"Acts of service" but little to no affection - is this emotional abuse ?

[Yesnotagain]

DH and I married 5 years. No DCs. The last 2 years have been difficult. He is very "helpful" and on the surface supportive but shows me very little warmth or affection. Our sex life is dead. We never kiss other than an awkward peck to say hello/goodbye. When I reach for him e.g. for a hug, he does respond, but a lot of the time it feels like he can't wait to disengage.

I have tried to explain many times over the past year or so that I really need warmth and affection from him, but he gets very defensive immediately and starts raising his voice, so I back down. I haven't brought this up for a few months since he stormed off in the middle of a conversation about it.

I feel like I am being punished, to be honest. For example (and I know this sounds a bit daft) but he is so affectionate to our dog, in front of me, almost to make a point. He very frequently acts miserable, as if he is living under a cloud, but won't tell me what is wrong or allow me to try to help. He has few friends, doesn't go out, hates his job. Has a vulnerable and demanding family who depend on him for money etc. so I don't blame him for not being 'jolly' all the time, but his baseline mood of cynicism and misery is really getting me down. He has tried therapy but it made no difference. He's been clinically depressed before and may be so now, but won't seek any more help.

He seems to think his "acts of service" for me (mostly support with my elderly parents) somehow equate to the love I need to feel from him. They don't, not for me. It makes me feel like a 'case', if that makes sense - yet another person who relies on him for help. I've tried to explain this but cannot get through. Yet, every time I pull away a bit he does turn the thermostat up and shows me a bit of the affection I am craving. He also doesn't like it if I am not the focus of his attention, e.g. will interrupt me when I am obviously doing something like writing a text. Then seems to sulk if I don't switch focus to him immediately. Which is why I am asking myself if this is an abusive pattern.

All of this follows an emotional infidelity/ limerence issue he had with a friend a few years ago. I posted about it here https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/relationships/4961125-emotional-infidelity-should-i-ever-trust-him-again?reply=131387150

Does this pattern sound abusive ? I'm not an easy person either, do get stressed and cross quite easily but I am open and honest and affectionate, and desperately want the same from him, like we had before. Don't know if I should hold on and try another way, or just leave before I lose what's left of my self respect and confidence (which isn't much tbf).

Thanks everyone. I know what I need to do, really. It's when and how, and the dread of telling people who think the sun shines out of his arse and how lucky I am to be his wife.

You don’t exist to give his life purpose. He isn’t doing the same for you- quite the opposite.

He has changed dramatically in a short time.

You don’t have to stay.

At a basic level, is he making you happier than you would be on your own? No? Then why stay.

My DH has some similar tendencies, in terms of not being affectionate or physical. I resigned myself to meeting my emotional needs myself, and not relying on him for any of the touchy feely stuff. We’re companionable and comfortable and that’s enough. But we have a nice home, adult children- we’re well past any benefit to starting again, and we’re before I fully understood our situation. You have noticed in time. Bail now. You are allowed!

The relationship is no longer working for you. There are so many red flags. I would make plans financially and then leave him. Thank goodness you don’t have children.

He is clearly unhappy, but you are his partner, not his punchbag. Whether he is autistic is irrelevant. Neurodiversity is not a free pass to be manipulative.

To summarise your opening post:

You have no sex life. But he is not even a friend to you, let alone an intimate partner.

He is cold and not affectionate, but capable of being affectionate (to the dog or when he chooses to switch it on, under duress).

He responds when you articulate your needs with aggression, by raising his voice. Are you afraid of him?

He doesn’t treat you as an equal / confidante. Possibly he has a saviour complex.

He has form for this kind of behaviour before and it was due to limerence for another woman.

This has gone on for two years.

You are worth more than this. 💐

Why do you think it didn't help? Is that something that could be changed? You sound quite defeated already and almost accepting of being with someone who you don't believe loves you and can't meet your emotional needs.

he is saying so, just not with words.

What are u getting out of this?, it's no fun.

it's possible he doesn't really want you but doesnt want anyone else to have you and you are stuck in this rut together as a result.

He may wish he did love you, he certainly does have some kind of love for you, he may just be choosing to look away from it rather than confront it.
Its a shame you'll probably have to do the hard part for him.
This lack of love and consideration wpuld chip away at me, death by a thousand cuts.
Best of luck making the break xxx

OP you are allowed to leave a relationship that is not meeting any of your needs and/or making you unhappy.

I wouldn’t say abusive but he sounds unkind. If I’m being kind he sounds depressed, but that’s not your fault and he shouldn’t take it out on you.

I’ve read your other thread and I think you should leave. He doesn’t sound like he cares about you.

My first reaction was autism/Aspergers too. I’m very very close to a person with this (Asperger’s, even though it’s not called that anymore) and they sound identical in almost every way. Not using that as an excuse or trying to diagnose, I’m just saying it might be worth considering.

My relative went on a very low dose antidepressant, long term, and it really helped with the moods and depressive negativity. Interestingly, once they were diagnosed, they (we) realised that a lot of their family were very similar, it explained a LOT!!!!! It explained why they were leaning on him so much too. I just said I would drop this in here as it might be a possibility.

I had a relationship like this (he was also autistic but I don't really think that was the problem). He thought 'love' meant making sure my car was running properly, spending hours tinkering with it. I would rather have had his time and PAID someone to sort out the car.

In the end it was the sex that killed it. He still wanted sex, but couldn't see that giving no affection at all either before or after made me feel as though he was paying me for it, somehow. I felt like a blow up doll, there to be used and then pushed away. And that was that, really.

He was, and is, a lovely man. Helpful, sociable, kind - he just couldn't see me as a partner, but as a little woman who needed help and was there to have sex with. And I wanted someone who would hug me if I was upset, without then mentioning that they had a erection....

This rings true. Thank you xx

Honestly ? It is sometimes fun. He is very intelligent, has a biting sense of humour which I enjoy, is very attractive, is someone I know I can rely on for practical help if I need it (important as I have no siblings or close family in this country), and has made a real effort with my family including learning their difficult language. So there is a lot in it for me, it is "just" eroding my self respect and integrity feeling/knowing that this apparently amazing person is with me for reasons more to do with their self-image as knight in shining armour than any actual love for me - and seems to punish me for some unidentified sin by withholding the love/affection which once flowed freely enough to convince me that committing to the relationship was a good idea.

@3luckystars @Vroomfondleswaistcoat I could believe it's an autism spectrum issue if he hadn't changed so radically from how he was before.

My guy masked like hell for the first year. He was all over me, took me out, did loads of stuff. It was when he relaxed because he thought that now he'd got a girlfriend he didn't have to bother. I wouldn't have continued a relationship with him if he'd been the 'him' he became and I think he knew this. That was what upset me more, that he knew how he 'ought to behave' because he did it at first, he just stopped thinking he needed to bother.

Lots of reasons, not all DH's fault. But he didn't seem willing to be honest or vulnerable. It was as if he was going along with it but not really invested in it, behind a glass wall somehow. Also the counsellor wasn't great, it seemed to become an intellectual exercise for them rather than helping us see the patterns we had got stuck in. Also the counsellor didn't question the narrative that DH's emotional affair/limerence was no big deal and I should be over it already. So that broke my trust.

That's rough - sorry you had to go through it.

I agree about the masking and you were probably completely head over heels in love with him and thinking he was fabulous until he messed up. Now you are seeing the real him.

Thank you. But he really was a nice guy, he didn't treat me badly. It was just that my idea of a relationship didn't mesh with his idea. I can see that he'd make a very good partner for someone not like me - he's loyal and kind and, whilst a bit mean with money, he does do stuff. We parted in fairly good circumstances. I hope you can see your way clear to getting free to live your own life the way you want.

You need to leave OP. Hes not meeting your needs. Everyone has different needs but mine - and most peoples are the following:

A best friend who I can't keep my hands off, and who can't keep their hands off me.
To feel safe and secure in the relationship.

That's it really in a nutshell. I NEED all of that, and if that person isn't meeting all of those needs then I leave - and I have. I think these are what most people need in a partner. Some parts more than others maybe - some may not need their partner to be their 'best friend' as they may have that role filled by someone else, but they would certainly want a friendship there. Some may not need physical affection and sex as much as I do or want their partner to. But from what you are saying here, your partner literally isn't meeting any of your needs at all. And he won't work on it. Although I have to say if my partner started not wanting to be physical with me, I wouldn't discuss it I would just leave because I would never ever want him to feel pressured to do so. He clearly didnt want to, so that would be enough for me to go.

I don't think there is any hope sadly.

@bigkahunaburger that's exactly it, I would never want him to feel pressured, which is why I don't try to initiate sex with him. I've been the partner who doesn't want it, and there is nothing worse than feeling pressured. He is my best platonic friend in many ways but I don't feel safe at all, and he doesn't want me sexually (whether that's depression or just not attracted anymore).

yesnotagain

Well there's your answer lovely. You have the best friend bit, but nothing else that you need (safety and passion). You can't work on it, because like me you need him to want to want you - you can't make that happen.

My heart breaks for you. You've done your best and given it a long time. Go out and find a person that gives you all you need. You sound lovely - someone will be chomping at the bit to be your best friend who wants to ravish you and also makes you feel safe because they are consistent.

thank you! there's a chink of light right there xx

My boyfriend had the same situation you have with his ex wife and mother of his children. It made him so clinically depressed he got very unwell, left, and had to have counselling to rebuild his self-esteem and become healthy again. He knows he stayed way too long, for the kids, but he said living like that - with someone who pulled away from him at any sort of affection, never wanted to have sex or be intimate in any way, would get angry if it was brought up, just completely destroyed him and his self-worth. You sound at the early stages of that. I don't want to be an alarmist, but as a strong act of self-care protect your mental health before your self-esteem gets destroyed. You deserve better.

BTW I'm a therapeutic social worker and this is exactly what I would tell a client in your situation.