Why would I imagine something hurtful was said to me?

[loosingmy]

Some months ago a family member said something very hurtful to me. One short and very specific sentence. Now I tried to talk about it with them. They denied to have said it and got very angry at me for making that up. We both were not drunk or agitated in a way that we wouldn't know what we just said or what we just heard. It's also not about that I got something wrong or misheard. I'm convinced they said exactly that sentence and they are denying that. They are truly mad at me for wrongly accusing them because they are convinced they didn't say it.
How likely is it that I made this sentence up in my mind? Why would I do that?

Could you have misheard them? Did you discuss it at the time?

Do you have any reason to think this person is manipulative? Has this person ever used your feelings against you to get away with being unkind?

What is it you thought they said, and what was the context of the situation?

If it was a while ago is it actually possible they have completely forgotten and so don't think they'd say that?

I don't know. Just suggesting

Did they ask for clarifying information or did they go straight to rage?

Are they gaslighting you?

Trust your gut. If you are 'calling them out' so to speak on bad behaviour, they quite likely have resorted to their usual defence mechanisms, rather than take accountability. Bottom line, if you recall whatever u did, and you want to discuss it and express your hurt...if its met with denial/blame/deflection/gaslighting...MASSIVE red flag imo

When you tried to talk to them did it immediately become about how terrible a person you are?

If your sadness at something they said evokes anger and not concern then they either hate you or feel nothing for you. Probably a combination of both. They’ll definitely hate you at the moment. This is ALL GOOD.

Thank you all so much!

I try some answers:

• I thought of any way I could have misheard but it's too specific. I'm really as sure as you can be that this is not a possible explanation.
• I'm convinced they wouldn't have forgotten it.
• They didn't ask for clarifying. Immediately blew up. I must add the relationship is strained for a long time now. The situation now was that they were calling me out for avoiding contact. I explained that I was still hurt about what they said to me.
• Gaslighting sounds very much how I feel about it and how it was for me previous to that incident. But it would definitely be unconscious gaslighting. I'm asking here because I would like to hear if it could be something else.
• I didn't get to say anything after that sentence was said because they were going on and on after that and I'm the type of person that doesn't immediately push back.

If they were going on and on, isn't it likely that they may have forgotten exactly what was said at the time?

I had the exact same with my sister years ago. We were having a family party so loads of people around and I tripped and fell onto a kids toy, breaking it. She immediately burst out laughing and screamed really loudly “oh my god you’re so fat!”

It was so embarrassing as it was in front of our entire family including partners etc. It was a long time ago and we’re not with the same partners any more but when I brought it up years later, she furiously denied saying it. Sorry but something like that sticks in your head. I still remember the exact tone and volume she screamed it at 20 years later. I put it down to her feeling embarrassed at herself for stooping so low. She’ll never admit she said it so I just won’t ever bring it up again.

I think you either need to accept that she’ll never admit she said what she did and try to move past it or just cool your friendship with her.

I don't want to write here what they said because it's really very hurtful. I can only hope you can believe me that it was something you wouldn't forget to have said, especially that specific wording.

The exact same thing happened once to me. They denied saying it, it was a very strange conversation. I had to let it go in the end.
It sounds like they are gas lighting you or regret saying it so are rewriting history rather than apologising. If it was very hurtful and said clearly, then they very likely remember it but want to forget it.

"I'm convinced they said exactly that sentence and they are denying that"

Which is more likely:

A ... they said it.

B... you have lost your marbles and invented the whole thing in your head, or possibly got a bizarre dream and reality mixed up.

Answer A seems far more likely to me, in which case they have either:

1... forgotten they said it.

2... they said it deliberately, remember perfectly well, and are now lying through their teeth and gaslighting you into making you doubt yourself.

Unless they are habitually forgetful or have some signs of dementia, then it's going to be no 2.

I wouldn't waste anymore head space thinking you have misheard. You know what they said.

Thank you for sharing that. I know I have to accept that they'll never admit it. I was expecting they would try to twist it and blame me for consciously misrepresent it or anything like that. I was surprised they denied it completely and how truly mad they were about me making that up. Like with gaslighting I immediately started to doubt my own memory. But I still have this vivid memory and ask myself if you could have such a vivid “memory” by imagining it and why would that be.

Gaslighting is really just lying and lying is very common. Loads of people lie to get themselves off the hook, loads of people react to having their bad behaviour called out by trying to play victim and turn the tables. When people talk about everyone having narcissistic traits this is what they mean. They are very common bad behaviours.

I would say neither 1 or 2. I'm convinced they are convinced of their reality. Like I previously said I'm asking here to explore if and how their reality might be true. Perhaps someone made the experience of being accused of saying something they are convinced they never said?

Their reality might be 'true' in their head, in which case they could possibly a narcissist. Narcs can never accept or admit any kind of wrongdoing, and will always blame the other person for misunderstanding, making it all up, being crazy, whatever.

I think it is incredibly unlikely that you imagined them saying it.

It is what it is. Don’t be deceived by the deceit. They think you’re too weak to stop it. They hope you are because they really like it when they get to be abusive and then get an extra bonus abuse session when they deny it later on.

Given this is an anonymous platform, it might be helpful to know what was said so we can work out how they might be deluding themselves about it/where the gap in understanding\expertise lies between you

If someone I love and trust says I have said something that has hurt them I am concerned for our relationship. My desire to understand doesn’t ever ever involve aggression.

I don't want to be difficult by not repeating that sentence here. Like I said it's still very hurtful for me but that's not the only reason I hold it back. The sentence alone would need context and I don't know how to give that in a useful way. The "whole story" is way too long and I don't think I'm able to give a sensible short summary.
I hoped that someone could tell me about being on the “other side”. Like #speakball questioned if they asked for clarifying information or going straight to rage. I was in a slightly similar situation myself but instead of raging I was bewildered and was very interested to get together the context to understand how they might have gotten to their perception.

Human memory is genuinely shit.

People remember specific things and forget others.

They also lie.

However people are very good at remembering times they got upset or hurt. So on balance it's very likely they said it.

They either genuinely don't remember (possibly because they say hurtful things all the time and so this is just one of many and so not important) or they are lying,