’ll cope and it’ll be fine. This is becoming a huge wedge between us, as every time I say that I need him to explain against all our costs how this works, because it’s causing me to feel huge financial pressure, he gets angry that I’m not supporting him. He brought it up again this morning and it led to a huge fight and he stormed out.

I basically know I need to get on board but I am so upset - I’ve been killing myself in my job, I did a short mat leave so I wouldn’t lose my income or make us just rely on him, work full time etc etc to provide the best possible life on my side for us and our child. I don’t love my job but I do it for the family. And now he just wants to toss that all up in the air. I want to be supportive as I understand how hard our jobs are, and I don’t want him to be miserable for the next 30 years, but I am just so upset that he doesn’t seem to understand or care about the impact and uncertainty he’ll put on us. What’s also stressful is he’ll go days without mentioning this and indicating he’s actually fine with his current job, then suddenly he’ll swap and we’re back to this again.

I didn’t post this in aibu as I know I have to get on board, but I really want some guidance on how to navigate this so I can support him in changing jobs while not cracking myself under the stress / resentment of his attitude / feeling totally trapped, or finding ourselves messed up financially. Would love advice from anyone who’s been in a similar situation :(

The sad thing is, whatever you and he decide or do now, he's shown that your and your child's wellbeing aren't his primary concern, and you can't un-know that.

You sound like a pretty unselfish person but you may need to act defensively. Bills have to be paid.

Yeah, don't bring another baby into this OP. If it all goes tits up (divorce, financial ruin) then one child is way better than two. My first thought was that this fantasy has been re-ignited by fatherhood. He wants to feel like a free spirit again. Unfortunately he isn't and he won't be for a very long time. This is also fairly typical of men, they always put themselves first and you've now learned the first lesson in this. Don't let him bully you into this for the sake of his "wellbeing". What about yours, and your child's? If I was you I would start getting your ducks in a row with a view to this relationship possibly ending.

Think a sensible approach would be to consider either part-time working in the new venture, or a longer period of leave, or maybe trying as a 'side hustle' first. We'd all love to leave 'officeVille' to become an artist/photographer/novelist or whatever, but there are good reasons not to.

The thing is, when I’ve said I’m unhappy with my job and semi joked about going part time or taking a huge pay cut (there were some interesting opps that once came up with a similar cut), he’s always said absolutely not as it’s too much pressure on him. And I was fine with that as I understood I would hate to be the primary breadwinner too! Splitting the load as it were has made things easier.

I think that you need to use this argument back at him too - you saw some interesting routes for you and he vetoed them as he didn't want the pressure. (And you even got a short maternity leave due to the "pressure" on him.) Now he wants interesting opps for him and he needs to recognise that you don't want the pressure either. SO, again, he needs to show you how he won' t be inflicting pressure on you either financially or with the family burden. I also think that you need to ask him to wait until the expensive childcare years are over which would give him lots of time to plan ahead properly and investigate the career in more depth. If he absolutely refuses to defer then I would get quite firm with him and say that you are prepared to offer him more support than he was prepared to offer you BUT only if he is prepared to accept that you also need the security of not carrying all the financial pressure - hence grey rocking his attempts to have a hypothetical discussion with a "go away and produce a proper plan and then we can talk" response on repeat. Every time he says you are not supportive tell him you are ready to consider being supportive but only once he has done his share of being supportive to his family by coming up with a realistic and viable plan. The bold words are essential and non negotiable....

This. Dh went self employed, we talked about it for a long time, we did financial projections for a couple of years, what ifs, looked into the cost of sick pay insurance both short term and long term ones.

Holidays have to be considered because no work, no pay. He went from taking 35 days holiday when in paid employment to just 16 days the first year he was establishing the business. That one sticks in my head. Mainly because he needed the break.

Your Dh would be pausing his employer pension contribution so he will need to set up a new pension pot too.

You don't have to get on board with this. He needs to show he has considered everything, from money to family time to potentially only being able to afford one child.

My Dad was self employed and it was a shit show, The number of times they almost lost the house when I was a child still haunts me.

Your Dh is being completely selfish, no family time, no nursery pickups basically everything is being left to you to do. You would be a married single parent. Lots of businesses and start ups don't survive. He needs to see a professional career coach but he won't because he won't have anyone tell him his dream is unrealistic.

He has a wife and child to consider in all of this. It is unfair to say you cannot reduce your hours because of the pressure it would have put on him to now expect you to be the main earner and he ploughs his savings into day to day living costs.

Ask him to explain to you exactly what he considers being supportive to mean.

Its very clear to me that he sees it as him getting his own way without showing you that he has done the work to ensure every chance of success and with you sacrificing any of your own wants.

He needs to understand that there’s a big difference between a supportive spouse and a mug. He wants you to be a mug and is angry that you won’t meekly fall into line. I also would be getting my ducks in a row. The level of selfishness is appalling

Life is too short to be miserable in a job when there are other options.
I'd look at outgoings and reduce them, cheaper cars, phone contracts, holidays, short term reduction in pension etc. I'd also suggest to DH that he holds out for 6-12 months to have an experience of living on a lower salary and put all income above what he will be earning in the new career into savings.

This is also good advice.

This is a great idea on testing the savings. But I have no idea how I could make him do it! Our finances are separate..I can’t stop him getting expensive deliveroos or whatever if he feels like it. But I imagine we could test a period of time without holidays, only allowing X number of meals out a month, only shopping certain supermarkets etc... don’t know if he’d play ball.

Honestly though childcare and mortgage / bills are our biggest expenses by a mile. And it’s impossible to reduce at least childcare without me cutting back work hours.

Wed been discussing speaking to a financial person to generally figure out some stuff beforehand, so I am thinking of asking a professional to do the actual projections, if only for my own sanity. Even if DH does them himself there’s no way he’ll factor in or understand the impact of no sick leave, no paid holiday, no pension etc. Of course in an ideal world, DH would be the one thinking about this ..

Thanks you for the comments on this thread, they’ve been really balanced and helpful. I don’t know who to speak to in real life - my parents would be worried, my friends would just mirror my stress. His family would, I think, just take his side - they are also not very practical really, but are still quite comfortable (mostly from being in a very lucky generation etc).

Oops sorry - I thought I read you were saving for a house.

The thing is, when I’ve said I’m unhappy with my job and semi joked about going part time or taking a huge pay cut (there were some interesting opps that once came up with a similar cut), he’s always said absolutely not as it’s too much pressure on him. And I was fine with that as I understood I would hate to be the primary breadwinner too! Splitting the load as it were has made things easier.

This seems quite unfair on you.

Is he qualified for this new kind of work? Is it something you can just walk into?

Im tempted to suggest you say to him "I think that's a great idea - so good in fact I am going to do exactly the same".. perhaps not very constructive, bit it might be a useful thought experiment.

I am in some ways your dh in my own marriage. I earn far far less than my dh. But I check in with him regularly to ensure that he is not feeling unfairly pressured. And more to the point I did so when we still had kids at home. I am well aware that I am not entitled to carry on with my career, which I love, if it means I am a financial burden to someone I love, and have entered into a partnership with. (I also spend less on my hobbies than he does - not that he's especially extravagant)

I could probably earn more in an NMW role and he knows that is always an option if we need me to do it.

Honestly the refusal to have a clear, open, honest, full conversation about this, but just get shouty instead, is really off. He is not acting like any kind of husband i would want in my life. Im not sure i could live with that personally, he perceives any valid question from you as an attack! I can only assume he is full of doubt himself but finds it easier to put them down to you being unsupportive, rather then face them head on and address them.

Which does not bode AT ALL well for his ability to navigate the choppy waters of a new and challenging career.

I wonder if you could try to tak this through with a third party? I don't see how you can become supportive without answers to your basic sensible questions, perhaps a third party might help you think them through together?

It won't be "fine" he is a complete selfish idiot.

Your point about projecting his doubts is spot on. I assume this is also why he doesn’t want to speak to a career advisor, a financial advisor, etc - he doesn’t want them pointing out the risks. It’s easier to chalk them up to me being a cow. And yes this is exactly my fear re navigating a new career. Sorry it’s sort of hard to describe without being very outing.

He is sort of qualified for it, it’s not like he wants to just spuriously open a bar or something, but it’s a tough industry and he’ll be up against newly minted hungry grads with no obligations. Think like journalism, criminal barrister, that sort of thing - sounds prestigious / interesting (and I imagine is!) but difficult in all the other “boring” respects..

I completely understand that someone who is unhappy in their work wants to change career while they are still young-ish.

I will undoubtedly put a massive strain on your relationship if he feels you are preventing him from making changes.

Maybe you need to downsize/move somewhere cheaper so he can try a new career and you might be able to work part-time.

I also would not want to bring another child into the mix either unless you can reach an agreement on your professional plans first.

Honestly OP if I felt that my partner expected me to be miserable at work for life, I would seriously consider leaving the relationship.

Agree you are allowed to express an opinion about how it will affect you and your daughter and actually have a plan

recognise his unhappiness but also that you cannot sacrifice yours to make him happy so it needs to work for both of you in the medium to longer term

How is it that you are married and he has sufficient savings to do this but you don't? Are they not family savings? Did you cover all your costs out of your maternity leave pay and return before full pay ended by any chance?

In his projections, [non existent obviously] is he assuming you will now cover all childcare and mortgage costs while he uses "his" savings for a start up with no business plan?

What are the career risks to him if this venture fails? Would bankruptcy impact his ability to resume his former career if certified in some way eg accountant/lawyer etc? Or indeed his professional credibility?

Have you both considered leaving London for a lower income, lower stress alternative to your current careers? eg if you are both lawyers, going in house or relocating to a 2nd tier firm with less hours?

I think he is being grossly unfair to you and I can understand why you are so upset. Not least by doing this then he has decided for you that you can only have one child. Without discussion or analysis as to whether he could stick it out for 5 years until both are in school, childcare bills are halved and you both have more assets under your belt to protect against this scheme.

If you divorce now, what would you be forced to do? Do you have equity in the home you live in now?

Do you have a friend, preferably male, one who runs his own business and is respected by your husband? Someone savvy enough to ask the right questions.

In the meantime, I'd take the suggestion up thread. You both spend 3-6 months working within your new notional means while he builds out a business plan and you both stack up some savings ahead of him giving notice. If he won't consider that then I think you know just where his family sits within his priorities and it would be ultimatum time for me.

I think you need a 3rd party mediator if he won’t discuss it reasonably. It sounds like he fears it won’t be able to happen, if he has you objecting, or partly trying to facilitate it but not exactly how he wants, he can blame that on you and not himself. So I don’t think just going along with it does anything to strengthen your relationship, it’s just postponing the strain. He has to be told that you can’t take all the responsibility, either, and he has to face that right now.

Honestly @SEhitherhere22 I think whatever outcome happens it is going to have a very detrimental effect on your relationship

For me it’s really hard to know if he’s being unreasonable without knowing the career he’s giving up and what he’s venturing into. And the potential money reductions.

I changed career in my mid 30’s. Left my well paid job, did a 3 year doctorate on a bursary (15k). We had 1 dc in nursery. It was tough for those 3 years, but two years after qualifying I was earning 40% more than I was before with much more flexibility.
so I don’t think he’s unreasonable for wanting something different. Being in a career you don’t like for 40+ years will be would destroying.

He is sort of qualified for it, it’s not like he wants to just spuriously open a bar or something, but it’s a tough industry and he’ll be up against newly minted hungry grads with no obligations. Think like journalism, criminal barrister,

Is he qualified? Is it going from being a qualified solicitor to wanting to be a criminal barrister? Or is it more like going from being a doctor to wanting to start a band?!

He's away with the fairies. Why doesn't he like what he does? There are loads of factors impacting satisfaction at work...

Doing such a change when you have going kids will mean he is unlikely to be very successful unless he is prepared for some serious sacrifices.

jeez fo you actually like thia person?

In this case OP I would be saying no. If he wants to do a career change he needs to find something that pays decently and prep the transition while still working in his current job. You’ve got kids and a house and bills to pay, he can’t just burn through your savings and plunge you into what could a miserable financial position to be selfish.
i wouldn’t want my savings depleted by my partner being so self indulgent.
It is particularly concerning that he wouldn’t be able to do any additional childcare either. He’s being very selfish I think given you have a child to support.

I would be very, very seriously pointing out to him that as you are married, what he does financially has an impact on you, savings or not, and that its actually incredibly hurtful and worrying that he would not want to make sure he got all the professional advice possible and planned it out properly, with contingency plans etc, because he's not thinking about your financial security at all here - a partner should first and foremost be making sure their partner is protected if things went wrong, and he cant possibly do that if he doesn't figure out how thats going to work, so its upsetting that he has the option to protect you and your child's financial security and he is choosing not to take it.

I would worry that Youtube, or whatever, is making things seem easier than they are. For example, I am an accountant (in manufacturing) and I am aware self employed or small firms of practice accountants exist. Some will be raking it in - and no doubt I could find videos of people with a flash lifestyle. Thing is, I couldn't easily switch over. They are in effect different jobs with the same title.

Maybe take a lower stress day to day job and re-appraise, or plan to gradually phase that out as the new work comes on board?

I'm 55 now, and understand where the "if not now, when" thought comes into your head. I've also been shat on by employers in the past, and have always been the sole (ish) breadwinner.

There must be a middle ground somewhere, at least to begin with. My identity was tied to being a "high flying" CFO, until it wasn't....