How to process this - sex and marriage

[Piccalino3]

I am separated from my husband of 13 years and am just starting to process what went wrong in our marriage and why.

I think it boils down to a lack of emotional connection and intimacy over many years, but today I have been thinking about how our sex life dwindled. We have 3 kids, I've had birth injuries each time and then a recent repair of the last injury, so there's been a fair bit of physical trauma to that area that did no good for that aspect of our lives. Over the last 5 years, really since our last child was born, I didn't want to have sex anymore. Our physical intimacy stopped over the last year because any non sexual physical touch would lead to pressure for sex, which I didn't want.

The thing I'm trying to process now is my feelings about sex. For the last 2-3 years of our relationship I would give in to duty sex. My husband would ask and I'd say no, and then he'd pester and sulk which made me feel pressured. I'd give in at times to keep the peace, sometimes I would be actively angry while doing it and say something along the lines of 'hurry up and get it over with', he would and then he'd say thank you. There were a few occasions I turned to my side after and cried. The pestering wasn't all time, maybe once a month, but the feeling of emptiness would be awful. I couldn't bear to kiss him, would turn my head away. Sometimes I would actually feel physically like I wanted sex but also really didn't want to do it which was confusing. There were a couple of occasions he was drunk and threatened me by shouting that there would be 'consequences', although we never discussed what these were.

He was never forceful, and I did tell him the impact of his behaviour when we went to marriage counselling and that it made me feel like a wank sock. I tried surgery to fix my prolapse, HRT, reading erotic books etc to increase my desire, it didn't work and now we are separated I find that I am sexually interested in another man, so when I thought I was broken I was not, it was probably the situation. He was hurt by the lack of physical touch and I understand that.

Suddenly I find myself reflecting on these experiences of sex and it's upset me. I think of my husband to be a good person and things just didn't work out with us for various reasons, but this sits with me, I wonder how I'll react in my next relationship (if I have one) around sex and expectation.

Has anyone had any experience of this?

I would recommend reading through this board and you'll see that many posters have experienced this. You are definitely not alone.

I also think that at best your ex could be described as an uncaring sex-pest, but if I look at the details of your post, I would say it's more akin to rape. You did not want to have sex, told him so and he kept pressuring your till you gave in. That is not consent.

Your lack of attraction to him is completely understandable. He has shown, time and time again, that he does not care for your pleasure or comfort. He did not give a shit if sex hurt you or made your injuries worse. It is very hard to be attracted to someone who doesn't even see you as a human being, but only cares about getting his own sexual wants met.

I would also recommend that you read through you own post from the point of view of a third party. What if a friend told you all this about her husband? What would you think?

I could have written that! Although I didn’t give in to the pestering or have a prolapse but the rest is spot on.

I agree that it must be so hurtful to be on the receiving end of that. Imaging being with someone you want to have sex with, that you love, and they turn you down over and over.

We are now amicably divorced and have both met other partners. I thought there was something wrong with me because I didn’t want to have sex with my ex, but it just turns out I stopped fancying him. Being with someone else I actually fancy is amazing!

Your body was telling you that this coercive man was not good for you. He pressured you into sex you didn’t want - there’s a word for that. And he continued to have sex on you despite your lack of enthusiastic consent. He’s vile and I’m glad you’re rid of him.

Enjoy getting to know this new man and take it at a pace you’re comfortable with. Maybe work on your boundaries and assertiveness so that you will feel able to walk away from an abusive situation more easily next time.

I also thought I wasn’t fussed about sex when I was with my H. After divorce I met a man who revelled in my pleasure and it was a whole different story! You can reclaim your sex life and enjoy it.

I can relate too op. The sex pest years were awful. Ive not had sex with him for the past 4 years as i just refused. Ive been there too and gave in lots of times, had to deal with his anger when i may have agreed earler in the day to having sex later when the kids asleep but then being too tired and cba and him kicking off. Pretending to be asleep etc. feeling like he didnt care about me but just wanted his own pleasure.

currently divorcing.

You are far from alone but the reality is that you wanted different things from the relationship. It’s understandable that you felt the way you did because of what happened to you having children however it’s also understandable that he wanted a full sexual relationship, didn’t want to cheat but got frustrated. Ultimately if you want different things then calling it quits is the only answer. I’m not defending him getting annoyed but I can understand how it came to be.

Another sex pest divorcee here. I got sick of it and him. The end.

You are reasonable to feel the way you did around sex in your marriage. However your partner was also reasonably to want sex in his relationship. At least you tried through marriage counselling etc. even if it did not work.

I think more women need to be honest with their partner; if they no longer are interested in sex anymore then they should clearly inform them that it will always be a no and whether a divorce would be an appropriate resolution.

i think in terms of future relationships, when you feel ready you could talk about this together as a way of setting boundaries. E.g. I was raped, so before embarking on a sexual relationship with my now husband I talked about it with him, and said that if/when I ever said no to sex, my expectation was that that would be accepted without question, and that if I couldn’t trust my now husband to respect that then I could never be sexual with him. It’s worked for us but I do feel he needed it spelling out right at the start.

Thanks for your posts, they've given me some things to think about. I can understand the frustration and rejection from my husbands pov, and at times felt very guilty about that, hence the giving in. I tried various things to solve the sex problem, one being reading an article about having sex every day for a month to increase the intimacy - which we did, and it worked for a while but that was before the last baby came along.

The giving in to sex was a really negative loop for me, it created this thing in my head that I didn't want to have sex, even when physically sometimes I did and I didn't realise the consequences at the time. As for my husband, he wasn't totally uncaring about the birth injuries, but he also wasn't caring enough either. We resumed sexual activity when the babies were 6-7 weeks old each time, it was painful for me and on reflection I shouldn't have put that pressure on myself. Hindsight is a wonderful thing. I had a big vaginal repair surgery in June last year and have been able to just let it heal without pressure of sex, and I think it has - which made me wonder why I put myself through painful sex that I didn't really want.

@SnowflakeSmasher86 thank you for your post. I do think I need to work on my boundaries and assertiveness. I need to spend some time considering that. I haven't done the deed with the new man yet, that's likely to happen in the next few weeks, which is probably why I'm thinking about this now. I feel excited and scared, and happy that it's not me that is broken in terms of the desire, but it was the situation.

Ffs. Yes it's reasonable to want sex with your partner. It's NOT reasonable to coerce, pester and threaten your partner into having sex with you. It's not reasonable to have sex with your partner while they turn their head away in tears. It's not reasonable to have sex with your partner when they are telling you they do not want sex with you and that you make them feel empty and used.

It's not only unreasonable. It's abusive. So all you pp wanging on about how sad it was for her husband that she didn't want sex with him, give your head a wobble.

Thank you @wafflesmgee, this is what I've been thinking about. How to communicate this to my new partner, without talking too much about previous sexual experiences. I feel that I can never tolerate what happened before ever again, so entering a new sexual relationship seems scary, I need to bring it up, but when. It seems so obvious and I feel upset even thinking about communicating that and why. I'll have a think about this because the new partner I've known for a long time and we have a very open and honest dialogue. It seems such a basic thing to say - I can't have sex I don't want, that I almost feel he will just think of course you can't, without truly knowing and understanding why. I'm actually quite a good communicator, but this just feels so vulnerable it's hard to talk about it bring up.

Thank you everyone for your posts, it's really helping me unpick this which I'm finding hard to confront. I have counselling so will discuss this with my counsellor too.

I wouldn’t bring it up too heavily the first time. But you could say something like ‘let’s be gentle and slow about this; I had negative experiences in my last relationship that I am still healing from’

I completely agree.

This the increasing conservatism on the board that has me so disheartened about the state of feminism and the rights of women in the world.

We are told not to listen to our bodies and our heads and to cater to frustrated men who don't give a damn about us and would rather see us in pain than perhaps help themselves to an orgasm for once, who don´t care if we cry because we feel physically used, as long as they get their rocks off. Nobody would ever expect a man to put up with such treatment, but we women have to accommodate this shit to our own detriment.

OP, I disagree with you that your husband was "not totally uncaring". He put you in pain, and what's worse, he made you believe that you put that pressure on yourself, when he was the one actively pestering you and reduced you to tears and made you feel like a "wank sock".

Not even in my worst relationships have I been treated like that. When I said I was in pain, they would always stop. If you care, you don't hurt someone when it can easily be prevented.

I find it utterly repellant OP that he had sex with you while you were clearly upset and didn't want it. How could any man do that ot possibly enjoy it? Whatever happens you need a break from him.

Parts of it resonate with my experiences with XH too.
Also your last part. I now have a lover I fancy the pants off (even after 30 months ) and I now know there was nothing wrong with my libido, I'd lost my desire for him over the years. He was a cheater and liar and I was forever in a kind of 'pick me dance' nightmare of sorts I now realise.

Me too.

I'm ten months out of a long marriage which was sexless at the end and for long periods before that too.

My situation was different in that exdh had ED and sex was all about him. We only did what worked for him. His pleasure and needs were centred. I was pushed and pulled into the positions that gave him the most pleasure. I too felt like a wank sock. There was no connection, no intimacy, no mutual pleasure, no fun. I wasn't allowed to talk during it. He just closed his eyes and did his thing.

I'm in a new relationship too and it couldn't be more different. It's been wonderful but at the same time allowed me to feel anger towards my ex. He made me feel broken. Undesirable. Needy. Unreasonable. And all along it was about his insecurities and his selfishness. I'm also angry with myself for putting up with it, but feel proud that I was strong enough to walk away.

And before anyone asks, I was nothing but supportive about his ED. I constantly minimized my own needs to benefit his.

I replay one incident over in my mind when I feel sad about what I've lost (it wasn't all bad). He'd finally gone to the gp about Viagra. Then finally got round to taking it. First attempt lasted hours. He just kept going. I was like a blow up doll. I got sore and told him, said I wanted to stop. He apologised and agreed but kept going. I let him, then asked again. He said "But it feels so good and I haven't felt this pleasure for so long. Just let me do it a bit longer." So I did, reluctantly. I had to get cross (nagging, needy) to make him stop. It made me feel uncomfortable emotionally at the time. I still loved him so I suppose it was cognitive dissonance on my part.

Now I can see how wrong it was. He used me.

My current partner checks in with me constantly. My pleasure is as important as his. We make love. It's wonderful. I absolutely adore it with him. I can let go in a way I never could with my ex. He makes me feel safe, sexy, adored. Every woman deserves this.

I should be able to let the anger go, but today I'm feeling it again.

Some men are so f*cking selfish. That's what it comes down to.

Thank you @ChersHandbag that sounds perfect. The new man is very emotionally intelligent and I know he'll understand that I'm trying to tell him something, but not quite ready to explain it yet. I don't know why I didn't think of that.

The abusive nature of this dynamic is really hard for me to even consider - and I actually volunteer directly with clients for a survivor of sexual abuse charity, so I'm not unused to these types of conversations, but it's hard to put into context in my own life, and perhaps I'm a bit desensitised too. I know what coercion is, I know that I didn't consent enthusiastically and I don't understand how my husband would want to have sex with me when he knew I didn't want to. When I've tried to have a conversation about it, he gets extremely angry - I suspect he knew it wasn't right and can't face his own behaviour, but to label it as abusive seems so dramatic.

I've started to think a lot more about my own sexuality, the messages we have been given as women and girls about sex - and much of it is horrendous - be a good girl, don't enjoy it too much but give it freely, but not too freely. Make the man feel like he's giving you pleasure, even if he's not, man need sex despite what you need etc etc. It's all so damaging to both sexes and it's so so selfish of the men and I feel as a woman I've been conditioned to accept and expect that.

@Springrainfalling that sounds awful, and I'm sorry you went through that, but so pleased you have a new partner that you are having a great experience with now. I hope I have that too.

to label it as abusive seems so dramatic.

Would you label it abusive if it happened to your daughter or best friend? Or a client where you volunteer?

Of course your ex gets angry and shuts the conversation down - he knows he abused and coerced you (many, including me, would call this rape) but he doesn't want you to know that. He wants you to feel sorry for him and not consider yourself - your emotions, your dignity.

Would you consider doing thr Freedom Programme OP? I know you say your current partner is lovely but you also describe your ex as a good person, which makes me think your radar is very damaged.

It sounds very much like sexual coercion which is an offence. It was very obvious from your behaviour that you were submitting to sex unwillingly and at other times he threatened you with 'consequences'.

It might help to discuss your experience with someone. The Survivor's Trust has a good helpline and can direct you to specialist counselling.

@wrongthinker thank you. I think I'm realising the impact of my family situation growing up with a very domineering father and subservient mother. I unconsciously learnt that was the way relationships are, it wasn't awful but I'm trying to unpick that now.

I obviously have an issue with boundaries, maybe my ex isn't a good person, I don't know, that's so hard to think - and annoying because I see it all the time on here - he's a great husband/Dad, and then they go on to say how terrible he is. It's hard to see in your own situation I think. I know about the freedom programme but would never have thought to do it myself but I'll have a look, thank you for suggesting it. Things with the new man will be very very slow for various reasons so that gives me lots of space, my priority is to work on and understand myself.

@MiloMinderbinder925 thank you for the suggestion of the survivors trust. To me it seems crazy to think of calling them with my situation but maybe I do need to talk about it with someone. I definitely feel like I could sit in a dark room and think today - but I have kids so unpaid uber driver for the most part it is.

Thank you everyone who has posted. This thread is really helpful to me.

No problem at all. What you've described is coerced sex. Pestering until you give in, telling him to get it over with and threatening you is sexual coercion. Rape Crisis is open 24/7 and you can discuss it with them.

He wasn't a nice man.

I'm glad you are leaving him.

Your posts are an eloquent testament to the long-term psychological harm that "duty sex" does to women.

@Piccalino3

This paragraph is so, so true.

I've started to think a lot more about my own sexuality, the messages we have been given as women and girls about sex - and much of it is horrendous - be a good girl, don't enjoy it too much but give it freely, but not too freely. Make the man feel like he's giving you pleasure, even if he's not, man need sex despite what you need etc etc. It's all so damaging to both sexes and it's so so selfish of the men and I feel as a woman I've been conditioned to accept and expect that.

There's a big difference between 'duty sex' and rape. Coerced sex is rape and duty sex is consensual.