Estranged daughter

[Eleanorswindow]

I haven't seen or spoken to my DD for almost 2 years now and it's tearing me apart. She's in her 50's and menopausal (may be relevant) and we've always been extremely close so the hole in my life is immense.

It started with her saying she had MH issues and didn't feel up to seeing anyone, me included, and this went on for months although we still spoke on the phone daily. I started to suspect there was more to it from a couple of comments she made about my DH, her SF since she was 6yo, and eventually I asked her directly whether there was a problem with him.

She then revealed that he had always made her uncomfortable, had made comments about her body as a teenager and basically implied that he has an unhealthy interest in teenage girls. When pressed she couldn't come up with anything really concrete, just vague references to how he was around her when she was growing up. I do remember him commenting that she didn't get her boobs from me (hers are much bigger than mine ever were) and the like but I honestly never thought anything of it, he can be a bit socially inept and doesn't always seem to know where the line is but it never seemed that bad to me, just typical of men of our generation really.

I tried really hard to see her point of view but struggled to hear her talk about him like that, he's not perfect but he's not a bad man and I did say as much to her. She took this very badly, said I was minimising her experience and defending him and cut contact with me completely. I was very angry on DH's behalf when this first happened and very hurt that she seemed to be punishing me for something I didn't do so didn't try particularly hard to persuade her otherwise but I also thought maybe menopausal hormones were to blame for at least some of what was happening with her and that she would come round in time.

But that doesn't seem to be happening as the months are ticking by and the situation is beginning to feel permanent and irreparable. I'm devastated that we've ended up here but have no idea how to begin to fix it, she's been very clear that she doesn't want to hear from me. Is there anything I can do here or do I just have to accept that I've lost my DD forever? I miss her and my DGC so much and honestly can't believe any of this has happened, we were so close.

You let your husband creep on your daughter. You heard that yourself and you enabled his creeping by giving him the socially inept excuse.

You chose a relationship with a guy who made your daughter sexually uncomfortable in her own home. You dismissed what she was saying because you wanted a partner more than a daughter who felt safe.

Now there's consequences for you. Deal.

You chose to set an example of what not to be as a parent.

She's chosen to keep her children away from your creep husband and his enabler, you.

👏for your daughter.

You do realize there's more that happened when you weren't around, don't you?

I'm probably around your daughter's age, maybe a little bit older (b 1969) and in my experience your husband's comments would have been widely recognised as unacceptable in the '80s/early '90s when your daughter was a teen. I accept that YOU didn't see it that way, I'm not saying that you're lying or misremembering, but I'm really surprised no one else seemed to have noticed.

Of course there are outliers - for example the sexualised pictures of Trump and his oldest daughter and his comments about her - and I think that for a biodad a single comment might have been dismissed as him just being kind of gross and pervy back then, but a stepdad? No way. I'm not saying this to hurt you but just to explain that your daughter's sense of betrayal and her remembering her teen years as characterised by a lack of protection from the adults she was supposed to trust (primarily you since it was your husband, but maybe her dad too if he was in her life back then) is probably a lot deeper and more serious than you seem to think. And you're STILL defending this man and making up weird reasons why your daughter may be saying what she is and reacting so strongly to it. You didn't put her first then and you're not now. If she's still hurting, then I'm afraid that she's right to limit contact for now.

I agree with PPs, I think there is more to this than she's said, I feel like she was testing the waters to see if you would defend her. And as you didn't she's had no choice but to walk away from a relationship.

It’s kind of vile that you’re blaming her hormones for this and says a lot for how little you respect her and women in general. Perhaps you’ve internalised a lot of misogyny given the way you think a stepdad perving on his stepdaughter’s breasts is no big deal and just a case of oh bless him he’s socially inept. Stepdaughter themed porn is a massive category for a reason and enough stepdad’s do inappropriate things for it to be obscene for you to dismiss and invalidate what she’s said. She’s done the right thing backing off from you and the only way to repair that is to work on yourself to understand and accept your mistakes, not to blame it on the menopause and hope she’ll grow out of it. Or you can choose your DH as you always have and carry on as you are.

She was raised with a creepy sex pest for a SF and you not only didnt see it but excused it and took his side when she told you.

No hope to reconcile here.

So your daughter tried to open up to you about your husband making inappropriate comments about her, made her feel uncomfortable and shown an unhealthy interest in teenage girls. Instead of listening and taking defense of your daughter you decide to invalidate her feelings and words completely and then wonder why she doesn't want anything to do with you. She is your child regardless of how old she is. Your comment 'nothing more concrete' is a shameful excuse for you not to take what she is saying as serious as you should of. FFS he made a comment about his teenagers step daughter boob's and you thought hearing this was ok! Until you accept that your husband is clearly a predator regardless of how big or small the comments were then you should expect not to speak to your daughter again. This has nothing to do with menopause its to do with your child feeling like you squased her feelings and chose him and if you cant see that she's better off.

I wonder if creeper said something inappropriate to one of her kids and that's why she initially approached her mom about it.

I remember this thread. Could well be the daughter. Cut contact about 2 years ago, mother in her 70s, creepy stepfather.

You didn’t protect your dd. You didn’t listen to her.

⬆️ this. You've got to get it right or you'll lose her.

Stopped reading after the boobs comment. How could this not have raised an alarm for you?

You need to apologise to her for your initial reaction to her telling you about her husbands inappropriate comments, tell her you will always put her first and ask her to tell you everthing, and assure her that you believe her.

But you would have to mean it, which could mean that you leave your husband for behaving inappropriately to your daughter.

His comment on her breasts was totally creepy, and could well be the tip of the iceberg. I think you have to follow up on what she said, but I know that some women do pick a man over their own children.

As you were very close, this seperation must be so hard for her, particularly as she could see you as siding with a man who may be her abuser.

I think the only time I would question if my daughter was exaggerating something like this would be if she was having a full psycotic breakdown, not the menopause.

She will have had to work herself up to confiding that in you. It's possible (probable) that things happened which were worse than she told you. When it comes to difficult subjects, people usually work their way in, with the less shocking stuff, then confide more based on the response they get.

As it is, you invalidated what she said. Worse, you've blamed it on hormones. You've dismissed her feelings and memories. You've put your husband's feelings above hers. You've put the feelings of a man who made a teenage girl uncomfortable above that girl, your child.

If you want to make things right with her, you have to spend some time thinking about what she's confided in you. And if you are ready to listen and believe her, then tell her that.

I know this won't be easy for you. Imagine how hard it is for her.

I am a similar age to your daughter and the youngest of 3 sisters. Our dad would never have made comments about our bodies. Never.

So my dad would have been the same generation as your husband. Perhaps even older. My uncles would have been the same generation. Never did any male members of our family make comments about our bodies. I grew up surrounded by men of your husband’s generation and they were all decent men who never made me feel uncomfortable.

Do you see where I’m going with this @Eleanorswindow? This is nothing to do with your husband’s generation. This is him. You brought him into her home. You dismissed her experiences of him.

You can not go back and change the past. But you have to accept that your daughter has every right to completely distance herself from you.

just typical of men of our generation really.

You are excusing a whole generation of men.

Good on your daughter for protecting her own mental health.

So your husband is a creepy pervert and you blame your daughter for being hormonal and defending him and you can’t understand why she’s cut you off? Really?

One of the reasons I don't want to talk to my mother (and there are many) is that when I was about 14, she left me with her husband while she went out one night. Then the next day she asked me if "was ok with me".

Even at the time I was upset that she'd rather leave me with him and risk that something would happen, than take steps to prevent that if she was worried. I'm menopausal now, and I'm fucking angry about that thing that probably registers for her (if she remembers it) as 'I was looking out for dd, what a good mother'. It was literally forty years ago and nothing happened but believe me you know when your own mother has got things wrong and you never forget.

the excuse that men of a certain generation can make gross sexual comments to children is really tiring OP.

your Husband sounds like a creep and you making excuses for him has no doubt annoyed your daughter.

I hope there are no children in the family now that he has contact with

Decent men don't talk to young girls in that way, and decent mothers don't expose their daughters to men who do.

@Eleanorswindow

Yep like everyone else says, your DH is a creepy pervert and instead of listening to your DD you've taken his side over hers. How could you? You're her mother FFS.

Your poor DD. She should have been able to tell you when she was growing up how he made her feel. (I wonder why she didn't? Because she knew you wouldn't believe her?) Then as an adult when she tests the water with you, you minimise everything and defend the creep. And as PP above said there's a lot more she hasn't told you about him.

No wonder she's cut you off. You've no chance of getting her back unless you admit you got it wrong and are prepared to listen to (and accept) some very unpleasant truths about your so called "D"H.

Whether she’s menopausal or not isn’t relevant, it’s just a convenient excuse for you to dismiss her as hormonal/emotional/irrational.

a couple of comments she made about my DH, her SF since she was 6yo
She was testing the water - this is a difficult and upsetting thing to talk about.

he had always made her uncomfortable, had made comments about her body as a teenager and basically implied that he has an unhealthy interest in teenage girls
If a teacher at school, a youth club leader, or any other adult man had made similar comments about her body when she was a teenager, would you have felt uncomfortable about it? Would you have thought a man who was behaving like that might have an unhealthy interest in teenage girls?
Why is your daughter wrong to feel this about your husband?

I do remember him commenting that she didn't get her boobs from me (hers are much bigger than mine ever were) and the like but I honestly never thought anything of it.
If my DH commented on my teenage daughter’s breast size I’d hit the roof. If he made more than one comment, I’d kick him out.
Can you not imagine how you’d have felt as a teen if a creepy uncle, or one of your Dad’s friends, had said things like this to you?
If he behaved like this in front of you it’s entirely possible he was much more inappropriate when you weren’t around.

I tried really hard to see her point of view but struggled to hear her talk about him like that, he's not perfect but he's not a bad man and I did say as much to her.
You struggled to hear it? Do you think she might have struggled to say it? She was having MH issues for months due to the impact of your husband’s disgusting behaviour, finally got up the courage to talk to you, and you made it about how you felt, refused to believe her, and defended him.

I was very angry on DH's behalf when this first happened and very hurt that she seemed to be punishing me for something I didn't do so didn't try particularly hard to persuade her otherwise.
Angry on your DHs behalf, hurt for yourself, but not concerned about your daughter? Not willing to entertain the thought that she might be telling the truth, and is right to feel upset?
You’re not being “punished” unfairly, you’re experiencing the natural consequences of your own inaction and wilful ignorance. You are prioritising your husband over your daughter’s totally valid feelings. Your husband behaved appallingly, you did nothing, then when she finally had the courage to raise this, you got offended and implied she was overreacting. I’m not surprised she’s cut contact with you. I don’t know how you repair this - if I was your daughter I don’t think I’d even want to try.

Would you forgive your mum if she basically didn't believe you when you told her the truth about your pervy step dad?

You sided with him. Over your own daughter.

This 100% !

You both sound a bit odd. Him for saying that and you for not thinking anything of it. Socially inept? He sounds like a perv! Gross!

You sound like every parent on estranged parent forums who claim their children are unreasonable and you have no idea why the estrangement happened. So I am going to break it down from your post.

She's in her 50's and menopausal (may be relevant).

So you are blaming your estrangement on her homones?

* I do remember him commenting that she didn't get her boobs from me but I honestly never thought anything of it,*

He was commenting on her body and it did not raise a red flag for you? You were not bothered enough about your teenage daughters safety to wonder if this was ok? Or bothered enough about her feelings to wonder if this would be upsetting?

doesn't always seem to know where the line is but it never seemed that bad to me, just typical of men of our generation really.

So you minimized the fact that he was inappropriate. And decided that because it did not matter to you, it should not matter to her.

I tried really hard to see her point of view but struggled to hear her talk about him like that, he's not perfect but he's not a bad man and I did say as much to her.

You did not try to see her point of view, you defended your marriage at the expense of her feelings. She told you something that really upset her and you discounted it.

I was very angry on DH's behalf when this first happened

You defended your marriage at the expense of your daughter.

very hurt that she seemed to be punishing me for something I didn't do

So took no responsibility for bringing this man into her life, or your failure to protect her.

* so didn't try particularly hard to persuade her otherwise*

You waited for her to come back to you because you felt you did nothing wrong - I wonder if you ever feel you are in the wring.

devastated that we've ended up here but have no idea how to begin to fix it, she's been very clear that she doesn't want to hear from me. Is there anything I can do here or do I just have to accept that I've lost my DD forever?

Yes, you have to accept the consequences of your actions. If you ever get a chance to speak to your daughter again, you need to apologize sincerely for not taking her seriously and properly listen and take responsibility for what happened. And want it to be because you want to have a good relationship with your daughter, not because you want more access to your grandchildren.

You allowed your husband to be creepy about her when she was a child, dismissed her when she opened up about it, got defensive over her telling you that your perverted husband is a pervert, and then think it's OK to dismiss it as him being of a certain generation and blame her hormones.

Not only does it come across as though you hate your daughter, it comes across as though you hate women.

I wish your daughter peace moving forward.