Page 38 | February 2025 Well we took you to Stately Homes

Dogaredabomb · 04/05/2025 14:57

wondering good luck and baby dust for your IVF, wishing you strength.

SamAndAnnie · 04/05/2025 15:45

That resonates Motherissues

I tried separating the past person from the current person. Not forgive and forget, more like I thought let's leave the past in the past, press the reset button and go forward from scratch with a more surface relationship and keeping things amicable. Because I thought they're "mostly kind" now and can't affect my life in the same way as during childhood. I made it clear by my actions that any abusive behaviour was now zero tolerance. You'd think they'd take what's on offer, if they want a relationship with me? No. They alternately got angry that I wouldn't tolerate the abuse, or played victim about why I'm behaving the way I am, as if it was undeserved, as if I'm doing them a major disservice by not sticking around to tolerate the abuse. It's made me see them in a whole new light. The kindness was just an act to get what they want, when they can't have what they want their true character comes out and it's not nice.

Meltedcandlewax · 04/05/2025 18:22

CheekySnake · 04/05/2025 13:45

@SamAndAnnie yep you're right about the phone rules. TBH I hardly ever answer it. Most of the time it's not even on. I know we have to have them now, but I hate the bloody thing. Prior to that call it had been literally weeks since we'd spoken, but before she moved back to the UK, we never spoke on the phone at all and I'd forgotten how exhausting I find it. I know in hindsight why she rang this week - she wanted to emotionally vomit on someone about the bleeping council elections and presumably couldn't find anyone else. I don't think she wanted to talk to me personally. I need to get better at dealing with the odd call and making it short. I could have just put the phone down and come back to it an hour later 😆

Could you set a ringtone for her? That’s what I do. I know she’s calling and can ignore it if I want to.

FriendlyReminder · 04/05/2025 23:15

wonderingwonderingwondering · 04/05/2025 11:46

I think the question to ask yourself is what is your goal in confronting her? Is it to give her the chance to be the mother you always wanted her to be, to show up and fix her behaviour and apologise? Is it remorse and understanding and a changed relationship? Or is it that you just want to honour your values and be honest so you can know that at least you didn't leave her hanging and made her aware of why things were going to change? Think about this. Hard.

I tried to talk to my mother. I did a load of therapy and realised, she's never really helped me or taken an interest in me. My mum is a good person and she can get distracted. And to be fair, ive been abroad and im pretty independent. l'll tell her and it'll make the relationship better. Simple! And instead I got talked down to, gaslit, lectured, dismissed, invalidated. On a loop. That happened for a few years, then I got engaged, then married, then infertility and she played the same non-existant role in my life and my eyes were very much open. I told her she never was a mother to me. I stopped answering the phone. I stopped visiting. We had an almighty phone call where she...half apologised about things that happened 20+ years ago, denied things that were happening today, blamed as much as she could on me, made it all about her and guilted me about getting old, only a few years left blah blah.

It was all honesty very re-traumatising. My life was hard and I kept just looking for a mother. And instead I got traumatised again. I walked around not knowing what was real, wondering if I was going mad, feeling so bad about myself. I'm still susceptible to feeling that way if I think about it too much. But I learned the hard way that the woman is not for changing, my feelings and wellbeing will never matter to her, my life and experiences are not as important to her as her own, and she needs me in an invisible role to be able to function as a mother. She's not about to acknowledge she did a thing wrong, and she will hold me accountable for saying a single thing that she doesn't like via scapegoating and discarding.

Anyway, this is longer than I intended. But I'd implore you to really think about what your impulse to have a conversation with your mother is all about, and what impact her emotional abuse is going to have on you. You're allowed to just go off the grid. You're allowed to not answer her calls, or set a boundary and ignore her violations. You don't owe her anything. Healing requires your needs to matter more.

Show quote history

Thank you for this post, seriously. I could read myself in it, and I can't even find the words 🙏

TorroFerney · 05/05/2025 07:20

MotherIssues2025 · 04/05/2025 09:09

One thing I’m struggling with, and what I’m unpicking with my counsellor next week is whether I confront my mum or not.

A lot of people who I speak to say there’s no point as she’ll never take accountability, but where does that leave me? Full of bitterness and letting her away with all the harm she has caused and still does?

How do I go no contact, or minimal contact without explaining my reasons to her? I can’t just go off radar because she will know something has changed so surely I have to tell her. It just doesn’t make sense to me to not say anything to her.

Maybe this won’t resonate but for me the need to explain is a trauma response so I don’t “get into trouble”. You need to find peace without her, you are making your peace/getting rid of the bitterness dependent partly on her and that way madness lies. She’s got the power, take it from her!

its the snake analogy, if a snake bites you you don’t ask it why, you get away from the snake. Your parent may as well be that snake, they won’t react reasonably to the conversation.

obviously very easy to say very hard to do.

TorroFerney · 05/05/2025 07:27

SamAndAnnie · 04/05/2025 13:40

I realised today, with all the talk of those who don't care about the NC, that neither of my parents or difficult family members has ever phoned me just to see how I am. Only ever if they want me to be somewhere or do something for them. Always on their terms, not like "let's meet up, when suits you?".

When I first moved out I phoned regularly, because as a child I remembered my own mother doing this weekly to her parents. So it became my default. When I changed jobs to a 9-5 and ended up in an abusive relationship, I no longer had time for these calls, so they stopped. When I left that relationship I changed and stopped tolerating that nasty behaviour from anyone, so again I didn't call because our relationship wasn't good from my perspective. I've just realised, in all the intervening decades since I first stopped the weekly phone calls, none of them has ever called me up just for a chat or to see how I am, not once. It's only ever been if they want something from me. I feel a bit daft for never having noticed that before!

I'm grieving the loss of narc2 who I'd always hoped to be friends with. I've put up with so much unacceptable shit over the years because I didn't want to lose them. I'm accepting now though that they don't like me. Which I think may be jealousy because I'm the scapegoat so I rejected expectations and rebelled to live my own life fairly early on (although so did they in their own way 🤷) and because I'm now no longer appeasing main narc at all I think that's pissiing narc2 off. I don't expect to see again other than at elderly relatives funerals perhaps. It's not the relationship I'd hoped to have, but I'm NC now and letting go of that dream.

Oh good grief your first paragraph resonated. Exactly the same here. A phone call or message from my mother is one of two things; an update on an appointment she’s had or “I need you to”. I’ve written this perhaps on this thread already or another one but I’ve been back from holiday three weeks now. I’ve seen her in person twice, spoken on the phone twice and messaged her. She has yet to ask me if I had a nice holiday, I don’t mean a conversation where I drone on about what we did I mean she has not mentioned the fact that I’ve been away.

Meltedcandlewax · 05/05/2025 07:29

FriendlyReminder · 04/05/2025 23:15

Thank you for this post, seriously. I could read myself in it, and I can't even find the words 🙏

Show quote history

This could be me also. I have tried and tried with my mother but nothing ever changes. Last time I saw her I let rip. I let it all pour out but wasn’t rude and tried not to be hurtful. She just sat there staring at me and said ‘just listen to yourself’ in a tone of total disgust. She then asked me to leave. She hasn’t apologised for what she did ( attacking my husband quite needlessly and accusing him of various things). She now just expects me to carry on going to see her and doing things for her as though nothing has happened. It’s an old story.

She had a fall last week and is sending me pitiful messages expecting me to call or go and see her. I just can’t bring myself to do so. She is 88 and I feel is goi g to die within the next two years. I don’t want her to die with us estranged but I have a visceral feeling of absolute revulsion when I’m near her now. I just can’t bring myself to bear her. For some reason the attack on my husband was the final straw as he’s never done anything against her. I’m used to her bashing me but attacks on my loved ones hurts more.

I just don’t know what to do. I know she will never change. My siblings don’t have an issue with her but she treats them differently. It feels very lonely.

FriendlyReminder · 05/05/2025 07:35

Meltedcandlewax · 05/05/2025 07:29

This could be me also. I have tried and tried with my mother but nothing ever changes. Last time I saw her I let rip. I let it all pour out but wasn’t rude and tried not to be hurtful. She just sat there staring at me and said ‘just listen to yourself’ in a tone of total disgust. She then asked me to leave. She hasn’t apologised for what she did ( attacking my husband quite needlessly and accusing him of various things). She now just expects me to carry on going to see her and doing things for her as though nothing has happened. It’s an old story.

She had a fall last week and is sending me pitiful messages expecting me to call or go and see her. I just can’t bring myself to do so. She is 88 and I feel is goi g to die within the next two years. I don’t want her to die with us estranged but I have a visceral feeling of absolute revulsion when I’m near her now. I just can’t bring myself to bear her. For some reason the attack on my husband was the final straw as he’s never done anything against her. I’m used to her bashing me but attacks on my loved ones hurts more.

I just don’t know what to do. I know she will never change. My siblings don’t have an issue with her but she treats them differently. It feels very lonely.

Show quote history

I'm very sorry 💐 I also have this visceral sensation, in my body, of not wanting to be near her. It's so sad... I've spend all my life trying to deny it or override it. I now have daughters and sometimes I become paralized with fear that they feel the same way about me and I'm unable to notice...

Dogaredabomb · 05/05/2025 09:00

Yes to the physical reaction!!! Have you always had it? I have.

This is possibly separate but she had an interest in other people's bodies to an insane amount. Everything was scrutinised and commented on, also in public and about other people.

I remember an excruciating bra shopping experience where she was throwing bra after bra over the curtain rail and the shop assistant said 'could you not throw all the stock on the floor' I said 'it's not me, it's my mum!' withering look, didn't believe me.

She whipped the curtain back as I was mid change and I knew she wanted to keep doing that, it was insane.

She was always like that, really out of control. It's like she was stuck as a 2 year old who points at willies and bums and shouts about it with glee.

Meltedcandlewax · 05/05/2025 09:37

My mother is obsessed with sex. She has a very peculiar thing about gay men and their sexual activities. I even found some sort of essay she’d
written about it for something or other. She hates the idea of sex happening in her house , and it’s totally verboten for people who aren’t married. She brings sex into everything. I find it deeply disturbing.

CheekySnake · 05/05/2025 10:03

@Meltedcandlewax I have the same physical reaction. I can't bear hugging my mother. I haven't told her I love her in years, I gag on the words. I know they can be said and not meant, I did that plenty of times as a child, but I find now that I can't even manage the lie.
FWIW I know from snippets that I've heard that my mother has a very different relationship with the siblings (1 bio, 1 step). She has very frequent contact with them, socialises with them, and throws money at them. Any suggestion I make that might involve spending a few quid is met with 'that's too expensive.' And I'm not talking about big things, I'm talking about going for flipping coffee and cake.

Meltedcandlewax · 05/05/2025 10:10

I think it's our bodies telling us that this person is not good for us. I never tell my mother I love her. I can't bear hugging her. it's really very sad.

CheekySnake · 05/05/2025 10:10

@Dogaredabomb I've got weird similar stories. My mother to some extent, my father a lot. He constantly made sniping comments about other people's bodies. And there were definitely weird attitudes around sex in our house. Lots of shame and disgust mixed in with things that were totally inappropriate. IDK. I don't know if I'll ever be able to unpick that bit.

Meltedcandlewax · 05/05/2025 10:11

CheekySnake · 05/05/2025 10:10

@Dogaredabomb I've got weird similar stories. My mother to some extent, my father a lot. He constantly made sniping comments about other people's bodies. And there were definitely weird attitudes around sex in our house. Lots of shame and disgust mixed in with things that were totally inappropriate. IDK. I don't know if I'll ever be able to unpick that bit.

Yes, both my parents would make comments about other peoples bodies too. My mother is obsessed with weight and my father would make inappropriate comments to me as a teenager. Derogatory comments.

CheekySnake · 05/05/2025 10:21

@Meltedcandlewax OMG the comments about my weight were almost constant. 'You're just big' 'you're so clumsy' 'you're like a baby elephant' 'you seriously need to lose some weight' 'you'll always be big, there's nothing you can do about it.' My mother said to me, at the age of 15 (5'8 and 8 stone with a 26' waist) that I was a size 14 so that's what I wore. Obviously none of my clothes fit me and I looked absolutely dreadful. In hindsight I can see it was deliberate, and if I let myself think about it, I know it's the behaviour of someone who doesn't like their teen daughter very much.

Dogaredabomb · 05/05/2025 10:45

Yes, just an absolute obsession with sex and the mechanics of how would xyz do xyz. You could fall into the trap of patiently explaining and she'd ask again very quickly. I felt that it was somehow her porn in a very odd way. She constantly complained about her sex life with my father to us. I snapped at her as an adult to speak to her peers, GP, a priest or counsellor about sex rather than cross generational boundaries. She said 'but who would i talk to about it?' I said 'ANYONE EXCEPT FOR YOUR CHILDREN!!!' 🤣

I actually feel like I was sexually abused by her obsessive pruriant interest.

Dogaredabomb · 05/05/2025 10:49

I've mentioned before that I was truly insanely promiscuous from 13-15 and it took me till my late 30s not to feel like dying from the shame of that. I was utterly at sea about men, sex, love, relationships. I felt that I was less than zero so if it gave someone happiness to use me I might as well be of some use. A friend of mine when I was 15 (who was also 15) said to me 'just stop it! It's ridiculous! I know you don't even like so and so!' so I did. Isn't that weird?

CheekySnake · 05/05/2025 10:51

I had another really bad night still ruminating about the phone call from my mother and some of the things that were said in the conversation, and got up this morning and realised that another brick got knocked out of the wall of what remains of our relationship, that I'd still on some level had a bit of hope. It's smaller now. A bit more of it died over the weekend. What I know now, without a shadow of a doubt, is that when my mental health was absolutely in the toilet as a teen girl, she didn't notice. Even now, she still hadn't looked back, thought about it, and realised. My own kids can barely fart without me noticing. I also realised that she doesn't like other women very much, and will always prioritise men. I think that's partly why she treats the siblings very differently to me. The only time she hasn't done that is with my son, but he's of no use to her.

CheekySnake · 05/05/2025 10:56

@Dogaredabomb it's not shameful. It's not. You were a child figuring out how to cope. The things we look back at, that we feel embarrassed by, are things we did because the adults in our life let us down.

(FWIW, I was completely at sea with all that too, but went the other way, and didn't have a boyfriend until I was in my 20's because I thought I was disgusting and no-one would want me).

Dogaredabomb · 05/05/2025 10:57

I'm sorry cheekysnake it's not fair that she gets to use you as an emotional bucket when it suits her. She should just phone the speaking clock.

CheekySnake · 05/05/2025 11:01

Dogaredabomb · 05/05/2025 10:45

Yes, just an absolute obsession with sex and the mechanics of how would xyz do xyz. You could fall into the trap of patiently explaining and she'd ask again very quickly. I felt that it was somehow her porn in a very odd way. She constantly complained about her sex life with my father to us. I snapped at her as an adult to speak to her peers, GP, a priest or counsellor about sex rather than cross generational boundaries. She said 'but who would i talk to about it?' I said 'ANYONE EXCEPT FOR YOUR CHILDREN!!!' 🤣

I actually feel like I was sexually abused by her obsessive pruriant interest.

Her behaviour was weird and inappropriate and your feelings are totally valid here.

Twatalert · 05/05/2025 11:14

@CheekySnake it sounds to me as though you are in the process of completely detaching from your mother. Emotionally I mean. I believe it's initially painful and heavy but better for the long-term. It's difficult but also very brave.

FriendlyReminder · 05/05/2025 11:15

Yes, @Dogaredabomb, my mother was extremely cruel with people's bodies. In hindsight, I know I grew up absolutely terrified of how others would see me. Still today, when I'm with other people (even my loved ones), I imagine their gaze upon my body and myself and hear in my head what I think they are thinking. Obviously it's not them, thinking it, it's my mother. She tainted my perception of beauty, but I'm happy to say she didn't destroy it: I'm the opposite of shallow/fashionable (even to a fault maybe 😅).
But, damn, I can't get her voice out of my head...

Dogaredabomb · 05/05/2025 11:16

The death of all hope is very painful ♥️

Twatalert · 05/05/2025 11:17

@Dogaredabomb the sexual stuff your mother used you for is also a form of enmeshment. But I would agree it's a form of sexual abuse. Surely it always made you uncomfortable but your mother didn't pick up on it and stopped but continued. It's vile.