Starting all over again at 38 and hoping to have a baby.. handhold

[anotherusernamehere]

I think I'm just looking for handhold really.. I posted before about my situation with my partner.. not sure if I've managed to link this properly but I'll try- Page 4 | Please help me decide if I should start again at 38... | Mumsnet

In a nutshell, been together almost 2 years, I really wanted children, he wants them but only in the right relationship and didnt feel ready etc. I have diminished ovarian reserve so might go through early menopause and will likely only get 1 or 2 eggs on any IVF cycle.

We went ahead with all the beginning stages of IVF tests and the like and we're ready to go ahead properly but he has told me 'not ready and knows he can't ask me for any more time to see if he can get there as he might never do. After a lot of painful conversations we've decided to break up.

I've left and gone back to my home (we lived together at his but kept mine). I need to see him at the weekend to get the rest of my stuff.

I'm so heartbroken. I know it gets easier as I've been through this before - basically the same bloody thing - a man who didn't want kids, although this one told me he did at least! But it's so hard to remember that right now. It doesn't feel possible. All I can think about is how I'm not going to have him in my life anymore and I'm giving up on our life. It wasn't perfect though..amongst other things he had ADHD and got stressed easily/argumentative, was messy, lost things etc. I was able and willing to deal with that to be with him.. but I'm trying to focus on the negatives..

I'm going to go ahead and try to create embryos with a sperm donor but obviously now that not be possible to go ahead immediately like it would have with him. I'm not ready to implant/try to get pregnant with one right now though - just try to create frozen embryos for now. I feel like I want to give myself at least another year to see if I meet someone else etc before making that final decision to officially go it alone.

I haven't told the IVF clinic yet about wanting to change to this as I guess I'm still holding out hope of him "changing his mind"? I had mentioned early on it might be this though so I guess they won't be totally shocked...

Grateful for any advice if you've been in this situation.. or just gone through a break up at this age and still hoping to meet your person, or been a single mother.. any advice and hand holds welcome. Literally none of my friends have even been in a break up in this sort of stage (living together, as adults, fully committed), let alone whilst still hoping/wanting to have kids so I feel so alone..

Thanks

Why do you need to date, you've just come out of a relationship and will be going through IVF. Surely dating can wait a year or 2?

I have no interest in having children. If I ever do in future (and have a stable environment for them) I would look to foster or adopt older kids.

I think you should go for it with donor sperm.

I try to live my life by the ‘big rocks and sand’ analogy, I had my son in far less than perfect circumstances (it could have been considered pretty reckless really) but having a child was by ‘biggest rock’ and everything else (the sand) just fell into place and moved around that.

Re: adoption. I spent a lot of time looking into it before going down the IVF route.

The children who are waiting for adoption at the moment are typically part of sibling groups, are older and have experienced more harmful things in their lives (making them less trusting of adults), or they are children with complex additional needs.

The charity Adoption UK said about two-thirds of adoptive parents encounter aggression or violence from their children And half with teenagers are in severe crisis.

Adoption breakdowns aren’t uncommon. I speak from experience here too (my aunt adopted 3 brothers two decades ago (two under 5) and it ruined her life - they had FAS (not disclosed by the council) stole from her, assaulted her, assaulted other people, attacked her biological daughter, and so don’t have a relationship at all now - and her husband is a renowned child psychiatrist and even they struggled to the point of disruption.

A lot of the time the councils brush over the issues and don’t provide the full picture of abuse/family history. Then don’t always provide support once the papers are signed. There are some excellent support threads and groups on Mumsnet about this topic.

Also: the goal is family unification, not removing children, so there can be a lot of false starts and heartache there. There can be an obligation to stay in contact with very difficult or even abusive birth parents and former fosterers too. Only about 1% of children are voluntarily relinquished by their mothers - most are removed because of substantial harm and neglect.

As an older single mother, that’s not the kind of experience the OP should casually walk into - and possibly wouldn’t be allowed to anyway. Even with the best intentions and support network. You can end up further traumatising the child, and need extensive professional support. It can be life-altering. Being a loving home often isn’t enough and many spend years fighting for assistance and school support or have to take care of a severely disabled person their whole life.

All of this can happen with a biological child too, but the statistics are there. All to say: probably best not to casually recommend adopting to strangers on the internet who probably are not equipped for this life and to successfully parent that level of need. If you are, that’s incredible and I wish you and any future adopted child(ren) all the best if you do decide to pursue that route.

Also, important: adoption teams often ask for a minimum six-month healing period between ending IVF treatment and applying to adopt because - rightly so - infertility generally should not the driver for adoption.

OP: anecdotally, I know two single mothers by choice over 40, and it’s extremely difficult for one of them - her mother and sister had to come stay with her and her child is extremely colicky and had some medical issues at birth, and so she’s really struggling. She had eggs frozen but got pregnant naturally aged 39 - though the guy then disappeared when he found out.

The other moved back to her home country for extra support, but is having a wonderful experience - she used a sperm donor and is very satisfied with that choice.

Very well said.

At nearly 62, I’ve no regrets being childfree but do enjoy my partner.

Broodiness is driven more by hormones than the brain.

@TheHerboristei wonder how true that is. Like maybe temporary broodiness that has crept up on you? But I wonder if it’s far more complex than just hormones. Me and all my sisters have loved young children and babies since we were pretty much babies ourselves. And my sister’s three daughters and the other sister’s daughter are the same. (No boys in the mix so I can’t comment!) And I definitely put it to question in my late 20s and tried to figure out if I truly did want children. But I’d say it can’t solely be some hormonal thing. It could be also partly genetic, and partly how we were “nurtured” ourselves. Certainly it’s a complex part of the human psychology. I’ll wholly admit that infertility and ttc and approaching the last of my eggs has changed my normal fairly balanced brain, that having a baby has been foregrounded and taken over everything. But I’d say that’s circumstantial rather than (or mixed in with) hormonal. I think to oversimplify the desire to nurture, love and care for a child, to compare it to wishing to be rich, is a little crass. I may end up living a child free life and loving it, I sure hope I do if that’s my lot! But OP is expressing how she feels, and she’s being told “you’re just hormonal”. Doesn’t feel right.

The live birth rate from IVF with eggs frozen at 35 is going to be small, sorry OP.

It doesn't change my opinion at all because the odds aren't even close to being in your favour. You need to be realistic, 35/36 is already reduced fertility and its eggs not even embroys. Have you asked about the odds with eggs that age, because they're really not good. If I was in your position and wanted a child that's what I'd be focused on for the next couple years then looking for a partner further down the track. If I left someone I loved so I could have a child that's where I'd focus my energy.

Without being rude, if you've no interest in having children, all of your advice on this doesnt really apply to me then does it? I probably should have asked this sooner! We're clearly very different people and you couldn't possibly imagine the way I'm feeling and why I would "throw away" a good partner to pursue this.

Like another poster said, I've been one of those women who has always wanted to be a mother. Loved little kids and babies when I was a child, everyone who knew me used to say so, and it never went away. I just never realised my path to meeting a life partner who also wanted those things would be so difficult. And I do regret choices I made, such as staying with a previous partner so long, that led me here. But hindsight is 20/20.

Welcome to mumsnet where you will geg bashed by strangers who want to feel superior about their diffenet life choices and outcome. The one woman I know who went it alone was a quite specific type who didn't have the patience for a man. Whatever you do you can't eliminate risk totally and it sounds like you're knowledgeable about the limitations of fertility treatments. I know plenty of men who haven't settled down until mid 40s with ladies in mid to late 30s. And in many cases babies came easily to them.

Ps the idea that having children is a hormonal urge akin to scoffing a bar of chocolate is ridiculous. It's a biological imperative for the majority of people. It's fine to not want that but to poo poo someone else who doesn't want it is mean.

I accidentally stumbled across this thread and must say I’m shocked by how harsh some of the comments are!
i left my previous partner months away from my 35th birthday, at that point I made peace with not having a child / children as I didn’t want to put pressure on finding someone just to have family. I met my now husband very soon after, we got married last year and I’m currently 27 weeks pregnant and will give birth a month after my 39th birthday. I know it’s not the case for everyone and we were lucky (got pregnant very quickly without actively “trying”)
Now to where I’m going with this…..I joined some Facebook groups for “older mums” and let me tell you how shocked I was to see so many women get pregnant in their 40s after meeting partners or second husbands later in life. I know this isn’t necessarily the norm but I think there’s enough on such pages to at least keep some hope alive that you might just get your fairy tale ending.
I know for me, making peace with the fact I may not have my own kids helped a lot with my relationship as we didn’t put any pressure on it. We spoke about it briefly before we married and both decided that there were other avenues available if we ended up unable to conceive for whatever reason
Apologies as feel like I’m rambling now, just didn’t want you to feel too crushed by a lot of the comments on here

thanks @Butningembers .. I've also found a lot of other threads about people meeting at 38 or so and having a family which have helped a bit to feel like it's not impossible...

I guess the difference there is that they presumably don't have fertility issues and I do.. but I also look at it that my 12 frozen eggs (if I come to use them) give me the equivalent of a year's worth of trying naturally there so got to help a bit? Even if only, say, 10 make it out the thaw then that's the equivalent of 10 months of trying at the perfect time? Ugh I don't know.. just need to keep a bit of hope alive 😪

Do you know what "confirmation bias" is? Your post here is the prime example of it. You seem intent on hoping your fairy tale will come true - so no matter that most people tell you to face reality you refuse.

Same was in January when you posted about your partner dilly-dallying. The advice was unanimous. But you chose to ignore it and stayed with him hoping for a miracle, which didn't materialise.

At least, if you do try to find your unicorn - give yourself a time limit. And if by 39 you are not TTC with your miraculous new partner - accept that you don't live in the fairy tale. And take matters into your own hands.

Your eggs do give you a little time - but you are massively overestimating the amount of time it gives you. Success rate with frozen eggs isn't all that great. And your "advanced" age will make it all harder anyway.

Personally - I don't know how you think that your age and diminished fertility won't affect your dating. If I were a man of similar age, who actually wanted children - I'd not be picking someone who'll need me to decide on something this massive/important in a really short time frame. Like the poster above said - she was about 35/36 - that gives you a few years to get to know each other. In your case - that luxury is not there.
IF your fertility was not an issue - that also would be different.

But I am wasting my breath as you won't hear any of this.

Good luck

Hi, I have diminished ovarian reserve and can only reproduce through ivf so I do know a bit about this topic (had a cycle of ivf and got three embryos, first was a miscarriage, second I’m pregnant with right now and third is in the freezer). I’m unlikely to be able to get any more embryos through more ivf unless I use donor eggs do this is me done.

You say you have 12 eggs and that’s a year’s worth of trying. It might be if they all survived the thaw and were all fertilised. However, there’s usually fairly large attrition rates. So with 12 eggs, maybe 11 will survive the thaw, six might fertilise and then you’d get 2-3 embryos. Then sadly, there’s only a 66% chance of them implanting (so 2 out of 3 would implant) and then there’s a 1/3 chance of miscarrying. So you’d be likely to just get one live birth from 12 eggs but it’s possible you may not even get that.

I think if you can afford to be a single Mum by choice then you should pursue this asap. IVF outcomes are massively influenced by age I’m afraid. So if you need another round of ivf (which would probably be advisable) then the sooner the better. As others have said, you would not struggle to find another man if you had a child in tow. It’s more important to get the child you want now and meet the man later.

This is really good advice and I think you should go to a fertility clinic and ask about options and success rates. If you can afford it you could go straight into making embryos with your current eggs and keep the frozen ones as back up BUT you'd probably want to find out first how successful this is likely to be.

Ultimately it depends how much being in a relationship matters to you more or less than being a mother plus how important it is to want to parent in a relationship. You might get both- lots of people have children later in life. You might meet someone but it's too late to conceive (in which case you could have a chance with your backup eggs or donor eggs if they don't work?). Or you might still be in the same position in a few years but obviously then your current fertility would be worse and if your back up eggs didn’t work you'd have to look at double donation. But knowledge is power so I'd start looking seriously into your options for solo motherhood if that's what you want.

I'd honestly ignore people talking about adoption or fostering as it is a completely different conversation.

This is good advice, however OP froze eggs at 35 and I don’t think the statistics are quite as low as what you’ve quoted there. 12 eggs leading to 2 embryos is different from the advice I was given when I froze my eggs at a similar age to when OP froze hers. I could be wrong as I don’t remember exactly what the doctor said (have it written down somewhere). I remember it being low odds but not quite as low as 12 eggs = 2 embryos.

Different circumstances but I found myself breaking up with my partner at 38 whilst pregnant for the first time. He then decided to not be involved and we haven't see him for years. I can truly and honestly say that I have absolutely loved being a single mum. Parenting isn't easy for anyone, but I've found the years I've spent raising my daughter on my own nothing short of magical. You have to be smart with money and you have to find an understanding employer and things like that but...in a different life if my choice had been go it alone or not have a child at all...now knowing what I know about how I'd cope...I would have absolutely gone for it alone and had a baby.

And I have now found the man of my dreams. We're both single parents (his boys are quite grown up now) and we're planning to move in together soon after dating for over 4 years. The fact we were both single parents made us go slow so we've really gotten to know each other. The fact that I had a bigger priority allowed me to be fussy.

I'm not going to tell you what to do but I think you need to ask yourself would you forever regret leaving it too late to at least try for a baby?

Thanks! It’s true it might not be as low as two embryos for 12 eggs but there are no guarantees for anyone is what I mean. Some people get zero embryos from 20 eggs because you won’t really know what will happen until you try. Some people (like me) get three embryos from six eggs. But it’s better to err on the side of caution in terms of egg or embryo numbers. Not least because getting the embryos isn’t even the end point. Someone could get five embryos and none of them would implant or if one did implant then maybe there’d be a miscarriage.

If you want one child; three embryos is a good number (is what I was told but every clinic is different). It’s certainly true for me so far. First embryo miscarried, second I’m ten weeks pregnant with and third is in the freezer (but there’s only about a 30-40% chance of it getting to a live birth because it has to successfully implant and then not miscarry).

I’m so so pleased it has worked for me but I’m very aware it could easily have not done. So I’d rather be a bit pessimistic in order to maximise chances. It’s such a precious thing to be pregnant and have a child so I really hope OP gets to experience it.

Also, to the other poster who quoted me and also said that adoption and fostering are completely different choices to pursuing fertility treatment; I couldn’t agree more. Adoption and fostering are really hard things to do and I admire people who do it. It’s such a tough road that you need to be a particular kind of person to cope with it. Being infertile doesn’t magically make a person suited to adoption or fostering. Or that’s my opinion anyway. I could love a child who wasn’t my blood relative but there are myriad other issues around adoption and fostering apart from that.

Do you mind me asking how old you were when you froze your eggs, and how old you were trying to use them? Three embryos from six eggs is a great result.

@Crushed23I don’t mind at all! I was 37 years and one month when I had ivf and I used my husband’s sperm with my fresh eggs. We got three embryos. We used ICSI (where sperm is injected into the egg which improves outcomes); frozen eggs are always injected with sperm using ICSI so that will help people using frozen eggs.

I had my first (fresh) embryo transfer at 37 and one month and had a frozen embryo transfer at 37 years and five months following a miscarriage of the first embryo. I’m due to have this baby when I’m 38 years and one month and I can try my third and final frozen embryo at 39.

I was nearly infertile even through ivf at 36 according to my consultant so 39 will be too late for me personally to have more ivf. So this current pregnancy and my final frozen embryo will be my only chances unless I use donor eggs. I wouldn’t have a problem using donor eggs but I feel I have no way of knowing if my child will mind being donor conceived so I’ve decided donor eggs aren’t an option because of that.

Hi OP hope things worked out x

I am going to be quite blunt, take your chance now and get your longed for child if possible. I had my youngest at your age and did it alone, no ivf though. I have not regretted it for a second.
The chance of meeting someone wanting to start a family relatively quickly is probably quite low. But having a child with someone you have only known for a short time is risky. We all know that ppl can present their best self for a while but it takes much longer to get to see the real them.
I know someone having a child with a partner of 12mths, thought he was "the one" turns out to be in serious debt and a compulsive liar. She is really concerned about coparenting with him if they part ways, which they would have by now if she wasn't pregnant.
Good luck whatever you decide 💕

At this point I'd be doing it alone rather than risk another bloke asking you to wait around.
I'd also seriously consider donor eggs