AIBU to think that most relationships will end with an OVERLAP with a new relationship.

[morningpaper]

I don't get this thing on MN whereby married people are expected to end marriages before embarking on other relationships.

This idea of people (except you always mean 'woman' ) being "slappers" if they enter relationships with married people makes me think lots of you have very little understanding of how relationships work.

• To be blunt, I would be FAR more upset if DH left me for a lonely life as a single person in a bedsit than for a new relationship. I think the former is FAR more insulting. I have a close friend whose husband did this and it was MORTIFYING every time people said "Oh darlng, was there someone else?" and she had to say "No" (unspoken message: 'I am just too horrific to live with').

• People need support when they end relationships - and that support often comes from a new relationship.

• If people ended every marriage at the first sniff of new romance, or at the first feelings of dissatisfaction, then none of our relationships would last more than a year or two! It is often a new relationship that gives people the impetus to re-evaluate their lives.

• Most relationships become very "stale" after a certain amount of time - society tells us we must WORK at our relationships after the desire has gone, but WHY? Why not just accept that our partners or ourselves might be MORE happy in a new relationships - we have changed and grown, after all.

I have several friends in relationships with married people - and I expect a lot of you do, too, but they probably don't tell you because you are so HORRIFIED at the idea. Such relationships generally end in a lot of DESPAIR but they are part of life.

When you talk about "ending relationships before starting new ones" it sounds to me just like people who talk about not having sex before marriage - a great ideal (perhaps), but not realistic for 99% of people.

i seeeee

so the notion of being with your DH for life was not the driving force?

maybe i am far more traditional than i realised

i am not sure what i would do , as i have never been in the position, nor allowed myself to be in the position of falling in love with another man.

i went into marriage, as is DH, with the premise of being together , having children, being a family and growing old together.

i did not go into thinking, there are plenty of other men i could fall in love with

and he was not my first boyfriend, and i am not naive or a disney princess but i think that there is little point in getting married just becasue or if you feel strongly that someone better or different is round the corner

'Affairs are fun, and easy, and hugely enjoyable '

what a bizarre idea of entertainment.

affairs are immature, stupid and hurtful.

I disagree totally with MP aswell.
I find her view really very very saddening.

I think I undertsand what MP is getting at, and think she has a good point.

Has anyone read 'The road less travelled'?
This book talks about 'the myth of romantic love' an how damaging this has been to happiness and maintenance of long term relationships. 'Romantic Love' is something which is a strong sudden force with a strong attraction and 'fusing' of two people. It can feel uncontrollable but is hardly ever long lasting (about 2years reesrach suggets).

But this is what we have come to belive, through literature and Disney, is 'True Love', but REAL deep love usually follows from this and is the act of commiting and giving in a selfless way to another person.

The idea of romantic love being the only true love, leads to disatisfaction when it waers off, and the abandonment of one reltionship for the the next one, that can provided this romatic rush again.

Hence high divorce statistics and relationships OFTEN overlapping.

I agree with MP that I am suprised that so many of you are suprised that this occurs. I've seen many 'good' 'caring' an usually rationale people fall into this 'overlap scenario' because of the force of falling in love.

MP's view is actually a much more positive one of marriage: it being something that you choose to commit to and live your life acting out your love for that person you have chosen to be with DESPITE acknoweding that the 'romantic love' may occur again, but beacuse of your 'real love' and your commitment, you choose not to act upon it. That is real love, a selfless act.

Love is an act and not a feeling.

Or have I totally misunderstood you MP?

If you have a decent relationship and you have children you should do all in your power to stay together. There's nothing 'complicated' about that.

cheating is no basis for starting or continuing a genuine fulfilling relationship even if man did leave wife for OW the OW will eventually become her indoors... and then it will be her turn to wait and wonder if he is cheating and the wandering eye/hand have turned to another other woman

if an attached man or woman meet and are attracted the decent thing is to end current relationship, before committing adultery/cheating

i am faithful, loyal, attentive to my friends and boyfriend and unsurprisingly expect the same back

for fear of sounding like a bunny boiler, the thought of my dp intimate with another woman makes me jibbering-incandescent-jealous-scary-frothing-foaming-daftie

i have been going out with boyfriend sinece i was 18 (no other serious boyfriend), we have a LO that means something.he is my soulmate

so no i would not shrug sagely if he fancied someone else blithely accepting that is better than him being lonely

soul mate has to mean something

i believe a soul mate is forever

that does not necessarily mean marriage but sure as shit means fidelity

I don't believe in romantic love, FWIW.

I think it's a machination to sell things, tbh.

But I do believe in commitment, duty and respect.

In fact, I find these things even more important than romantic love because, to me at least, they are love.

So where I see being unfaithful is not so much about romantic love, but about going back on your word, as not honouring your promise, not showing respect or courtesy or decency to someone and people you made a huge commitment to.

i agree that the notion of that dizzying true love that wears off is true

i have been with DH 11 years, and i love him in a differnt way now to when we first met

i think that if you go into marriage and are not prepared for the mundanity of living together, laundry , work, shopping , then the changes that children bring, you are in for a nasty shock . and far easier to get that wonderful euphoric high falling in love again

i have far more respect for people who work through difficult spells, and accept that marriage is constantly evolving and changing, and the person you are is always changing.

being able to weather the storms and peaks and troughs together without using it is a reason to shag around is far more worthy of our respect than is deemed fashionable

Exactly expat, what I was trying to say but more succiently put.

BUT the myth of romatic love (that I see subcribed to alot on this thread) is actully what leads to much of this serial monogomy and relationship overlapping, as the romatic rush is believed to be the 'real' thing and 'proves' the existing relatiopnship MUST be flawed.

Not suprised in the present culture that all this relationship overlapping occurs.

my friend introduces her DH as "my current husband"

I apologise for my comment about romance MP.

I am not avoiding the argument though, I am quite happy to discuss this!

But I still don't think affairs are romantic. They're not, imo, not at all. They're hurtful an d unkind and selfish.

I think the notion that we all could get so 'carried away' that we are unable to remember why it would be hurtful to sleep with someone else is fanciful and sounds to me like an excuse, not the behaviour of decent grown ups.

(and I know this isn't all about you but does your dh also accept that he might fall in love with someone else and leave you and are you fine with that?)

I don't necessarily subscribe to either the notions of romantic love or monogamy. But I still think if you fall in love with someone else, while you are married/with your partner then you either a) leave your partner or b) ignore it, you don't say "ah, well, relationships overlap, that's the way it is these days and I fancy a shag so never mind" do you? well, some of you clearly do but I really find it a dishonourable way to behave.

Just as I don't subscribe to the 'men can't help themselves, their sex drives are so strong poor loves' school of thought, I don;t accept that men or women are so overcome they can't help themselves and 'fall' into affairs while otherwise committed.

marriages do end they dont always end in sex with someone else

I think you are putting far too much importance on sex

sex even makes me feel secure, loved , wanted especially when i am depressed though if I sought it off someone else I am quite sure it would make things worse not better

mp, i am not havinga go at you btw. I am quite happy to agree we disagree and I wasnt picking on you about the 'threads' but maybe its the amount of posts on this matter. My brained is rather blurred as far as MN is concerned tbh and I cant provide links and statistics ever

oh and I believe in romantic love too, thank god for it

What exactly is so complicated about showing someone you committed to, and kids you committed to, a little decency and courtesy?

I really don't get why that's complicated at all.

I think there are many drama queens in the world, however, male and female.

I used to go down that path myself. I thought it was exciting and fun.

It got old once I started to grow up, though.

v true expat and from experience its fucking depressing as a child to be on the end/aftermath/call what you want, from it all. We can all gloss it over and pretend everyone shopuld just be more secure, but at the end of the day people have feelings

I even think mp you might one day be suprised yourself at what it might feel like

am just going to post:

i totally agree with expat and WWW every few minutes

did tesco deliver lulu?

yes ! today, with lots of apologies

you two sound like spies lol

oh we are
thank god lulu

yes, and the black crow flies east over moscow, or something !

dont know if the name-calling comment was aimed at me,but i really do think that people who have affairs are pathetic cowards,who havent got the guts to end a relationship they dont want to be in anymore.i see affairs as the ultimate in emotional abuse,and i have the same opinion of cheaters as i do of wife(or husband)-beaters,ie.pathetic cowards.

somebody who has healthy self-esteem and is secure in themselves would not have an affair.if they accept they will never be monogomous(like madamez)then they dont get into relationships.if they are in a relationship which isnt working or the person isnt right for them,they would be honest and assertive,and end it.

i think only an insecure person would have an affair.

I mostly find that I agree with Expat on all issues relating to adultery.

But picking up on Morningpapers last comment about whether your marriage is over if you fall in love with someone else, I think not.

Falling in love is something people do ever so often, to a certain extent. We have spent our entire teenage years falling in love repeatedly. Some girls fell in love with a new bloke every month. We are pretty used to this falling in love business. It is a fleeting, head-rushy sort of lusty feeling, that often is based on nothing else than looking at a mans pert buttox and stealing a glance at the front bulge, before meeting his eyes in a long sullen sultry gaze. (If a little older than a teenager, and if you find yourself in a club, you are more likely than not to go home with him for a closer scrutiny of said buttox and bulge)

Does this superficial headrushy feeling necessarily stop when you get married? I think it changes name to "innocent crush". But most of us know that it is sufficient to just look at the picture of Leonardo DiCaprio from Titanic (or Johnny Depp, Orlando Bloom, the gym instructor, the guy who drinks coffee in starbucks every morning at 8.50) and just swoon ever so slightly. Put it out of our heads and forget it. So no, falling in love does not mean your marriage is over. It just means you have to alter your priorities a little, and look in on what you have and give your partner a little tlc to rekindle what is there. In my opinion.

on a tangential topic i was shocked at how many men are on dating websites and married

now that is cynical especially when they arent upfront about it and so invite people on dates who do not want to see married men

i guess women do this too